| Author | Message | ||
| Lori |
I need you guys to help me answer these questions that a friend of mine sent me. She has been worshipping on Sundays, but has that nagging guilt that remains and these verses have been difficult for her, as I have battled with these verses myself, I'm asking for your thoughts as well, before I respond: Her questions/comments are as follows: Genesis 2:3 says, "And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all His work which God created and made." Help me understand if I am intertwining this verse with something I have been taught ... or was the sabbath made holy then? God blessed the animals and mankind to be fruitful and multiply. And, He said that they were very good. Bless means "to make holy; to ask divine favor for; to make happy; to praise." Sanctify "to set apart as holy; consecrate, to make free from sin." Holy "dedicated to religeous use; sacred; spiritually pure and sinless; deserving reverence or adoration." Sacred "consecrated to a god or God; ..." Comments please!!!! | ||
| Lynn W |
God did bless the 7th day and sanctified it. But don't stop reading there. Read the New Testament as well. That's where you'll find Jesus Christ. That's where you'll find the Gospel. And that's where you'll find, as Paul Harvey would say, "the rest of the story." | ||
| Plain Patti |
Dear Lori, There is one thing that we former SDAs often overlook in Genesis...or shall I say there is one thing that SDAs have added to the interpretation of this passage that is not there. When God ceased His labors and rested on the seventh day, He blessed THAT day. There is nothing to say that He went back to work on the next day. There is nothing to say that He set the weekly cycle or sabbath in motion in these verses. There is no indication that He commanded Adam and Eve to rest also. His work was finished, and He blessed the day--THAT day--in which all His work was done. There is no command for man to observe the seventh day sabbath until Exodus 16. And then it is not given as a memorial to creation, but merely as a day of rest; a day in which there would be no manna to gather. | ||
| Plain Patti |
Also, here is a comment on Hebrews 4, in case that comes up in your conversation, which it often will if the person with which you are conversing is well-versed scripturally: Hebrews 4:9 There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest* for the people of God;(NIV) The only appearance of this particular word* in the entire Bible is in Hebrews 4:9, and it is not given in verb form. From the KJV New Testament Greek Lexicon: Original Word: sabbatismovž Word Origin: from a derivative of (4521) Transliterated Word: Sabbatismos TDNT Entry: 7:34,989 Phonetic Spelling : sab-bat-is-mos' Parts of Speech: Noun Masculine Definition 1. a keeping sabbath 2. the blessed rest from toils and troubles looked for in the age to come by the true worshippers of God and true Christians I had a discussion with Dr. Bacchiocchi about this at one time. He maintained that the word meant "sabbath-keeping" and tried to prove that the sabbath commandment was still binding. The word sabbitismos, however, is a noun, not a verb. The literal translation is a "keeping sabbath," a perennial rest from our labors. It is not something we do (i.e. it is not a verb), although I can see why a lawmonger would interpret it as such; it is something (i.e. noun) that we are given in Jesus Christ: the blessed rest from toils and troubles looked for in the age to come by the true worshippers of God and true Christians. The entire them of the Book of Hebrews is the superiority of Jesus Christ to anything that preceded Him. Hebrews 1:1-3 Christ is superior to the prophets. Hebrews 1:4 Christ is superior to the angels Hebrews 3 Christ is superior to Moses Hebrews 4 Christ is superior to Joshua Hebrews 5 Christ is superior to the Aaronic priests Hebrews 6 In Christ lies our hope Hebrews 7 The work of Christ is superior to the work of the Aaronic high priest Hebrews 8 The heavenly sanctuary (Christ) is superior to the earthly Hebrews 9 The Messianic covenant is superior to the first covenant Hebrews 10 Forgiveness in Christ is superior to forgiveness by sacrifice Hebrews 11 Faith in Christ is superior to works Hebrews 12 Summary--Christ is the fulfillment of all things and Author and perfect Finisher of our faith In the light of this, let's take another look at that text: Hebrews 4:9 So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God.(RSV) This noun sabbitismos which is found nowhere in the Bible except in this one verse of Hebrews 4, follows in the same line as the rest of the book of Hebrews. It is a superlative, showing that this is a different kind of rest, both from the weekly sabbath and from the rest that God gave the children of Israel under the leadership of Joshua. More evidence that this sabbatismos does not refer to the weekly sabbath is found in preceding verses: Hebrews 4:4 For somewhere he has spoken about the seventh day in these words: "And on the seventh day God rested from all his work." 5 And again in the passage above he says, "They shall never enter my rest." 6 It still remains that some will enter that rest, and those who formerly had the gospel preached to them did not go in, because of their disobedience. (or disbelief) 7 Therefore God again set a certain day, calling it Today, when a long time later he spoke through David God set aside a different day--this is in contrast to verse 4 that mentions the weekly sabbath--calling it Today. Today is the day that God wants us to enter His rest. 9. There remains, therefore, a rest. Since God has set aside a rest for his people, and, in the previous verses it is clear that it is neither the Sabbath nor the Canaan rest, a rest remains for the people of God. The sabbath and the Canaan rest were only types (shadows, if you will) of the sabbatismos that we find in Jesus Christ. 10. For he that is entered into his rest. When God rested on the Sabbath, the type of the true rest, his works ceased. So when our rest comes, our efforts to gain salvation by the work of our own hands will cease. 11. Let us labor therefore. Since this glorious rest, our sabbatismos in Christ, remains for faithful believers, we should make every effort to achieve it, and especially take heed that we do not fail through disbelief as our spiritual ancestors did. So it becomes very clear that the theme of Hebrews holds true for chapters 3 and 4. Just as Christ is found superior to all other things in the rest of the book, so in this passage, our rest from our labors to save ourselves in Jesus Christ is SUPERIOR to the weekly sabbath and to the rest that God gave the children of Israel under Joshua, and we must make every effort to "enter into His rest." | ||
| Plain Patti |
And don't forget Colossians 2:16, 17 16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ. and Romans 14:6, 7 5 One man considers one day more sacred than another; another man considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. 6 He who regards one day as special, does so to the Lord. He who eats meat, eats to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who abstains, does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God. I do not think I need to add to Paul's very concise words here.... | ||
| Plain Patti |
GOD MADE THE ISRAELITES BREAK THE SABBATH! Remember the story of Jericho? The children of Israel entered the promised land to find the promised rest. Obviously this rest does not refer to the weekly sabbath because one of the first things the children of Israel did upon entering Canaan is to "break" the weekly sabbath rest. They marched around the city of Jericho, as commanded, for seven days straight. One time around the first day, twice on the second, three on the third, etc. until the seventh day when they marched around seven times. Now we are not told what day of the week they actually began marching. Suppose they began on the first day of the week. That would place their marching 7 times and actual siege of the city on the sabbath day. No matter on which day they started their campaign, they were marching around Jericho on a sabbath day! It seems that God must have rescinded His own law for that single day. Or perhaps we are totally misguided as to God's meaning and purpose of sabbath rest for the Israelites. | ||
| BRUCE H |
Patti Here is another one. Matt 12:1-5 1 ¸ At that time Jesus went through the grainfields on the Sabbath. And His disciples were hungry, and began to pluck heads of grain and to eat. 2 And when the Pharisees saw it, they said to Him, "Look, Your disciples are doing what is not lawful to do on the Sabbath!" 3 But He said to them, "Have you not read what David did when he was hungry, he and those who were with him: 4 "how he entered the house of God and ate the showbread which was not lawful for him to eat, nor for those who were with him, but only for the priests? 5 "Or have you not read in the law that on the Sabbath the priests in the temple profane the Sabbath, and are blameless? Jesus is not saying that it is OK for David and his men to eat the showbread, BUT ONLY THE PRIEST IN THE TEMPLE. Or have you not read in the Law that on the sabbath the priest in the Temple profane the Sabbath, and are blameless Profane= 1)Treat with irreverence 2) Not concerned with religion 3) serving to debase what is holy. Now who are we???????? Rev 1:5-6 5 and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler over the kings of the earth. To Him who loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood, 6 and has made us kings and PRIESTS to His God and Father, to Him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen. 1 Peter 2:5 5 you also, as living stones, are being built up a spiritual house, a holy PRIESTHOOD, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. SO WE ARE PRIESTS IN A HOLY PRIESTHOOD. Bruce Heinrich BH | ||
| Bruce H |
Patti Here is another one. Rom 7:3-4 3 So then if, while her husband lives, she marries another man, she will be called an adulteress; but if her husband dies, she is free from that law, so that she is no adulteress, though she has married another man. 4 Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another--to Him who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to God. Now it say married to another, well what were we married to in the first place? THE LAW. So we died to the Law to be married to another, who is that, Jesus.... So what would it be called if you go back to your old spouse the LAW??? Adultery. So if in your adultery with the Law you have children and teach them the Law, what will happen. Deut 23:2 2 "One of illegitimate birth shall not enter the assembly of the LORD; even to the tenth generation none of his descendants shall enter the assembly of the LORD. So the Adults who commited Adultery can go into the assembly of the Lord, but their children ARE NOT PERMITTED TO ENTER THE ASSEMBLY OF THE LORD to the TENTH GENERATION???? So let us look at these texts. If we are in christ and we Go back to the law are we still saved??? Yes (Rom 8:1). But what about our children??? Is this what God is trying to teach us that the Law is for Jesus and Jesus alone. Bruse Heinrich BH . | ||
| Plain Patti |
Great analogy, Bruse. May I improvise on that theme? I was musing on the words of Luther one evening and started thinking about what grace has meant to me. The closest thing I can compare it to in a temporal sense is the difference between being in a good marriage and a bad one. Have any of you ever been in a bad marriage? No need to answer, of course. I do not believe that there is any situation under heaven more insidiously debasing than living with someone who is supposed to love you supremely, but who treats you as dirt under their feet by lying to you, mistreating you, abusing you, being unfaithful to you. I think that possibly the lowest self-esteem an adult can have is the result of a bad marriage. Let us speak in parables now. Suppose you are married to someone who you love dearly. You are devoted to this person beyond any devotion that you have ever experienced. You try to please him/her. You do special things for him/her so that (s)he will be happy. At first, everything is bliss. You are quite certain that you little acts of love are striking their target directly in the heart, and you are happy and fulfilled. Soon, much too soon for you, the honeymoon is over. Your soulmate starts finding fault with you, getting angry at you for no real reason. (S)he no longer affirms your love by responding to it. On the contrary, nothing you do seems to be good enough. So, you do what every human would do. You try harder. You work even harder to keep the house neat, keep the yard work done, make a good living, spend extra time/money with him/her. But it seems the harder you work, the less your spouse likes you. You try to change things about yourself that you know your spouse doesn't like. You lose weight, you color your hair, you stop working late hours, you turn off the TV and try to have romantic time with him/her. But no matter what you do, it isn't enough. You are lost and frustrated. You lash out at him/her. You are called all kinds of names for your reactions. You scream and cry. (S)he laughs at your hysteria, slaps you, calls you crazy, and walks out the door, only to come home hours and hours later with tousled hair and a foreign cologne on his/her clothing. The phone begins to ring at all hours of the day or night. A strange person calls and asks if your mate is home. When you ask who it is, (s)he hangs up. You ask your spouse about it; (s)he says you are imagining things. Your spouse says (s)he has been called out of town on business. You mollify yourself and decide to take yourself out to dinner. There you see your spouse dancing in the arms of another person. Angrily you confront your spouse when (s)he finally comes home the next morning, only to be cursed and told you are crazy. You persist; you are struck and kicked several times. (S)he calls help and throws you out of the house and locks the door. You are in so much shock that you actually believe that you are to blame, so the next day you come back to the house and beg forgiveness only to have him/her lock and bar the doors and call the police on you. You cannot imagine how this could happen. How could you love someone so much who treats you so badly? Have you figured out where I am going with this yet? When we are married to the law, we are in a bad marriage. The law will never do anything but mock, berate, condemn, and eventually destroy us. The law tells us that we are not worthy of it. What do we do then? Why, we try harder, of course. The law, then, only beats us harder, demanding more and more. The harder we try, the more abusive the law becomes. What should we do? We must divorce the law. Let me continue my parable: You came to the end of your rope. There was no choice but to remove yourself from this awful marriage and try to pick up the pieces. You divorce this abusive spouse. There comes a new Person into your life. One that loves you much more than you could ever understand. And because you don't understand, because you don't know what being loved feels like, you have a hard time believing that it is true. This person not only tries to make you happy, (s)he also makes excuses for your shortcomings. (S)he helps you with responsibilities that you have failed to carry out without chastising you or throwing guilt on you. (S)he comforts you when you disappoint yourself, (s)he never notices when you fail to give him/her the attention (s)he deserves. (S)he laughs and kisses you when you say that you cannot understand why (s)he is so good to you. (S)he is always near, touching you, caressing you, taking burdens off of your shoulders. When you ask why (s)he loves you, (s)he says, Because you are mine. Although you revel in his/her company, roll in his/her kindnesses to you, it is still very difficult for you to understand why (s)he would love you the way (s)he does. (S)he says, It is OK. You do not have to understand why. You just need to believe that I do. Not for MY sake, but for your own. This person marries you without any regard for your past. (S)he does not care that you have failed at marriage or at life many times over. (S)he loves you no matter what you have done or will do. At first you feel awkward and selfish to be the obviously undeserving recipient of such powerful love. You feel like you must respond with some sort of love gift in order to maintain this love relationship. But the love coming from your spouse is so overwhelming that you know that nothing you do would influence it one way or the other. So what do you do? You try to show your spouse with your kindness and deeds that you love him/her also, but everything you do seems so small and insignificant in relation to the love that your lover has shown to you. This is very much like the Gospel. Jesus Christ marries Himself to His people regardless of their inward conditions. He knows that there is no way they can comprehend His great saving love; He merely asks them to believe. His commitment to His children is total--even to the death of the cross. He asks nothing of them in return except to accept and believe that He has paid the full price of their redemption. Oddly enough, there are those who choose to stay married to the law. And they loudly and openly condemn those who have removed themselves from a painful relationship. They boast of their fidelity to an abusive spouse. The problem is that, just as in marital love, some people believe that love for something is generated by the thing being loved. Thus the saying, I love him because he is ...(wonderful, kind, loving, etc.), is not an accurate representation of the source of love. Love springs from the heart of the lover. You love something because of what is in you, not because of what is in the object of your affection. Therefore, quite honest, kind and loving people can love the most selfish, vile, and corrupt people and things. People love the law not because of what the law is--a mean schoolmaster--but for what they are, or want to be, inside. They want to be pure and holy, and they believe that the law shows them how to become pure and holy. On the contrary, the law is an abusive spouse that constantly points out our faults and shortcomings to us. Jesus, in stark contrast, loved us before we existed. He loves us not because of what we are, but because of what He is. We cannot begin to fathom that kind of love, all we can do is accept it by faith. And we can know that, since this love is based upon what He is, and not upon what we are, it will not be taken away from us. But there is a problem here: You cannot be a bigamist. You cannot be married both to the law and to Christ. If you are married to the law, you must divorce yourself from it before you can become married to Christ. And if you are married to Christ, you divorce Him if you choose to return to the law. Bad marriage/good marriage. Why would anyone stay in a bad marriage if they had a choice in the matter? The Good News is that in Jesus Christ we can divorce that abusive spouse and can experience the wonder, the joy, the security, and the confidence of being truly loved, truly married to One Whose love has no bounds. | ||
| Maryann |
Patti, Patti, how far did you have to dig for that one? It was GOLD. THANK YOU, THANK YOU! At Mom's insistance, I just listened to a 2 hour call in with Jack Blanco of the cLEAR wORD bIBLE on 3ABN and tried to get on. Guess what? They didn't let me on. To bad, I had a couple good questions. I'm so glad you are back, thank you..Maryann | ||
| Bruce H |
Wow Amen!!!! Amen!!! Amen!!! Amen!!! | ||
| Jude the Obscure |
Excellent, Patti. More! | ||
| Lori |
Thanks so much for your comments!!! I was wanting you to link it to Hebrews!!! I also found a very good article pertaining to this subject on Jack Gents site! He made the point of the 'unending day' and that Adam and Eve were given only one rule!! Not to eat of the Tree of knowlegde of Good and Evil as long as they obeyed they would live in eternal rest with God. Thank you!!!! I will forward your comments to my friend!! I know that God will bless her with understanding!! | ||
| Lynn W |
And don't forget Gal 4:9-10 "But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?" And what are these beggarly elements? Verse 10: "Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years." Gal 4:22-29 22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman. 23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise. 24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai [10C], which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar. 25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children. 26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all. 27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband. 28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise [grace]. 29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now. 30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman. 31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free. | ||
| Colleentinker |
Patti--That was wonderful! You explained it so clearly. Clay Peck, the pastor of Grace Place (He was fired from the Colorado Conference in 1997) calls trying to live both under law and under grace "spiritual adultery". You can't do both the law and the New Covenant. Thank you for that wonderful explanation! | ||
| Bruce H |
Lori here is a new one. I went into LA and asked a Jewish Rabbi, when was the sabbath given. He told me it was given at Mount Siani. I then asked well what about at creation Gen 2:2-3 2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made. was it not given at creation on the seventh day. He said no, for two reasons. Reason number one God did not give adam or man commandment or the command to keep it at creation, you cannot find a command anywhere in Genisis (at creation that is) it is not one of the 613 commandments, nor found in the Torah. Reason number two the days of creation were broken or seperated from sunrise to sunrise not sunset to sunset. I did not understand this so he showed me. Look at RSV Genesis 1: 1-5 1 ¸ In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was without form and void, and darkness was upon the face of the deep; and the Spirit of God was moving over the face of the waters. 3 ¸ And God said, "Let there be light"; and there was light. 4 And God saw that the light was good; and God separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, one day. this is what God created on the first day because a Day is 24 hours. When you get to verse 5 it states "And God called the light day, and the darkness He called night. And there was evening and there was mourning, one day". It say the same thing at the end of all the other days except the seventh day. Well he said you have 24 hrs in a day. Well the text says, (AND THERE WAS evening and and there was mourning), he said this is just 12 hours were did the other 12 hours go. The Hebrew word for evening is {EREB} and it means at dusk or the preparation time for the sabbath just before the sun goes down. The word mourning in Hebrew boqer {bo'-ker} means Breaking of light or end of night. He told me this is how it happened. In versus 1 through 4 this was the first 12 hours of the day and God created light and divided the light from darkness. Then in verse 5 it says AND THERE WAS evening and there was mourning, or the last 12 hours of the day. So this is How God created, first he created Light (1st 12hrs), and then there was evening and there was mourning, or broker or break of day (last 12hrs), day one. Then he created the firmament (1st 12hrs), and then there was evening and there was mourning, or broker or break of day, (last 12hrs), day two. Then he created Land (1st 12hrs), and then there was evening and there was mourning, or broker or break of day, (last 12hrs), day three. etc.etc. Thus the days of creation were seperated from sunrise to sunrise and not like the Sabbath at Siani which was from sunset to sunset. God was doing his work during the first 12 hours, then the Bible says AND there was eveing and mourning, one day. So God created then there came the evening and then the mourning and so the first day or 24 hrs. I have found several bible commentaries that comment on this point. Bruce Heinrich bh | ||
| Jude the Obscure |
Wow, Bruce, That's amazing. I can't find anything about it in the NIV textnotes for Genesis 1. Could you share more info from some of the Bible commentaries you've consulted? See you at church tonight, Jude | ||
| Lori |
Bruce, After reading what you posted,....about a dozen times, I finally caught on !!!!! What an interesting detail!!!! It certainly blows away the concept of the Sabbath being conceived at creation. Thanks! Lori | ||
| Bruce H |
Lori You may have heard this one. Most Adventist do not understand the covenants. I was a Adventist for 39 years and did not understand that there is an old covenant and a new covenant. I was told by Adventist that they are blended but they are not. Adventist will tell you that the Sabbath was given in the Garden of eden at creation, well let us look at the fourth commandment. EXODUS 20:8,9 8 "Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. Well let us see what God wrote with his finger, (you shall do no work...nor your male servant), So Adam had servants and beasts of burden and look at that last one. Strangers who are within your gate. Wow in God's perfect creation before the fall of man, you had gates and slaves. No the Ten Commandments or the Old Covenant were given at Mount Sinai. Deut 5:1-3 1 ¸ And Moses called all Israel, and said to them: "Hear, O Israel, the statutes and judgments which I speak in your hearing today, that you may learn them and be careful to observe them. 2 "The LORD our God made a covenant with us in Horeb. 3 "The LORD did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us, those who are here today, all of us who are alive. So the Covenant at Horeb was not given to the fathers. Deuteronomy 4:10-13 10 "especially concerning the day you stood before the LORD your God in Horeb (Sinai), when the LORD said to me, `Gather the people to Me, and I will let them hear My words, that they may learn to fear Me all the days they live on the earth, and that they may teach their children.' 11 "Then you came near and stood at the foot of the mountain, and the mountain burned with fire to the midst of heaven, with darkness, cloud, and thick darkness. 12 "And the LORD spoke to you out of the midst of the fire. You heard the sound of the words, but saw no form; you only heard a voice. 13 "So He declared to you His covenant which He commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He wrote them on two tablets of stone. So the Covenant at Horeb is the Ten Commandments with the fourth Commandment right in the middle. Rom 5:12-14 12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned-- 13 (For until the law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law. 14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those who had not sinned according to the likeness of the transgression of Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come. For until the law (that is because the law was given at Sinai), in other word this says until the Ten Commandments given at Mt Sinai sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses. Why Adam to Moses because this is the Time that there was no law because the Law with the Ten commandments were given at Mt Sinai. Rom 3: 16-17 16 Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, "And to seeds," as of many, but as of one, "And to your Seed," who is Christ. 17 And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. So the Law which was 430 years After Abraham. this confirms Deut 5:1-3. Gal 3:19 19 ¸ What purpose then does the law serve? It was ADDED because of transgressions, TILL the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. So the Law or Ten commandments were added (added = Joined to something else so as to increase in amount, find a sum, total) So the old covenant was given at Sinai and was the Ten Commandments written on stone. And it was not given to Adam at creation or Abraham and Jacob and the rest, it was not given until Moses. Bruce Heinrich B | ||
| Maryann |
Bruce strikes again! That was good. I'll need to go over it some more to get the full impact of it though. Maryann |
