Post Number: 422
|Posted on Monday, July 09, 2012 - 12:30 pm: || |
As far back as high school home ec class I was taught that vinegar was bad for you because EGW said so. It never made sense to me. I had never heard of anyone being addicted to vinegar?! She had a vinegar habit she struggled to break & overcome?
Later in life I began to read about the benefits of vinegar for health purposes, especially if it was natural live apple cider vinegar. I avoided it, but I sure questioned it all mentally.
I have a set of Woman's Day Encyclopedia of Cookery that was published in the 1960s. Today I was looking up vinegar just to see what they had to say about it:
"The name, derived from the French words vin aigre, 'sour wine', is an apt description of the way vinegar is made. Despite the winy origin, NO ALCOHOL REMAINS; the action of Acetobacter sees to that."
I know it has been stated here before that the whole thing was most likely a cover-up for EGW having a 'wine problem' (addiction?). This just confirmed it all for me. Not that I needed it confirmed these days. But for someone else out there still wondering . . . we were deceived & lied to.
Before I left sdaism I would have passed this off as THEIR delusion & lies. I would have believed we now knew better because EGW had further light & divine revelation.
This is/was crazy-making for me. Now it serves to infuriate me. I don't think the younger generations are as indoctrinated as those of my generation, thank God.
But it tells me we need to have our brains washed of the brainwashing! And we need to spread the word to those who are questioning to trust themselves, trust their questions, trust God & seek answers for ourselves.
Begin reading thru the entire bible, for yourself. Become open minded. Question everything! Question everything EGW wrote & said. God will answer & He is faithful.
As has been said "The truth will set you free. But first it will make you mad!"
Post Number: 1156
|Posted on Tuesday, July 10, 2012 - 2:42 pm: || |
I used to yearn to eat bread right out of the oven, but steadfastly controlled myself! EGW said it was a no-no.
Did you grow up under that one, too?
Post Number: 2730
|Posted on Tuesday, July 10, 2012 - 6:55 pm: || |
Yes, we had the same restrictions on eating bread right out of the oven. The only reason I let the bread cool off now is that it slices better if I wait. I bake with flour I mill myself and am now using hard white winter wheat. There is nothing finer than eating a slice of this bread right out of the oven with butter on it.
Praise God, it's not a sin to enjoy such a treat.
Post Number: 85
|Posted on Tuesday, July 10, 2012 - 7:07 pm: || |
My family was farmers and had no egw references so we ate and did what we wanted all the while I was told we attended the SDA church because all churches were imperfect but because of the sabbath the SDA church was the most right. Go figure.
Post Number: 13824
|Posted on Tuesday, July 10, 2012 - 10:04 pm: || |
Oh,yes--that warm bread prohibition always annoyed me and also made me feel guilty in the back of my mind when I would try to eat some warm. SOO glad to be able to enjoy warm bread!! (And vinegar and mustard, and ketchup and mayonnaise...)
Post Number: 554
|Posted on Tuesday, July 10, 2012 - 10:24 pm: || |
Ok, so warm bread was a no-no, but what about toast? French toast? Grilled Cheese? Bread pudding? Toasted bread crumbs over macaroni and cheese?
Or was is just something personal against the moment of completion?
Post Number: 160
|Posted on Wednesday, July 11, 2012 - 1:23 am: || |
From what I remember hearing other Adventists, toasted bread would actually be better than "normal" bread because it would be properly cooked and would not ferment in your stomach as all the yeast in the bread would be dead by then... Or something like that.
I think their avoidance of "warm" bread wasn't actually related to it being warm, but with what I said above.
Hadn't heard about mayonnaise... Maybe that never got into Spain Lucky for me, because as a kid I loved mayo!
What about not drinking water during your meals but only before them? Or avoiding mixing any sugar with milk? Last things I heard from Adventists about food, a few years back, was something about acid and alkaline foods. And also this guy, who was supposed to be an "expert", giving a conference and talking about apples giving you more "hertz" than other foods... Yes, like in waves' "hertz". If you have some knowledge in science or engineering you'll see where the problem is.
Post Number: 13827
|Posted on Wednesday, July 11, 2012 - 3:19 pm: || |
Yes, the problem with warm bread was that supposedly the yeast had not quit "baking" and was thus giving off poisonous gasses that would make us sick as it entered the stomach. It was thought that the yeast was somehow dangerous while it was actively working in dough.
Toasting was supposed to thoroughly kill any possible lingering yeast cells and make the bread safer to eat.
Yes, I also knew about no water with means and not mixing sugar and milk because it supposedly produced alcohol in the stomach. It was always a bit awkward, though...on the one hand, we had the prophet's warning; on the other...we had ice cream.
Post Number: 87
|Posted on Wednesday, July 11, 2012 - 3:20 pm: || |
Actually the humano body should be alkaline and not acid. You can get the test strips at the health foods store. That is very important. There will always be a smidgeon of truth interspersed with the loony.
Post Number: 2708
|Posted on Thursday, July 12, 2012 - 12:14 pm: || |
I think most all Adventists "wink" at some of the Ellen White rules while keeping others. (Of course the hard core Adventists try to keep ALL of them, but I bet they're really grumpy! Seriously, a person cannot keep up with all those rules and REST in Jesus!)
When I was an Adventist, my family "winked" at the hot bread rule and the no-cheese and butter rules too. Remember all the cheesy dishes at SDA potlucks? There's a LOT of Adventists who wink at her rules and consider themselve "not legalistic" for doing so!
One rule my family sternly kept was the "no-swim-on-Sabbath" rule. One hot Sabbath day when I was a young kid, our family was walking through a park or something. (I don't remember what place it was exactly.) We came across a cool stream rushing over bedrock. My brother begged my mother, saying that he wouldn't swim, just sort of scoot along in the water, so as not to "break" the Sabbath. She consented and we stood in the hot sun watching as he cooled off and played. I wasn't about to "break" the Sabbath by going into that water, but OH did I ever wish I could! If only it wasn't Sabbath,(!) I was thinking.
I stayed an Adventist for another 35 or so years after that, before the Lord delivered me out of that deception. Now I'm amazed how clear the Bible is about Jesus being our Sabbath REST now! (I feel cheated out of a lot of years too, by that burdensome religion. )
Post Number: 916
|Posted on Saturday, July 14, 2012 - 7:23 am: || |
Ah, another food thread!
These contradictions were one of the first things I noticed in the church that told me something was wrong.
My first Christmas in the church there was a white elephant gift exchange Christmas party following the mandatory Ingathering/ Christmas caroling. One of the church leaders stuffed some things inside a chocolate box and then said, "We ate them - sorry." Another person brought a box of chocolates for his gift. I had just heard about the dangers of caffeine - as a gateway drug to more dangerous drugs if you can possibly believe that and had stopped drinking caffeine. I was absolutely shocked by what I saw!
I brought jello to a potluck and only one other person besides me (I think - my memory is a bit faded) took some. A health message talk was given by a Dr. who was an elder. His wife confronted him about his caffeine use during the message. There was to be no ice cream at a pot luck, but an elder took me out for ice cream after one of the school programs. I had french toast at an elder's house, but was told not to tell anyone what we had. I had no idea why and was surprised that he didn't want anyone else to know. (It's generally not a favorite topic of conversation to tell what I had to eat at someone's house - unless its something fabulous). I wondered why.
There was no swimming, but we went to see the tall ships exhibit one Sabbath afternoon. Tons of people were working for us. Ironically, only the new people who had just learned about the Sabbath were concerned about breaking the Sabbath. Everyone else was ok with it.
The head elder said he ate veggie burgers at Burger King, but had grown tired of them and was now getting the real thing.
The rules were clearly there, but only sometimes followed. That was mainly when other Adventists were around.
By the way, one of the vegan elder's wives who DID follow the health message closely was one of the sickest people I've ever met. There was also a lot of obesity in the church. Go figure!
Post Number: 917
|Posted on Saturday, July 14, 2012 - 7:29 am: || |
By the way, there's an excellent article about EGW's vinegar addiction here.
The whole web site www.ellenwhiteexposed.com is well worth reading if you are beginning to see and question the truth of Ellen White's writings and whether or not she is a true prophet of God.
There is a link to the site map on the left. Although the main topics are good, I found the site map quite helpful.
Post Number: 2715
|Posted on Sunday, July 15, 2012 - 10:57 am: || |
Yes, since SDAs aren't supposed to eat meat, and the fake meat is so expensive, they eat lots and lots of carbohydrates to fill them up. I wonder if anyone has done a study on whether there's more obesity and diabetes among SDAs than among the general population!
Yummm... there's a place in Grants Pass, OR that serves sourdough bread bowls with delicious clam chowder. These aren't the ordinary bread bowls one usually gets which is just pre-baked, reheated bread. These are delicious, chewy ones (like the end piece on a fresh baked loaf of bread), that taste like they came right out of the oven! Ellen White would forbid all three, I think. Eating the bread fresh baked, eating sourdough and eating CLAM chowder!
Post Number: 9800
|Posted on Sunday, July 15, 2012 - 12:32 pm: || |
Asurprise, do you live in Grants Pass, Oregon? I ask because my best friend from 6th-12th grade lives there. She attends a celebration SDA church there.
Post Number: 425
|Posted on Sunday, July 15, 2012 - 12:50 pm: || |
Your link is very interesting & I may have to take back what I said in the initial post. It says that the way vinegar was made in the mid 1800s it had a much higher residual alcohol level in the final product. So EGW could have been 'addicted' to vinegar - to the alcohol content of it. I just imagined her being addicted to the salad dressing made from oil & venegar. What else could you do with vinegar that you could use enough to be addicted even it did have a higher alcohol level? lol!
From the description of what it took for her to break her 'vinegar habit', she surely was addicted to something!
Post Number: 91
|Posted on Sunday, July 15, 2012 - 4:51 pm: || |
Egw ate oysters all her life. Maybe not clam chowder but possibly oyster chowder way on her menu? I had two aunts, sisters, both lifelong SDA, Born in early 1900's. One was very strict, horrible to be around because of all her rules. The other one, remember she too was SDA thought the perfect Sabbath afternoon for the children was to give us each a bicycle and a bb gun so we could play Cowboys and Indians. I think you can each figure out which auntie I prefered to spend sabbath with. LOL. We could swim on Sabbath in Gods water (ocean, river, etc.) but not manmade water (pools, ditches, etc.).
Post Number: 2717
|Posted on Monday, July 16, 2012 - 8:48 am: || |
Diana; I live in the Medford area - Grants Pass is probably about 40 minutes from where I live...
A long time ago, back when I was an SDA, I remember visiting an SDA celebration church in Grants Pass. I went because there was so many Adventists complaining about celebration churches, that I wanted to go and see for myself. Other than a few people raising their hands during the music, which I thought was weird at the time, I didn't find anything to fault - from the point of view of an Adventist. (I think the only complaints I had read about concerning celebration churches was the fact they used drums in their music and that they projected the words of the music on a screen at the front. At the time I had no idea if they were right about drums being "satanic," but I thought it was rediculous that people would think it more holy to sing praises to God with their heads aimed down at their laps as they read the words from a hymnal, then to have their heads pointed forward reading the words from a screen up front.)
Post Number: 235
|Posted on Monday, July 16, 2012 - 7:43 pm: || |
What I was taught is that raising your arms is an invitation for a spirit to enter you--and the assumption was always that it would be an evil spirit.
Post Number: 1157
|Posted on Tuesday, July 17, 2012 - 10:00 am: || |
Martin, so you never got to experience the joy of "vege-naise"?!?
That's really what it's called!
Post Number: 1158
|Posted on Tuesday, July 17, 2012 - 10:03 am: || |
Not that it's bad to be healthy, but we were taught a warped view of healthy eating.