| Author | Message | ||
| Doctortazz |
"Thank you Patti & Susan, I needed that. I really appreciate you both. Lately, I'm taking more heat from within than without." Taking heat? There has been no heat! You are not being persecuted on this message board! But you are being insulting, high-minded, and preachy. All of you! You too, Jude. Your belief that Seventh-day Adventist theology is antithetical to the Gospel is not only insulting, it is also silly and uninformed. And Jude, I don't live on this message board. You don't have to bombard me with a zillion and a half questions. I do have a life, and I need to get back to it. You are not bringing up anything new when you talk about Col 2:13 - 19. Seventh-day Adventists have written about it extensively, and if you care to understand the position of Adventists, you shouldn't have much trouble finding it. Anyway, I've got to go. You can talk among yourselves now. | ||
| Susan |
Dr.tazz, I am truly sorry for the anger and animosity that you're experiencing. I don't think anyone here has tried to personally attack you. We've all just responded to your questions and had some of our own. Why did you ask us things and then freak out over our answers? I for one will defend my faith in Jesus Christ alone until the day I die. I don't push it on people but if asked and challenged, I will defend my faith with all I've got. If you've found the peace and fullfillment of your heart's desire in adventism, than that is great for you! But why slam us for our beliefs? Does it threaten you in some way, that we've made really valid points? Are you so defensive because your belief system is proving to be faulty and unbiblical? If you have confidence and assurance of your salvation while being adventist, why are you so curious about all of us? I will be praying for you and hoping that you will continue to visit us. I believe that the Holy Spirit is nudging you. When confronted with the awesome TRUTH of Jesus Christ, many people become angry and run. The gospel is funny that way. But many people reach up and embrace the hand of almighty God, that reaches down to lift us up from the depths of sin. You see, we are unable to play a part (ANY PART) in our salvation. That is the finished work of Jesus at calvary. May God richly bless you as you seek to find answers to your questions. | ||
| Plain Patti |
I was waiting for the other shoe to fall. Doc: But you are being insulting, high-minded, and preachy. All of you! You too, Jude. Your belief that Seventh-day Adventist theology is antithetical to the Gospel is not only insulting, it is also silly and uninformed. Patti: Has anyone else here had the same experience that I have? I have yet to find an SDA who can discuss things calmly with me, the apostate, without resorting to accusations and name-calling. I was just called a "spiritual harlot" on another forum. I have been called Jezebel, Potiphar's wife, satanic, stupid, ignorant, lacking intelligence, spiritually bankrupt. I have been told that I just did not understand the Bible, that I loved to wallow in my sins, that I flaunt my sins in the face of Christ, that I am lost--I should write a book!--all in the name of "faith that works in love." Not just SDAs, btw, but anyone who believes that (s)he must earn at least a part of his/her salvation. I do not call names in return, but I do ask them how they can degrade and condemn their fellow believer in the name of "faith working in love" which only leads to more insults and condemnations. What to do? Do we just leave them to their own ideas that they are the remnant, that they alone are worthy of God's favor? Do we keep trying to present the merits of Christ and just keep wiping the mud out of our eyes? At what point do you shake the dust off and walk away? God has given us a wonderful medium (the internet) for witnessing to hundreds of people at a time. Should we not try to reach our former peers? I know we are supposed to forgive over and over again, but it truly bothers me when they downplay the work of Christ for us, overshadowing it with the work of Christ in us. It truly bothers me when they relegate justification as "mere" forgiveness, or the vicarious righteousness of Christ as the "milk" of the Gospel--the "meat" of the Gospel being our own sanctification. Can you share some ideas with me? Or am I the only one with such rebellious thoughts? God bless. Patti | ||
| Jude the Obscure |
Dr. Tazz, Jesus said, "By their fruits ye shall know them." What do you think that means? Jude | ||
| Jude the Obscure |
Patti, Lynn, Susan, Colleen, Bruce and others I may have missed: Now we know what Paul must have felt like when the Judaizing Christians from Jerusalem attacked the churches that he had begun in Rome, Corinth, Galatia, Ephesus, Philippi, Colosse, and Thessalonica! But Jesus said, "Blessed are ye when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you." Matthew 5:11,12. You are His sheep. Did you hear His voice? He said, "Rejoice!" Why? "For great is your reward in heaven." And where is heaven? "The kingdom of God [heaven] is within you," Luke 17:20,21. And so our reward is to keep our tempers and keep our peace, because we have "the peace that passeth understanding." I'm so proud of you all for having done this in the face of Dr. Tazz's relentless attack. Pray for him, Jude | ||
| Ernie |
Cas: Thanks for your comments on my response to Dr. Tazz. Regarding to your question about some historical documents on the history of the Sabbath and Sunday, check www.ccel.wheaton.edu. They have the writings of the Apostolic Fathers and you would be able to see the position of those who lived close to the Apostles, and in some instances were disciples of the Apostles, on the 7th Day Sabbath. Read the Letter of Ignatius to the Magnesians (c. 107 AD), ch. 9. Read the 1st Apology of Justin Martyr (c. 150 AD), ch. 65. The Epistle of Pseudo-Barnabas (c. 70 AD), Ch. 8 is another source of historical evidence of an early observance of Sunday as a day of worship within the Gentile Christian Church. Of course reading Col. 2:8-18; Rom. 14; the entire letter of Galatians, 2 Cor. 3 and the letter of Hebrews will take you a deep understanding of the theology behind the change. If you want, contact Dale Ratzlaff (www.ratzlaf. com) and get his book Sabbath in Crisis; it is the best I have read on the subject without being too scholar or boring. May God bless you richly, Ernie | ||
| Ernie |
Dr. Tazz: I am sorry some of our answers offended you. However, the truth of the matter continue to be the same, Adventism is founded on deception, and has through its theological system hidden the greatest of all the Gospel truths: Christ has come to make us free from the observance of the Old Covenant Law. I know it is hard to swallow, but that's the Lord's message in the New Testament. It will take time to sink in, but one day you will see these glorious truths in their full glory. By the way, Dr. Tazz, do not get upset with us, theology and doctrine tend to be passionate. However, we love you and pray for God's light upon your life. In His wonderful Light, Ernie |
