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Colleentinker
Posted on Tuesday, February 01, 2000 - 8:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wendy, I'm so sorry for you and your family. I will pray for you and Tom and your children. Actually, the Adventist church does not support divorce, although it officially allows it in cases of "unfaithfulness". The reality is that many Adventists are divorced. Relationships are an area of great deception and falseness within Adventism. Somehow the rigidity of the church provides an excellent front for undisciplined behavior. There's no accountability.

In Him,
Colleen
Lynn W
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2000 - 10:23 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This is the saddest & most dispicable thing of all! You're husband is having affairs, yet in the eyes of the church, YOU are "in rebellion to God."

Does anyone wonder why it's sometimes hard not to get angry???!!!

This is also a perfect example of what Christ meant when He spoke of "straining at gnats & swallowing camels."

Be careful to keep the Sabbath (gnats).
Make excuses for immorality (camels).

I believe Jude said earlier, lifestyle follows doctrine. As Bill Gothard explains the reason: Not because our lifestyle conforms to our doctrine, but because we conform our doctrine to fit our lifestyle.

My heart & prayers go out to you.
Jude the Obscure
Posted on Wednesday, February 02, 2000 - 1:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Lynn,

Your anger is justified. Being justifiably angry is not sinning. Nowhere can you read in Scripture that anger per se is a sin. To the contrary, Paul (in Ephesians 4:25-28, NIV) says this:

"Therefore each of you must put off falsehood and speak truthfully to his neighbor, for we are all members of one body. 'In your anger do not sin' [quoting Psalm 4:4]. Do not let the sun go down while you are still angry, and do not give the devil a foothold. He who has been stealing must steal no longer, but must work, doing something useful with his own hands, that he may have something to share with those in need."

The NIV text note says this: "Christians do not lose their emotions at conversion, but their emotions should be purified. Some anger is sinful, some is not. 'Do not let the sun go down' [meaning], No anger is to outlast the day."

Your righteous anger against injustice done and mercilessness shown to other human beings made in the image of Christ is itself God given.

You can read between Paul's lines and see that he himself was justifiably angry that some people in the church at Ephesus were stealing from other people when they should be working to support themselves and people who are truly in need. If Paul had not expressed his anger, and had not given the members at Ephesus permission to express their anger, at this injustice, but had just nursed it ("let the sun go down" on it) and let it turn into resentment and animosity, THEN it would become sin.

Thank God He has given you this sensitivity to be able to express righteous anger at the suffering of others.

Sharing solid spiritual food from Paul,

Jude
Lynn W
Posted on Thursday, February 03, 2000 - 9:09 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wendy, I hope you don't mind, I've asked some friends to pray for this by private e-mail. Here's what one wrote me in response.

Lynn,
Steve [husband] and I were talking about what is going on with Wendy and he says she should go to SDA leadership and let them know what is going on, it doesn't sound right that the pastor is counseling him in that way and I'm sure leadership would want to know if something was going on that was misrepresentation of their doctrine and beliefs. Alot of times the head people aren't even aware of such things going on! (sadly)
Mel
Wendy
Posted on Thursday, February 03, 2000 - 5:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Lynn W,
Thanks for your prayers and support. What a blessing to know that there is support in Gods family and that others care.
To respond to Steve's suggestion that I go to the church leadership, I tried that this summer when Tom first told me about his affair. I called the church and spoke to one of the deacons. He told me that they would speak with Tom and the Pastor. Nobody ever contacted me again until I called the Pastor at his home. That went nowhere.
I believe that the best and only answer to this situation is PRAYER.
Thankyou ALL, again for your thoughts and prayers. I'm never going to give up on Tom, even if he decides not to stay married to me.
I know that Jesus is always with me and that gives me peace.
Yours in Christ,
Wendy
Jude the Obscure
Posted on Thursday, February 03, 2000 - 7:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wendy, Go to the pastor's conference president. -Jude
Lynn W
Posted on Friday, February 04, 2000 - 12:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"I believe that the best and only answer to this situation is PRAYER."
No truer words have ever been spoken.

For this request & others, if you're all like me you make a well-intended mental note to pray for a request, later during our extended time of prayer. But let's all get in the habit of stopping right there & praying when we read it. I may be only preaching to myself, but there's the reminder.
Sondra
Posted on Sunday, February 13, 2000 - 10:14 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wendy,

I have not been able to reach you but checking out the prayer requests, there you were! I am not surprised at this turn of events with regard to Tom as it looked bad six months ago! But just remember to stand back and watch God work! It is not us who changes things but HIM and His timing! How that is difficult to believe on a daily basis and do we do anything besides praying?

I tend to agree with Jude that you need to inform the hierarchy of the conference in your area and then the general conference. From what you told us in the past, that particular pastor makes up his rules NOT according to the SDA church policy! You are so faithful and precious to God in this situation. I do believe in allowing God to do what he wants with your life. You cannot stop Tom from divorcing you and this may be God's will. God takes us down some pretty painful roads in life and we don't know how He can turn this situation around. We do know that whatever mess we find ourselves in God can turn it into good...but we have to let Him. You are not choosing to divorce Tom and that is clear! You have been praying and fighting for his soul and your marriage for a long time...don't give up! But surround yourself with godly people from your church...you need born-again girlfriends who walk the Biblical principles and don't bail on them when the going gets tough. Get into a prayer group and ask God for a miracle! Be bold in prayer and consistent! I am soooo sorry this is happening. I love you in the Lord! A sister...Sondra.
Wendy
Posted on Sunday, February 13, 2000 - 10:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sondra,
What a blessing to hear from you. I returned your call as soon as I got the message.
Thank you for your prayer and support. You will never know how much you have helped me in these past few months. I am so grateful for the information that I have gained from these web sites and the literature that has been sent to me. I pray that one day I will be responding on the answered prayer page in regard to Tom. Until then, I'll just keep looking up!
Yours in Christ,
Wendy
Louise S
Posted on Tuesday, February 15, 2000 - 11:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Please pray for my husband & me. I've been ready to leave SDA Church since Sept. but seeking God's guidance in how & when to leave. I'm working on resignation letter. I believe time is NOW, but want assurance of that & more guidance regarding letter. Husband not ready to leave yet.
Jude the Obscure
Posted on Wednesday, February 16, 2000 - 10:10 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dear Louise,

Thanks so much for sharing. Yes, I will pray for you and your husband that you will receive both guidance and comfort from the Holy Spirit every step of the way.

Remember Moses. I am going to paraphrase a bit from his story in Hebrews 11:24-27 (NIV):

"By faith Louise, when she had grown up spiritually, refused to be known as a daughter of Ellen G. White. She chose to be mistreated along with the people of God rather than to enjoy the pleasures of hypocrisy for a short time. She regarded disgrace for the sake of Christ as of greater value than the social acceptance of Adventism, because she was looking ahead to her reward. By faith she left the SDA church, not fearing their anger: she persevered because she saw Him who is invisible."

Grace and peace to you and your husband,

Jude
Lydell
Posted on Wednesday, February 16, 2000 - 11:18 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Father God, we stand together with our new friend Louise in the situation she is facing. Lord we know that only you can see into her husbands mind to know the root reason that he is balking at listening to truth. Only you can uncover that root and deal with it so that he can move into the light of your freedom. Father, invade his ever waking moment with unrest over the contradictions with the Bible of those things being taught in his church. Stir him up so that he can no longer ignore the error.

We pray for this couple right now that they will be brought into unity in this decision. That Louise's mind will be open to your promptings of what exactly she needs to say to her husband and when. And we pray for her complete peace in following through on your decision of what she is to do at this time.

Father, we also pray that you would begin bringing into their lives right now those Christians who can help them in their journey into your truth. Stir these folks to take the first steps in reaching out to Louise and her husband that their journey may be shortened. And Father we thank you that you have never abandoned your children to struggle in solitude with spiritual problems. You have promised to supply all our needs, and we thank you for supplying spiritual fellowship for this couple. Amen.
Lynn W
Posted on Wednesday, February 16, 2000 - 11:30 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Louise, welcome. I will be in prayer for this situation as well that you will find a good Biblical fellowship where you can grow in the Word.

I have a rather strange situation in need of prayer. Our totally non-denominational, non-prophet, disorganized religion type church has some SDA who come regularly, but their loyalty is to the local SDA church & EGW. They've been infiltrating & inviting people to their church & home Bible study where they teach (surprise) Daniel.

My husband & his brother are both in the choir & have both considered quitting if the ringleader joins which she seems to be planning to do. All our pastors are in complete agreement that SDA is a cult, but the worship leader sees nothing wrong with having SDAs on the worship team. In fact he thinks it's a place where he can reach her with the gospel. He says he thinks she's "coming around," but when asked directly, she makes it clear she has not budged one inch away from EGW & SDA. She's been in our church for several years, so it's obvious she has no intentions of changing her views.

If he quits, my husband has said he will probably quit attending the Sat. night service which she is part of. Sunday's safe of course, she would never set foot in our church on Sunday. We all prefer the Sat. service & don't want to quit. More importantly, I believe the pastors need to take a consistant stand against cults, and the congregation needs to know the truth.

On the one hand, this could be good, for if the guys quit, people will certainly ask us about it & we'll then have opportunity to start educating more people. On the other hand, we will be seen as divisive & intolerant and it could put people in a position of feeling they have to chose sides. I'm afraid it will become more of a popularity contest than a test of right vs. wrong. Everyone thinks the world of her & she's been "discipling" people in our church.

First, what do you all think about this? Is the worship team a position of leadership where they should be held to a higher standard? Or is it an appropriate channel through which to try to evangelize the lost? (It's not uncommon for our worship leader to put brand new born-again-yesterday Christians on the team.) He's extremely popular. He loves everyone & everyone loves him, including my husband, his brother, & myself. He just can't stand confrontation. It's important to him that everyone feels welcome and accepted. I don't want to go against him by any means.

Secondly, we need prayer that God will either show us where we're wrong & convict us if we're just plain being intolerant, or show the pastors that they need to be intolerant of what my husband calls "enemies of the gospel." We've already had many meetings on this subject, & the worship pastor has seen the video & is in complete agreement of it, so it's not a matter of lack of education.
Lynn W
Posted on Wednesday, February 16, 2000 - 11:54 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Another praise/prayer situation.

My friend Karen who's involved in prison ministry recently met an Adventist who was once in prison. He goes to the prison weekly to teach a class on (surprise) prophecy. He's also been working with her pastor who's Assembly of God. We got to comparing notes, & it turns out, he's a guy we've been praying for & sharing with for years. Now it's their turn. She's the one I gave the video to. I'm praying the pastor will soon share it with the Adventist and of course, that he will regain his senses & go back to his AG roots.

God is in control.

P.S. Karen, hope to see you on here, soon. Don't be shy.
Jude the Obscure
Posted on Wednesday, February 16, 2000 - 12:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dear Lynn,

Speaking only for myself, I would not quit any spiritual function, such as choir, for the reasons you're considering. That is a negative action. Consider the following:

I know from your posts that you are a competent Bible student and that you have developed a specialty in showing where SDA doctrines fall short of the gospel.

Why not ask your pastor to let your church offer a course comparing SDA doctrines with the gospel? Perhaps you and your husband could "team teach" it. It could be held during the "Sunday school" time slot, thus maximizing attendance.

What do you think?

Jude

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