| Author | Message | ||
| Susan_2 Registered user Username: Susan_2 Post Number: 2269 Registered: 11-2002 |
Growing up SDA I was taught that the Catholic church, especially the pope and by extension all Catholics on down to include all "Sunday-keepers" are THE BEAST. As a child I was discouraged to make close friends with kids who were not at least Sabbath-keepers. I asked an elderly SDA loved one recently how come she didn't get involved with some of the communities senior clubs so she could have a more expanded social life and I got the answer was because she didn't want to get too attached to people she knew wouldn't get eternal life anyway. It is a very sad attitude and I think it isolates a lot of SDA's from their communities and neighbors, especially the elderly. Anyway, I read an ad on a bulletin board for a car for sale. I called the number. This is three weeks ago already. The lady heard my sad story about being homeless. She wanted five times more money for the car than I had at the time. She OFFERED to take what money I could give her at the time and let me have complete use of the car until I could get her paid off. She's never met me before and didn't know me from any John, Dick or Harry walking the streets. She let me sleep at her house, had me and my son over for dinner and did our laundry and fed us. She let us watch her t.v. and her movies. Finily I asked her if she's a Christian. Actually I asked her if she is an angel but she quickly let me know she's not an angel so I asked if she's a Christian and her reply was, "Yes, I am. I am Catholic." So much for the beast being out to get me, I thought. I have been so wonderfully blessed by the Lord leading me to that lady. Please, keep her too in your prayers as she and her children moved to Colorado yesterday. I finily got the car paid in full to her only 12 hours before her plane left to Colorado. What were some of the horror stories you all learned about THE BEAST, the pope, the Catholic church, the Catholic people, Sunday-keepers in general, etc. Let's share. | ||
| Peperpat Registered user Username: Peperpat Post Number: 24 Registered: 7-2006 |
What a blessing your story was today Susan, it is truly awesome how God puts people in our lives at just the right time! As to Catholicism, (I am not SDA, but have a son who is) I was baptized a Catholic and attended 12 years of Catholic schooling. You can imagine the indoctrination I received, esp. since I am 53 now. Anyway, I left that religion and became a Christian 26 yrs ago. My point is when I attended an SDA service with my son, a film was playing talking about 'grace' -we sat in front of someone who said lowly but loud enough for us to hear, derogatory remarks about catholics. He had a disgust in his voice and all I could think of was what if I Was still a member of that church - I certainly would have been put off by his remarks. Not a way to evangelize....Anyway its interesting to me to know what SDA thinks about Catholics. God bless you and that lovely lady! | ||
| Violet Registered user Username: Violet Post Number: 472 Registered: 2-2001 |
It is not just the SDAs I sat in on a parent/school board meeting at my daughter's school. This school is ran non-denominational so people from many churches are parents. One of the parents spoke up asking about the new teacher and commenting that he wanted to know where she stood on her Christian walk as he would not want a Catholic teaching his children. One of the parents in attendance is Catholic and is a wonderful parent and her child is an Olympic hopeful. They are good people any school would be lucky to have! Unfortunatley they were deeply hurt by the comment. | ||
| Peperpat Registered user Username: Peperpat Post Number: 25 Registered: 7-2006 |
That is sad, as Christians we need to be careful of lumping people into groups. That is how some churches get divided. - Patti | ||
| Seekr777 Registered user Username: Seekr777 Post Number: 567 Registered: 1-2003  |
Patti you said, "That is sad, as Christians we need to be careful of lumping people into groups." Does this include lumping all SDAs into one group? Just wondering??  Richard rtruitt@mac.com | ||
| Susan_2 Registered user Username: Susan_2 Post Number: 2270 Registered: 11-2002 |
Dear Peperpat, I was taught as a kid growing up SDA that although there are many good, decent and wonderful people it is the instutation of the Catholic church that is the beast of Revelation. They somehow get it by adding the numerical values of the letters on the popes headpeace to come up with the number 666. However, I think the words on the headpiece are in Greek (I might be wrong but I don't think it is Roman numerals.) and they assign the roman numeral value to the letters that are in a different language. They assign the letters 'u' and 'w' the same value to get it to come out like they want it to. I asked a SDA once how come then she is a SDA because the name Ellen Gould White when the letters are assigned Roman numeral values come out to 666. The answer I got was that the book of Revolation very clearly says the beast is a man and since EGW was a lady she is disqualified brom being considered the dreaded beast. I quickly pointed out that I took the term man to mean mankind and there are numerous times in the Bible where the word man is used but it does not specifically mean a male person but rather mankind or humankind. I have told numerous SDA's the only people on this earth who know that in the last days SDA's will be persucated by the Catholics and by extension all "Sunday-keeping" Christians are the SDA's themselves. They generally are just reinforced in their belief when I say that because I will then be told how sneeky and decietful satan is. And, Richard, yeah, I think it is o.k. to lump different groupsa together in a general way. When someone refers to himself as a Baptist I assume he believes on baptism by full dunking and usually shuns alchoal, etc. If someone defines himself as a SDA I assume the person 'keeps Sabbath', shuns pork and other things. Some thing just by defination the assumptions are included. | ||
| Peperpat Registered user Username: Peperpat Post Number: 26 Registered: 7-2006 |
Yes,by that I meant I believe there are some true Christians in the SDA, as well as in the Catholic church and other denominations. I cannot know the heart of another person, but I believe God has His children everywhere. I think the proof of that is all you wonderful people that God has called out of the SDA Patti | ||
| Wolfgang Registered user Username: Wolfgang Post Number: 90 Registered: 10-2005 |
as a SDA I never was taught or taught my kids that the pope or any catholics or sunday keepers were the beast,however I was taught that it was the roman institution that was the beast,dawn | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 2722 Registered: 3-2004  |
Growing up in SDA schools and churches, I was taught that the Catholic church as an institution was the beast and that Catholics and apostate protestants would join together to persecute and kill adventists. Thank God I do not have to think about that any more. God is holding me in his hands and no matter what happens, I am his. He is awesome. Diana | ||
| Pw Registered user Username: Pw Post Number: 487 Registered: 6-2004 |
Yes, I never could quite understand how the SDA could manipulate the numbers in order to make the pope/Catholic churches fit the number of the beast. Sad thing was, I just accepted it to be the truth. Thankfully my blinded eyes were open to that false teaching, among many other doctrines the SDA's claim as divine revelations by EGW. | ||
| Grace_alone Registered user Username: Grace_alone Post Number: 131 Registered: 6-2006  |
Okay, as a "never-been" this issue drives me nuts. For as long as I've known my husband (20+ years) his mother has asked me, at least every 6 months or so, "Do you pray to the Virgin Mary?" or "Do you believe in the Virgin Mary?" and just this past Sunday she asked me if my Lutheran church was like the Catholic church - even though she's been to my church at least twice, each time we baptised the kids. With the "Mary" questions, I have always said no. (Duh) but I know exactly what she means when she asks that or the Catholic question, and for the life of me, I don't know what to say! For one, she is from South America and although she speaks English fluently she has trouble understanding sometimes. I believe she's insulting me, however in her mind she's frightened of the Catholic church and is very serious about it. Does anyone have any good ideas on what I could say to hopefully make her understand that I'm not the beast??!! Leigh Anne | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 1453 Registered: 10-2004  |
Leigh Anne, You could tell her that Luther was more anti-Catholic than the Adventists are (including in doctrinal matters--such as salvation, sola scriptura, etc.--hehe! The truth is that the SDAs are much more "Catholic" in doctrine than the Lutherans are!). Perhaps you could also tell her to read EGW's glowing assessment of Luther in The Great Controversy. ;-) Jeremy | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 4466 Registered: 12-2003  |
Jeremy, that is a great suggestion! I'm sure your MIL's questions come from the fact that she believes "sunday-keeping" is Catholic and also the mark of the beast. I also know that South American Adventists have a different "flavor" than do North American ones. They tend to be a bit more "historic" and entrenched. Jeremy's is probably the best suggestionóyou can always do what you've been doingódenying your Mary worshipóbut clearly that isn't relieving her fears. Colleen | ||
| Snowboardingmom Registered user Username: Snowboardingmom Post Number: 153 Registered: 11-2005 |
Leigh Anne, While I was going to Loma Linda for school, I would play the piano at one of the local Lutheran churches on Sundays (it was my "part time" job during school). They liked hiring Adventists because their services never interfered with ours. I shamefully have to admit that, I too, like your mother-in-law, thought that Lutherans were very similar to Catholics. Actually, for that matter, almost all Sunday churches (except for the non-denominational ones which I saw as charismatic giving it a whole other set of issues) in my mind were like Catholic churches. The services were very different from the SDA services I was used to, and anything "different" combined with "Sunday" equaled Catholic-like. This was a very traditional Lutheran church, so they had liturgies, altar boys, and communion every Sunday. Even though the message always seemed to be pretty good and "legitimate", I was very cautious about getting too involved in the church social events for fear of being sucked in. It was a really irrational fear now that I think about it. Anyway, the point is, there is probably little you can do that will convince her to feel differently about your church. That fear and irrationality is deep and it takes more than good arguments and facts to convince. It really does take the Holy Spirit. I will say though, that I was always impressed about the love and message of grace the members always talked about. As scary as it was, it was also very intriguing to me. Even though I didn't quite understand it at the time, I'm sure it made an impression on me, and played a part of where I am now. If even just a little... So as frustrating as it may seem -- hang in there. She may surprise you one day, and just one time, she'll be able to see past the "beast" paranoia, and see the Holy Spirit in you. One of my friends recently asked if I had confessed to the priests in my church yet. Sigh... So I understand your frustration. Praying for you and your family. Grace | ||
| Grace_alone Registered user Username: Grace_alone Post Number: 132 Registered: 6-2006 |
Jeremy, Colleen and Grace, Thank you. That helps! I do like what Jeremy said - and it makes me feel better too, hehe. The funny thing is, my mil was born and raised a Catholic, but became an SDA when she was in her late teens. You'd think that she would be sensitive to the Catholic chuch. But you're right, Colleen, my husband even tells me that "Sunday Keeper" (I hate that term) = Catholic = the beast. I continue to share my faith with her, and tell her about my prayers for our famiy. I also sing hymns on occasions at her request, so she knows that my faith is a real every day relationship. Thanks for the "hang in there" Grace. I will! |
