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Blessed
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Username: Blessed

Post Number: 363
Registered: 1-2007
Posted on Saturday, December 05, 2009 - 2:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was came across this information on the Ellen White website. Apparently they want to get all her writings and information about her life and the SDA church onto the internet because it is a powerful resource. I copied the following from the website:

It is time to act—now! All of Ellen White’s
published writings, plus information about her life and
ministry, besides relevant details about the history
of the Seventh-day Adventist Church, must be made
available, as quickly as possible. We need it in
multiple languages and delivered in creative ways
that will meet the needs of people today, regardless of
where they live or their socio-economic status.
The challenge is great. Regular reading and
study of the Bible and the writings of Ellen White are
in decline among many church members, both young
and old. Likewise, estimates say that in some parts of
the world upwards of 70% of Adventist young people
currently leave the church. Further, far too many new
members apostatize. In the North American Division
alone there are thought to be twice as many former
Adventists as currently-active members. So the
critical need for quick action is clear.
Despite the church’s valiant efforts, almost
without exception all of the groups mentioned above
have felt the impact of criticisms of Ellen White and
the Seventh-day Adventist Church, often through
hostile Web sites. The same Internet that causes
problems we must now harness to help resolve them.
Starting immediately, the White Estate is determined
to use the Internet more effectively as a primary
means of communication and information delivery.
Not doing so only increases the potential size of the
critical challenge we face.

You might want to check this out on their site. I found it most interesting and encouraging that we as formers are making some significant inroads.
River
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Username: River

Post Number: 5782
Registered: 9-2006


Posted on Saturday, December 05, 2009 - 6:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Quote:It is time to act—now! All of Ellen White’s
published writings, plus information about her life and
ministry, besides relevant details about the history
of the Seventh-day Adventist Church, must be made
available, as quickly as possible. We need it in
multiple languages and delivered in creative ways
that will meet the needs of people today, regardless of
where they live or their socio-economic status.

This is very true, it is time for formers to band together and put the real truth about Ellen White and the Adventist church on many websites, on the streets and in your churches.

If they put their 'relevant details' out there, you can bet it will be misleading, if the formers who are truly formers, put it out there, it will be uncover the real face of Adventism, and people will be benefited by it.
River
Hec
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Username: Hec

Post Number: 827
Registered: 3-2009
Posted on Saturday, December 05, 2009 - 6:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'll say it once more. If we develop many Web sites that nobody visits because they don't show up in search engines, we will be wasting our time. The only way for a Web site to show up in a search engine in a position, like first page, where people are going to see it, is by the rating the engine gives it. And the rating is given by how many visits(hits) the site gets. So, yes, it's time for formers to act, but I think that a better use of time and resources would be to enter the sites that are already in the Web and we know that they are good. Hit those sites as if your life depended on it, and their ratings will go up.

Suggestion: why don't someone here who is good at deciphering truth from falsehood, check the sites and give us a short list that we should hit several times a day to improve the rating and the possibility of coming up when someone searches?

Hec
Bb
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Username: Bb

Post Number: 615
Registered: 7-2004
Posted on Sunday, December 06, 2009 - 4:21 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

On this subject, I received in the mail a booklet called "The National Sunday Law Revisited" by "Wake Up America Seminars, Inc.

I thought it was the same old thing sda thing, but the intro says...

This brochure has been sent to you in hopes that you might reexamine your position on the national Sunday law and the seven trumpets of Revelation. This is not an attempt to siphon members or money away from the SDA church. On the contrary, we recommend you stay in your church and add your voice to the growing number of Bible students who believe that the book of Revelation has much more to say about coming events than what has been taught in the past. This brochure is the only communication that you will receive from Wake Up America Seminars. No further mailings will be sent to you unless requested.

It goes on to reject ellen white, yet give their interpretation of final events.

Does anyone know anything about this one?
Raven
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Username: Raven

Post Number: 1095
Registered: 7-2004


Posted on Sunday, December 06, 2009 - 5:39 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I thought Wake Up American Seminars sounded familiar. This is by Larry Wilson, who is in the Dayton OH area. He was around back when I went to Spring Valley Academy in the early 80's, and it look like he is still in the same area. I think he was an SDA minister at one time, but isn't now. He always comes up with strange ways of interpreting Revelation that has put him at odds with the SDA church and I'm not sure he's even a member now--I had the idea they basically kicked him out. Back when I was SDA we all thought he was one of those fringe kooks. He definitely believes in the SDA distinctives, including 1844, EGW, etc. But he's in to date setting, something about the 2nd Coming will happen when the seventh Jubilee Sabbath is ushered in. At one time he thought that would be in 1994 - not sure what he is saying now. Here's his website:
http://www.wake-up.org/whatis/whatis.html
Here's his explanation shortly after 1994 about his position, and shows a lot of his thinking processes:
http://www.wake-up.org/daystar/ds1997/FEB97B.html
Raven
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Username: Raven

Post Number: 1096
Registered: 7-2004


Posted on Sunday, December 06, 2009 - 5:46 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

By the way, my opinion on what the White Estate proposes doing about declining membership, is that it will have no effect towards what they are trying to accomplish. In fact, the more aware people are of what EGW actually says, it could instead tend to distance them more from traditional SDAism, and/or create even more cognitive dissonance. There aren't too many people who have the fortitude to actually accept and implement everything EGW stated. I know alot of us (including me) grew up in mounds of EGW material and knew the history of the SDA church as well as any traditional SDA knows it. Yet when one's eyes are opened the true Gospel, there's no turning back! I say bring it on, as long as it is exactly what EGW said and not their spin of what she said - eventually it will cause many SDAs to think and notice the differences between the Bible and EGW.
Foofighter
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Username: Foofighter

Post Number: 98
Registered: 7-2005
Posted on Sunday, December 06, 2009 - 9:44 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Also, did anyone notice the price tag for these "investments in the future"? Estimated price for all of this is 10 million. It is such a shame that so much time and money is devoted to Ellen White and Adventism. There is so little mention of Jesus in all of this. Talk about cultic!

Just to go a bit off topic, but in regards to the lack of Jesus in Adventism...I just listened to one of Dwight Nelson's sermons yesterday. Someone had written a letter (or email) saying that he was on the verge of becoming an atheist, and could Dwight "impress him" to turn him away from atheism, basically. So, what did Dwight talk about? The Sabbath!!!! I don't recall any mention of Jesus at all. What about His sacrifice? The Lamb of God that taketh away the sin of the world? Do Adventist's ever tire of hearing about the Sabbath? I sure did. I finally started to wonder, what about Jesus?
Asurprise
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Username: Asurprise

Post Number: 1113
Registered: 7-2007
Posted on Sunday, December 06, 2009 - 11:09 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

GOOD!!! Lots of people are leaving! I imagine that LOTS of people from the cults are "apostatizing".

Have you heard what God is doing in the middle east? How many many Muslims and Jewish people are turning to the Lord? Often, in the case of Muslims, Jesus directly gives a dream of Himself to them and tells them to follow Him.

Those people (Muslims) don't have Bibles, but we in the "free" world do. Still, bringing anyone out of a cult is a miracle - the people in them are so blind.

If Adventists read some of the things Ellen wrote, it WOULD give them cognitive dissonance. I wonder what I would have thought if I'd read a little in the first chapter of "Spirit of Prophecy - volume 1." I didn't even know Ellen White had a book by that title. I thought ALL her writings TOGETHER were called "spirit of prophecy."

Anyway, if I'd read that Ellen White had said in this book (first chapter, second paragraph - about page 17), about how God the Father called the angels together and announced to them that from now on, Jesus was to be obeyed as readily as the Father; clearly inferring that up to this point, Jesus was somehow LESS than the Father. If I'd read how she clearly infers by Satan's subsequent hatred and jealousy in the following paragraph, that Jesus and Satan had been equals, but that Jesus had been chosen over Satan. "Satan thought that he was himself a favorite in Heaven among the angels." Right in that one sentence Ellen White says a lot. Yes, they should definitely put out this on the internet. I hope that now that I pointed this out, the Adventist church won't withdraw this book from the Adventist Book Center.
Asurprise
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Username: Asurprise

Post Number: 1114
Registered: 7-2007
Posted on Sunday, December 06, 2009 - 11:35 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When I pointed out what Ellen White had said here, to an Adventist where I work, she (the Adventist) said that God simply had to remind the angels that Jesus was equal to the Father, because of all the confusion that Satan was causing in Heaven. I should have pointed out that if the angels needed reminding that Jesus is God, then they would also have needed reminding that the Father is God!

It's WONDERFUL that God is bringing people OUT of all the false religions and making them His children! People from Mormonism, Roman Catholicism, Seventh-day Adventism, Islam, J-Witnesses, etc. etc. Of course the leaders of these religions will fight back and try to shield their "flocks" from the light!
Colleentinker
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Username: Colleentinker

Post Number: 10729
Registered: 12-2003


Posted on Sunday, December 06, 2009 - 9:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It certainly seems that the SDA organization is intensifying its push to make sure its members have a true SDA identity. Sometimes I feel I'm the last to know what's really happening, but I do sense a reaction to "exposure" or opposition—probably from many different fronts.

The Lord Jesus is faithful—He is calling people to Himself, and no matter how hard the cults and false religions fight against it, the power of the Holy Spirit and the compelling reality of Jesus and His death and resurrection cannot be overcome! He is the Victor!

Colleen
Bb
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Username: Bb

Post Number: 616
Registered: 7-2004
Posted on Monday, December 07, 2009 - 4:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thank you Raven, that pamphlet is now safely in the recycle bin!!

About Jesus having been supposed to be equal with Lucifer, or even confusion about whether he was to be obeyed is really "out there"! I never knew that she wrote that!! It does go along with the mormon concept that Jesus and Lucifer were brothers! Maybe she had some influence from that cult too!
Jls72612
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Username: Jls72612

Post Number: 10
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Thursday, December 10, 2009 - 7:37 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

Suggestion: why don't someone here who is good at deciphering truth from falsehood, check the sites and give us a short list that we should hit several times a day to improve the rating and the possibility of coming up when someone searches? Hec




Here are my favorites:

www.formeradventist.com - our own website
www.lifeassuranceministries.org - Proclamation!
www.lifeassuranceministries.com - Resource for Dale Ratzlaff's books and articles
www.exadventist.com - Former SDA pastor Mark Martin articles and audio files
www.nonsda.org - evidence for Bible truth versus EGW
www.ellenwhiteexposed.com - evidence of all the plagiarism

~Judy
Blessed
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Username: Blessed

Post Number: 364
Registered: 1-2007
Posted on Thursday, December 10, 2009 - 11:55 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I've been wondering if I should write the White Estate an email. I left Adventism long before there was one anti-Ellen or Anti-SDA website. I realized that Adventism was wrong because I read the scriptures alone and it became clear to me that I needed a personal relationship with Jesus. I also began to understand the gift of grace and it was amazing. Yes the websites are making a difference but if their doctrine was not in error the websites would not matter. Sometimes I wonder if I would be wasting my time doing so but maybe not. What do you think?
Hec
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Username: Hec

Post Number: 838
Registered: 3-2009
Posted on Thursday, December 10, 2009 - 11:58 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Organizational, I don't think you'll make a difference. On the personal level, who knows, God might use your e-mail to touch the heart of the one who will read it. And it will make a difference for that one. Every little bit counts.

Hec
Bobalou
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Username: Bobalou

Post Number: 65
Registered: 2-2005
Posted on Thursday, December 10, 2009 - 6:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Last I heard Larry Wilson was in Cleveland, TN.

I also received the pamphlet. He knows my feelings about the church and quit Corresponding with me several years ago.

He was into asteroids and their destruction of our planet. He thought the time was, I believe, in the 2003+/- era. At that time there were some coming close to us.
Dt
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Username: Dt

Post Number: 121
Registered: 4-2005
Posted on Thursday, December 10, 2009 - 8:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Amazing.

So, they need $10 million to get the word out on the internet? Most of the websites they are competing against are run by individuals or small groups. Usually, they have NO BUDGET but do it out of their own pockets or with small donations.
Not to worry though, you can bet that most of the $10 million will be squandered and wasted.

It is ironic that the group with the vault and the locked-up information wants to get the "truth" out there. I have a suggestion for them. How about just publishing all of the documents in the vault? Such as the handwritten copy of Ellen's diary from the Salmanca period, or all of the correspondence between her and John Kellogg. (note I said the exact copy of her diary and not the typed transcription)
How about publishing the original of Dr. Stewart's letter from 1906?

I have a really long list of documents I would like to see them publish. In fact, I would take a scanner and a secretary and scan them, catalog them and publish them on the net at my expense. They could save the $10 million (or waste it in other ways)

DT
Not holding my breath for the "truth"
Flyinglady
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Username: Flyinglady

Post Number: 7794
Registered: 3-2004


Posted on Thursday, December 10, 2009 - 9:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What the sadventist leaders do not realize is that do matter what they do, they will be wasting their money trying to get all sdas to read EGW. She is one of the BIG reasons I left. Then I learned about what the Bible really teaches. I learned amongst other things that our God is so very awesome.
Diana L
Colleentinker
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Username: Colleentinker

Post Number: 10743
Registered: 12-2003


Posted on Friday, December 11, 2009 - 3:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

We have heard of Larry Wilson through some now former SDAs (Christians now) who had been pretty deeply wrapped up in Wilson's theology and theories. It had had a pretty tight hold on the husband of the family, and he had trouble leaving Adventism for a while because he identified with Wilson's "counter-culture" ideas and found a way to believe in Sabbath and the basic structure of Adventism while disagreeing with the organization.

He has finally integrated into a vibrant Christian church, but the pull of the "sci-fi" speculation and theories was really compelling to him for some years.

You know, I am more and more deeply convinced that when we abandon trust in the Bible as the unchanging, unerring revelation of God's thoughts and purposes taught to us by His Spirit, we slide into the "gutter" of The Way and become vulnerable to no end of deceptions.

We have to learn to hold the apparently dichotomous revelations of Scripture (such as God is both in us when we are His, around us, and beyond us; election and the command to believe, etc) in tension, believing all is true without rationalizing it.

God Himself begins to resolve the tensions and to give us ability to live without figuring it all out in a formula form. God is faithful. But when we "edit" God's revelation, we close ourselves to the huge, unimagined reality that is more than all we can ask or imagine.

God is bigger than out hearts, our thoughts, or our ability to reason. We must submit our minds to His word before we can experience the wisdom of God (1 Cor 2).

Colleen

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