| Author | Message | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 907 Registered: 11-2005 |
Gilbert Jorgensen It has been 163 Years and 1 Day since October 22, 1844 | ||
| Helovesme2 Registered user Username: Helovesme2 Post Number: 1098 Registered: 8-2004  |
These are interesting quotes, but I'm not clear what point you are seeking to highlight. Care to elucidate? Blessings, Mary | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 910 Registered: 11-2005 |
To be continued ... Gilbert Jorgensen | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 913 Registered: 11-2005 |
Mary, you (like my wife) are way to astute! <grinning> Women have a special intuition, don't they! I'll tell you where I'm going with this. I stumbled across some information that I thought was interesting. We were all taught (and I do believe) that FreeMasonry and Christianity don't mix. I do not believe in FreeMasonry. Ellen White spoke out against it. So far so good. Now for the interesting part! Did you know that William Miller was a Master Mason? According to Webster’s Dictionary, a prophet is one "who delivers divine messages, or interprets the divine will, or one who foretells the future." It is true that Ellen White did not receive "the prophetic gift" until shortly after the Great Disappointment in 1844. However, God’s will for His people has never changed throughout the history of the world. The vile and unclean things of yesteryear are the same today as they have always been. If God revealed to Ellen White the evils of Masonry in the mid-1880s, this was not "new light", because these associations would have always been against His will. With Ellen White’s "close connection" to God, He could have easily prevented her from making the following irrefutable error in 1849! (I will provide her glowing endorsements in a followup post.) And despite her "enlightenment" in later years, she failed to correct her blunder, although the truth of William Miller’s membership in the Masonic Order has been a matter of public record, in print, since 1853. "At the age of 23, in 1803, he married Lucy Smith and they set up housekeeping in Poultney, Vermont. There was a large library in this town and Miller spent much time there. His ability to write verse made him popular at public occasions. He joined the Literary Society and also became a Mason.", LeRoy Froom, The Prophetic Faith of Our Fathers, vol. 4, page 456. "It was here [Poultney, Vermont] that Miller became a member of the Masonic fraternity, in which his perseverance, if nothing else, was manifested; for he advanced to the highest degree which the lodges in the country, or in any in that region, could confer.", Sylvester Bliss, Memoirs of William Miller, pages 21-22 (1853) Gilbert Jorgensen | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 914 Registered: 11-2005 |
James White obviously knew that William Miller was a Master Mason because when he copied and republished Sylvester Bliss's biography he copied the paragraph before and after the paragraph about William Miller being a Mason, but left that paragraph out. Why? So the leader of the Advent Movement was a Master Mason. So was Joseph Smith, leader of the Mormon Movement... Gilbert Jorgensen | ||
| Lordsanointed Registered user Username: Lordsanointed Post Number: 17 Registered: 8-2007 |
Gilbert, it´s new for me!!! Good point.
God bless you. Lordsanointed | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 924 Registered: 11-2005 |
The End... | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 2224 Registered: 10-2004  |
Gilbert, you left out the most spooky part--the part about her giving the secret Masonic hand signs. (I noticed you posted that part on CARM.) Jeremy | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 925 Registered: 11-2005 |
Oh. Thanks! I don't know what I would do without all of you keeping me straight!
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| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 926 Registered: 11-2005 |
And here is the unabridged version of the last CARM post with the books.google.com links:
Even though the Faulkhead story was long, I knew that if I didn't include it, one of the SDA's would claim it was proof, and that I waas trying to present a biased view. To me it shows the ridiculous lengths that the White Estate, and in this case Arthur White, will go to in order to give Ellen White a miraculous persona. I believe that her was also the one who came up with her 2000 visions myth (http://www.truthorfables.com/EGW_2000Vision_Fables.htm). Gilbert | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 4430 Registered: 3-2004  |
Other angels, besides the angels from heaven, know those signs and would not hesitate to use them to further Satan's cause. Diana | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 7059 Registered: 12-2003  |
True, Diana. Whatever the case...whether EGW got the signs from her "attending angel" or whether she got them from her own colleagues, the fact that she used them implicates her. How anyone can say that, because a person has the knowledge of dark/evil, she is therefore inspired of God, is beyond me. All this reminds me of the way Adventists used the testimony of the late Roger Morneau, the former occultitst who became Adventist, who said that his spirit guides told him Adventism was dangerous because it opposed spiritism and must be avoided at all costs. When Morneau became Adventist and published this "insider information" from his spirit guides, the Adventists were quick to let the world know that Satan was afraid of Adventism's "truth". Who ever heard of using the testimony of demons to "prove" Truth? Satan is the father of lies; why would he identify Adventism as the real truth unless it was a lie? As usual, it's all so twisted... Colleen | ||
| Larry Registered user Username: Larry Post Number: 262 Registered: 5-2007 |
Colleen, here's another twisty for you  sda's teach that Jesus could have failed and the whole universe gotten thrown into chaos. The only spirits at the cross who thought Jesus could fail was the demons. God the Father, knowing the end from the beginning knew exactly that the Son would never fail, nor sin. What do sda's preach? the doctrines of demons of course. | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 1668 Registered: 9-2006  |
Spoookeey, My father was a Mason, I have no idea his rank, my uncle and now my younger brother is a Mason, I think he holds a 33rd degree or some such. My Dad spent many years of his life with an abnormal fear of death; I would imagine it was because of his Masonic connections. Finally, the last time I spent with Dad in the healing conversations that the Lord provided between Dad and me, he told me �Son, I am not longer so afraid of death� I believe he had finally made peace with God. He only lasted a few short years after that before cancer took him, he spent the last hours of his life as I sat with him in the hospital room with the praises of God on his lips, he just kept saying �praise you Jesus� over and over. I felt a great sense of peace when he died. The interesting thing about this was that my younger brother insisted that we have a Masonic service after the Christian minister got done (this was all grave side). As the Christian minister preached a short message of our hope in God, I really felt the presence of the Holy Spirit. Now get this. When he was finished and the old Masonic lodge master and all the masons that were there stood up in their silly aprons and he went into his rigamarole I felt the Holy Spirit leave that place just as sure as I�m sitting here and it left me feeling cold as ice. My older brother said the same thing later. My uncle, the Mason, who had been very sick and could not stand ask me if I would throw his cedar sprig on the casket for him, I said "sure I'll throw your sprig on there" so when he gave the word I tossed the thing on there, but friends my feeling had left and I might as well have thrown a dog bone at that thing. I was mighty relieved when they got done with their pagan foolishness and the casket was draped with the flag, it was like the flag of our country finally covered that travesty. My older brother and I keep praying for our younger brother to be saved, we three are all that's left. I don't think the Holy Spirit liked the Masonic deal very much and wasn't going to participate in it. I know it sounds weird, but I am telling the truth the best way I know how and am honest before God. I tell you folks, when the Holy Spirit leaves, that's when I get ready to get hat and run like a turkey. I couldn't get out of there fast enough. What a bunch of nincompoops with their silly aprons, Masonic drivel and cedar sprigs. My younger brother kept the apron and I kept the flag, I wouldn't have that apron in my house. River | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 7065 Registered: 12-2003 |
River, I absolutely believe you. No doubt at all. Thank you for sharing that. I have a friend, a former Adventist whose dad was a Mason before he became an Adventist pastor. When my friend left SDAism and went to seminary for an M.Th., she spoke with a faculty member who actually had a specialty working with people who had been in Masonry, etc. She said she learned that Masons bequeath their blood lines to Beelzebub when they are initiated into the 28th degree. He dad had been at least a 32nd degree Mason. She realized with sudden clarity why there was so much trouble in her family with siblings whose lives were out of control, nieces and nephews who couldn't get their lives in order, etc. She realized with certainty that as the first true Christian in her family, God was asking her to minister His reconciliation to her family. She literally renounced the spirit of Masonry and asked God to free her from the Masonic curse that had been on her family. She's an amazing woman today...with a calling to a spiritually demanding ministry (unrelated to Masonry, I might add!). I have great respect for her. Colleen | ||
| Thomas1 Registered user Username: Thomas1 Post Number: 220 Registered: 4-2002  |
I was going to avoid this topic, because I do not believe this board is the appropriate place. But it's time for a little balloon popping. First, E G's inside information on Masonry propably didn't come from any "spirit", good or bad. During the mid 1800's there was a full blown furor about Masonry. Much information was written about the "secret" things, such as "signs" "grips" and "words" Much of this information was in error, but enough was true to make it very simple to do what she did. Again, her "spirit" probably came from someone elses writing. She was good at that, remember. This movement became so rabid that they even formed a natioal political party and ran a man for president on an Anti-Masonic ticket. The man who did the most writing for them was Named Ezra Cook. His writings are still in print and still are the main "source" of information used by those who claim to have knowledge of the fraternity. Second, some of the finest born again Christian men I have ever known were and still are Masons. The man who led me to a clearer understanding of grace was among them. To call him a pagan is an insult. Some of the information I have read hear is distorted, or flat out a lie. To call the apron worn by a Mason at a brothers funeral "silly looking" is as insulting as it would be to call the covers worn by the American Legion firing squad "silly looking", when tending to the honor guard of a fallen brother. Both are based in deep tradition and are worn with respect to a fallen brother. Those of you who know anything about me know that nothing means more to me than my relationship with Jesus. However you may suspect that my familiarity with Masonry is more than second hand knowledge. You are right. I am a 35 year member and have served in the highest office of my Lodge four times. I have been as high as you can earn in each of the two major appendant bodies. I can tell you that nothing that I have seen written here has ever been part of my affiliation with the fraternity. Nothing is so damaging as 10% (or less) of knowledge mixed with 90% of "agenda". Those who have never been an adventist do not know what it is really like. They can only know what they read or hear. The same holds for the Masonic fraternity. Do not hold beliefs based on spurious knowledge. B.S., colored and formed to look like a rose, still smells bad, because it's still B.S. Please don't attempt to get me into a dialoge on this, because as I said, I do not believe this is the place for such discussion. If my revealing this horrible knowledge about myself makes me uneligable for further membership, I guess it has to be. But I believe what is written here should be truth, and too much of this discussion has hot met that criteria. In any event, I remain In His Grip <>< Thomas | ||
| Honestwitness Registered user Username: Honestwitness Post Number: 349 Registered: 7-2005  |
So, Thomas, the part about bequeathing the blood lines to Beelzebub is not true? Honestwitness | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 931 Registered: 11-2005 |
Hi Thomas, I value your input, It would be helpful to know what the facts are. Let's suppose that we look at the universally approved doctrinal book of Freemasonry, "Morals and Dogma of the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry," By Albert Pike, Grand Commander, 1859-1891. Its title page states that it was prepared for the "Supreme Council of the Thirty-Third Degree and Published by its Authority." It was originally published in 1871. If we look at the 1966 Edition, is it not true that it states the following? Masonry teaches that Masonry is the Custodian of Truth: "The custodian and depository of the great philosophical and religious truths, unknown to the world at large, and handed down from age to age by an unbroken current of tradition, embodied in symbols, emblems and allegories." (page 210) Masonry teaches that Masonry is a religious institution: "Masonry, is in every sense of the word, except one, and that its least philosophical, an eminently religious institution - that it is indebted solely to the religious element which it contains for its origin and for its continued existence and that without this religious element it would scarcely be worthy of cultivation by the wise and good."..."Freemasonry is NOT Christianity not a substitute for it"..."But the religion of Masonry is not sectarian. It admits men of every creed within its hospitable bosom, rejecting institutions; and on this ground mainly, if not alone, should the religious Mason defend it." (Encyclopedia of Freemasonry, Albert G. Mackey, Revised Edition, 1921, pages 618, 619) Masonry teaches that Masonry is the foundation of religion: "It is the universal, eternal, immutable religion, such as God planted it in the heart of universal humanity. No creed has ever been long-lived that was not built on this foundation. It is the base and they are the superstructure." (page 219) Masonry teaches that the Masonic Temple is a temple of religion: "Every Masonic Temple is a Temple of Religion, and its teachings are instructions in religion." (page 213) Masonry teaches that Buddha is the first legislator: "The first Masonic legislator whose memory is preserved to us by history, was Buddha, who, about a thousand years before the Christian era, reformed the religion of Manous." (page 277) Masonry reverences all reformers: "It reverences all the great reformers. It sees in Moses, the lawgiver to the Jews, in Confucius and Zoroaster, in Jesus of Nazareth, and in the Arabain Iconoclast, great teachers of morality, and eminent reformers, if no more; and allows every brother of the order to assign to each such higher and even divine characteristics as his creed and truth require." (page 525) Masonry teaches that it is not creed-bound: "The true Mason is not creed-bound. He realizes with the divine illumination of his lodge that as a Mason his religion must be universal: Christ, Buddha or Mohammed, the name means little, for he recognizes only the light and not the bearer. He worships at every shrine, bows before every altar, whether in temple, mosque or cathedral, realizing with his truer understanding the oneness of all spiritual truth." (The Lost Keys of Freemasonry, Manly P. Hall, 33rd, page 65, Macoy Publishing and Masonic Supply Co. Richmond, Va., 1976.) Masonry teaches that God is above all the Baalim: "Masonry, around whose altars the Christian, the Hebrew, the Moslem, the Brahmin, the followers of Confucius and Zoroaster, can assemble as brethren and unite in prayer to the one God who is above ALL the Baalim, must needs leave it to each of its initiates to look for the foundation of his faith and hope to the written scriptures of his own religion." (page 226) Masonry teaches that Osiris, the ancient Egyptian god, is the source of all good: "Everything good in nature comes from OSIRIS - order, harmony, and the favorable temperature of the seasons and celestial periods." (page 476) [Osiris was the ancient Egyptian god whose annual death and resurrection personified the self-renewing vitality and fertility of nature. "The All Seeing Eye" is a Masonic representation of Osiris.] Masonry conceals its truths: "Masonry, like all the religions, all the Mysteries, Hermeticism and Alchemy, CONCEALS it secrets from all except the Adepts and Sages, or the Elect, and uses false explanations and misinterpretations of its symbols to mislead those who deserve only to be misled; to conceal the Truth, which it calls Light, from them, and to draw them away from it. Truth is not for those who are unworthy or unable to receive it, or would pervert it." (pages 104-105) Masonry teaches that the Blue Lodge is to be deceived: "The Blue Degrees are but the outer court or portico of the Temple. Part of the symbols are displayed there to the Initiate, but he is intentionally misled by false interpretations. It is not intended that he shall understand them, but it is intended that he shall imagine he understands them." (page 819) Masonry teaches that the Worshipful Master is the source of light: "Worshipful Master: The Head and Chief of the Lodge, the Source of Light, of Knowledge and instruction in Masonry. He personifies the Sublime Art of Masonry and is the Spokesman thereof." (Arthur Waite, A New Encyclopedia of Freemasonry, 1970, page xxiv) Masonry teaches that obedience is the first rule: "The first duty of every Mason is to obey the Mandate of the Master...The order must at once be obeyed; its character and its consequences may be matters of subsequent inquiry. The Masonic rule of obedience is like the nautical, imperative: 'Obey orders, even if you break owners'." (Encyclopedia of Freemasonry, Albert Mackey, page 525) Masonry teaches that the Bible is incomprehensible: "The teachers, even of Christianity, are, in general the most ignorant of the true meaning of that which they teach. There is no book of which so little is known as the Bible. To most who read it, it is as incomprehensible as the Sohar." (page 105) Masonry teaches that the Bible is incomplete: "All truly dogmatic religions have issued from the Kabalah and return to it. Everything scientific and grand in the religious dreams of the Illuminati, Jacob Boehme, Swedenborg, Saint-Martin, and others, is borrowed from the Kabalah; all the Masonic associations owe to it their secrets and their symbols. "The Kabalah alone consecrates the Alliance of the Universal Reason and the Divine Word... "The Bible, with all the allegories it contains, expresses, in an incomplete and veiled manner only, the religious science of the Hebrews. The doctrine of Moses and the Prophets, identical at bottom with that of the ancient Egyptians, also had its outward meaning and its veils. "The Hebrew books were written only to recall to memory the traditions; and they were written in symbols unintelligible to the profane...thus was a second Bible born, unknown to, or rather uncomprehended by, the Christians; a collection, they say, of monstrous absurdities. "One is filled with admiration, on penetrating into the Sanctuary of the Kabalah, at seeing a doctrine so logical, so simple and at the same time so absolute." (pages 744-745) [The "Kabalah" is a book of ancient Jewish mysticism and magic.] Masonry teaches that one of the deities of Masonry is Lucifer, and that Lucifer is God: "When the Mason learns that the Key to the warrior on the block is the proper application of the dynamo of living power, he has learned the Mystery of his Craft. The seething energies of Lucifer are in his hands and before he may step onward and upward, he must prove his ability to properly apply [this] energy." (Lost Keys of Freemasonry, Manly P. Hall, page 48) That which we must say to the crowd is - We worship a God, but it is the God that one adores without superstition. "To you, Sovereign Grand Inspectors General, we say this, that you may repeat it to the Brethren of the 32nd, 31st, and 30th degrees - The Masonic Religion should be, by all of us initiates of the high degrees, maintained in the purity of the Luciferian Doctrine. "If Lucifer were not God, would Adonay (The God of the Christians) whose deeds prove his cruelty, perfidy and hatred of man, barbarism and repulsion for science, would Adonay and his priests, calumniate him? "Yes, Lucifer is God, and unfortunately Adonay is also god. For the eternal law is that there is no light without shade, no beauty without ugliness, no white without black, for the absolute can only exist as two gods: darkness being necessary for light to serve as its foil as the pedestal is necessary to the statue, and the brake to the locomotive. "Thus, the doctrine of Satanism is a heresy; and the true and pure philosophical religion is the belief in Lucifer, the equal of Adonay; but Lucifer, God of Light and God of Good, is struggling for humanity against Adonay, the God of Darkness and Evil." (Instructions to the 23 Supreme Councils of the World, Albert Pike, Grand Commander, Sovereign Pontiff of Universal Freemasonry, July 14, 1889. Recorded by A.C. De La Rive, La Femme et l'Enfant dans la Franc-Maconnerie Universelle, page 588) The Word of God, the Bible, clearly puts Lucifer in his proper place, and gives God's reasons. "How Art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! How art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God; I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north. I will ascend above the clouds; I will be like the most High. Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit." (Isaiah 14:12-15) Masonry teaches the following about the "Grand Architect of the Universe": Masonic ritual is concerned with the recovery of the "Lost Word," presumed to be the name of God - supposedly lost through the murder of the architect, Hiram Abiff, during the building of Solomon's Temple. This quest is attained during the ritual of the ROYAL ARCH DEGREE. It is here that the SECRET NAME of the DEITY OF MASONRY is revealed. That name is "JAOBULON." "JAO" is the Greek word for Jehovah. "BUL" is a rendering of the name, BAAL. "ON" is the term used in the Babylonian mysteries to call upon the deity "OSIRIS"! The secret ritual book of the Craft prints the letters J.B.O. It states that: "We three do meet and agree - in peace, love and unity - the Sacred Word to keep - and never to divulge the same - until we three, or three such as we - do meet and agree." Thus, no Royal Arch Mason can pronounce the whole sacred name by himself! Masonry teaches the following about the "God of the Mystic Shrine": The candidates for this ritual kneel at the ALTAR OF OBLIGATION with arms bound, leaning upon the top, heads bowed. There they are required to "assume a most powerful and binding oath, inseparably uniting yourself with us, and once taken, it can never be retracted or departed from." The oath itself is curse enough, being four pages in length. Its penalty includes "having my eyeballs pierced to the center with a three-edged blade." The revelation of truth is in the candidates' sealing of the oath, revealing the true nature of the Masonic god of the "Mystic Shrine": ...and may ALLAH, the god of Arab, Moslem and Mohammedan, the GOD OF OUR FATHERS, support me to the entire fulfillment of the same, Amen, Amen, Amen. (The Ancient Arabic Order, Nobles of the Mystic Shrine, pages 35-39, Allen Publishing Co. NY, NY.) Masonry teaches the following about the "I Am that I Am": During the ceremonies of the ritual for the Royal Arch degree, the candidate is asked, "Brother Inspector, what are you?" and he replies, "I AM THAT I AM." Can you imagine that? When Moses asked God to name Himself, God said, "I AM THAT I AM" and He said, "Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you." (Exodus 3:14) Tell me how a Christian can take to himself the Biblical name of the God of Israel? The God of the Christian faith said, "Ye are even my witnesses! Is there a God besides me? Yea, I know not any! They that make a graven image are ALL of them vanity; and their delectable things shall not profit; and they are their own witnesses; they see not, nor know; that they may be ashamed." (Isaiah 44:8, 9) Masonry teaches that the Mastor Mason is a God in the making: "Man is a god in the making, and as in the mystic myths of Egypt, on the potter's wheel he is being molded. When his light shines out to lift and preserve all things, he receives the triple crown of godhood and joins that throng of Master Masons who, in their robes of Blue and Gold, are seeking to dispel the darkness of night with the triple light of the Masonic Lodge." "The glorious privileges of a Master Mason are in keeping with his greater knowledge and wisdom...For Him the Heavens have opened and the Great Light has bathed him in its radiance. The Prodigal Son, so long a wanderer in the regions of darkness, has returned to his Father's house. The voice speaks from the Heavens, its power thrilling the Master until his own being seems filled with its divinity, saying, 'This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.' He [The Master Mason], in truth has become the spokesman of the Most High. He stands between the glowing fire light and the world. Through him passes Hydra, the great snake, and from its mouth there pours to man the light of God." (The Lost Keys of Freemasonry, Manly P. Hall, pages 92, 54-55, Macoy Publishing and Supply Co., Richmond, Va, 1976) Masonry teaches about a blood oath: Throughout the initiation rituals of the "BLUE LODGES" and through all 33 degrees of Freemasonry, the candidates are sworn to secrecy by bloody oaths. Such as is the oath swore by the Entered Apprentice of first degree, " ...binding myself under no less penalty than that of having my throat cut across, my tongue torn out by its roots, and my body buried in the rough sands of the sea, at low-water mark." The Master Mason swears, "...under no less penalty than that of having my body severed in two, my bowels taken from thence and burned to ashes, the ashes scattered before the four winds of heaven..." (Duncan's Ritual of Freemasonry by Malcolm Duncan, Third Edition, pages 36, 39, D. McKay Publishing Co., N.Y., N.Y.) Masonry teaches in the "Blue Lodge" degree about raising the dead: It is in this final "Blue Lodge" degree that that candidate is laid out "in death"and is raised from the dead by the "Worshipful Master" of the Lodge (representing King Solomon), using the "strong grip" (or "Lion's Paw")of the Master Mason. Masonry teaches that Masonic Oaths are above the law: One the "five points of fellowship," he and his "savior" pass the sacred word, Mah-Hah-Bone. Also, while in this position, the new Master Mason solemnly vows "3d, Breast to Breast: that you will ever keep in your breast a brother's secrets, when communicated to you and received as such, murder and treason excepted." (Duncan's Rituals, Revised and Complete, pages 35, 96, 120, 121, E. Cook Publications, 1974) It should further be noted that in the Royal Arch Degree, the candidate swears to protect the "brethren, " "Murder and treason not excepted!" This places the Masonic oath above that of our courts and our country. Masonry teaches a pagan communion where the dead are eaten: "QUESTION: What is to us the chief symbol of man's ultimate redemption and regeneration? "ANSWER: The fraternal supper, of bread which nourishes, and of wine which refreshes and exhilarates, symbolically of the time which is to come, when all mankind shall be one great harmonious brotherhood; and teaching us these great lessons: that as matter changes ever, but no single atom is annihilated, it is not rational to suppose that the far nobler soul does not continue to exist beyond the grave: that many thousands who have died might claim to be joint owners with ourselves of the particles that compose our physical bodies; for matter ever forms new combinations; and the bodes of the ancient dead, the patriarchs before and since the flood, the kings and the common people of all ages, resolved into their constituent elements, are carried upon the wind over all continents, and continually enter into and form part of the habitations of new souls, creating new bonds of sympathy and brotherhood between each man that lives and all his race. And thus, in the bread we eat, and in the wind we drink tonight may enter into and form of us part of us the identical particles of matter that once formed parts of the material bodies called Moses, Confucius, Plato, Socrates, or Jesus of Nazareth. In the truest sense, we eat and drink the bodies of the dead; and cannot say that there is a single atom of our blood or body, the ownership of which some other soul might not dispute with us." (page 539) ============================================================= Charles G. Finney, the greatest of the 19th Century evangelists, left Freemasonry when he acknowledged Christ as Savior and Lord of his life. He wrote a book on the subject of Freemasonry. It has been reissued by Crown Publication, Burlington, Ontario, Canada under the title, The Antichrist of the Masonic Society. On page 139 he states correctly: "God hold the church and every branch of it, responsible for its opinions and actions in accordance with the best light, which, in His providence, is afforded them. "While Masonry was a secret, the church had no light, and no responsibility respecting it ... Hence God did not require the church to bear any testimony on the subject as long as Masonry was secret. "Freemasonry is now revealed. It is no longer a secret from any who wish to be informed. "Since these revelations (the rituals) have been made, and both the church and the world can know what Masonry really is, God demands, and the world has a right to expect, that the church will take due action and bear a truthful testimony in respect to this institution. She cannot now innocently hold her peace. The light has come. Fidelity to God, and to the souls of men, require that the church, which is the light of the world, should speak out, and should take such actions as will plainly reveal her views of the compatibility or incompatibility of Freemasonry with the Christian religion. "...How can we fail to pronounce Freemasonry an anti-Christian institution? .. Its morality is unchristian, ... its oath-bound secrecy is unchristian, .. taking of its oaths are unchristian, ... Masonic oaths pledge its members to commit most unlawful and unchristian acts, deliver each other from difficulty whether right or wrong, favor Masonry in political action and business transactions, sworn to retaliated, to persecute unto death the violators of Masonic obligations, ...its oaths are profane, the taking of the name of God in vain, ...the penalties of these oaths are barbarous and even savage, ...its teachings are false and profane, ...its design is partial and selfish, ...it is an enormous falsehood. "Every local branch of the Church of Christ is bound to examine this subject, and pronounce upon this institution, according to the best light they can get. God does not allow individuals, or churches, (or pastors), to withhold action, and the expression of the opinion, until other churches are as enlightened as themselves. "If churches who are known to have examined the subject withhold their testimony; if they continue to receive persistent and intelligent Freemasons; if they leave the public to infer that they see nothing in Freemasonry inconsistent with a creditable profession of the Christian religion, it will be justly inferred by other branches of the church, and by the world, that there is nothing in it so bad, so dangerous and unchristian as to call for their examination, action, and testimony. "It is almost universally conceded that persistent Freemasons, who continued to adhere and cooperate with them, ought not to be admitted to Christian churches." ================================================================= Dwight L. Moody said, "I do not see how any Christian, most of all a Christian minister, can go into these secret lodges with unbelievers. They say they can have more influence for good: but I say they can have more influence for good by staying out of them, and reproving their evil deeds. Abraham had more influence for good in Sodom than Lot had." For this, D. L. Moody was challenged, "If you talk this way, you will drive all the members of secret societies out of your meetings and out of our churches." To this the bold pastor proclaimed, "But what if I did? Better men will take their places. Give them the truth anyway, and if they would rather leave their churches than their lodges, the sooner they get out of the churches, the better. I would rather have ten members who are separated from the world than a thousand such members. Better one with God than a thousand without Him." Your friend, Gilbert | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 932 Registered: 11-2005 |
http://www.sacred-texts.com/mas/md/index.htm (Morals and Dogma by Albert Pike [1871]) http://www.sacred-texts.com/mas/index.htm (Freemasonry) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morals_and_Dogma_of_the_Ancient_and_Accepted_Scottish_Rite_of_Freemasonry http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freemasonry | ||
| Larry Registered user Username: Larry Post Number: 264 Registered: 5-2007 |
I saw elements of Mormonism and adventism within your post Gilbert! Did anyone else see elements of ellen white in this description of Masons? I certainly did. Can anyone find out if she had any masonic books in her personal library? Could there be any heresy that masons have not acquired? Looks like they've got it all! It seems all heresies possible are found within masonry. Did they overlook any? Thanks a million for posting that, as I had no idea what a mason stood for. | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 933 Registered: 11-2005 |
A good friend of mine recommended an excellent book, Early Christian Doctrines, by J.N.D. Kelly, which I purchased and have been reading. I read part of Chapter One today. Parts of it describe an eerie similarity in early post-apostolic thinking to the mystical and structured aspects of Masonism. Ultimately Adventism is what it is because of the foundation it was built on. I want to understand that foundation. The fact that William Miller achieved the level of a Master Mason, to me, is a fascinating connection. It had to have a profound effect on the way he viewed things as he laid the foundation for what later became Adventism. Within Adventism we see this passionate desire to have special knowledge that no one outside the organization has -- knowledge that is not gained from the Bible but by special association with a specific organization. It is like a perverted form of Christianity plus. A study of the early post-apostolic years documents a number of movements such as Gnosticism, Philonism, Platonism, Aristotelianism and Stoicism. Clement and Origen, for example, felt that there were two types of Christianity, with two grades of Christians corresponding to them. The first and lower type was based on "faith", i.e., the literal acceptance of the truths declared in Scriptures and the Church's teachings, while the second and higher type was described as "gnosis", i.e. an esoteric form of knowledge. This started with the Bible and tradition, indeed was founded on them, but its endeavor was to unravel their deeper meaning, and in the light of it to explore the profounder mysteries of God and His universe and scheme of salvation; it was supposed to culminate in mystical contemplation or ecstasy. Thus they divided the faithful into simple believers, whom they tended to disparage, and "spiritual" men, "gnostics", or "perfect", whom they regarded as specially privileged by God. Manichaeism is especially interesting in that it is really a completely independent religion embodying Christian, but also Buddhist and Zoroastrian, elements. Indeed, it claimed to be the only universal religion. It was founded on radical dualism, and taught that reality consists of two great forces eternally opposed to each other. Man is of the same essence as God, and human souls are fragments of divine substance. His salvation lies in grasping this truth by an interior illumination which may be spontaneous, but usually comes in response to initiation into the Machichaean fellowship; and in the process of salvation, paradoxically, God is at once redeemer and redeemed. Such in outline was the dualist doctrine which, with its highly organized church, its graded hierarchy of adherents ("auditors", "elect", "priests", "bishops", "apostles" or "masters"), and its corresponding degrees of asceticism, swept over Europe, Africa and Asia from the end of the third century and won such noble converts as Augustine. Reading this chapter helps me to understand so much better the mindset of Masonism, and by extension certain aspects of Adventism, that purport to house exclusive knowledge that no one else has. Gilbert Jorgensen | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 1669 Registered: 9-2006 |
Quote: "Ultimately Adventism is what it is because of the foundation it was built on. I want to understand that foundation." You and me too Gilbert. River | ||
| Darrell Registered user Username: Darrell Post Number: 116 Registered: 10-1999 |
This line really caught my attention: " . . . in the process of salvation, paradoxically, God is at once redeemer and redeemed." I couldn't help but see that this idea is present in the Adventist doctrine of the investigative judgement. The reason given for the IJ is to "vindicate the character of God". I had no idea that this idea had roots in ancient heresy. -Darrell | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 2260 Registered: 10-2004 |
Good catch, Darrell! Jeremy | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 7149 Registered: 12-2003 |
Hey, Darrell, it's good to hear from you! And yes--"good catch", indeed! Colleen | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 965 Registered: 11-2005 |
Darrel, that is an amazing observation! I took your thought and distilled it down to this:
Gilbert Jorgensen It has been 163 Years and 20 Days since October 22, 1844 |
