| Author | Message | ||
| Palorenz |
Everyone, Hello. Just found this site and like what I'm seeing. I'm a former SDA who left the denomination about 11 years ago. I'm in the Dallas, Texas area, so I'm quite far removed from a lot of you in California. My story is that God, over a period of of about a year let me see the error of Adventism and then broke me free completely from SDA bondage in Sept, 1989 at a meeting of former SDAs in Dallas. There's a question I've been curious about over the past decade. Never struggled with it, just curious: Who do you all say that EGW was? If I had hours, I could probably go to other SDA "awareness" site or research this site to find the answers. But since I don't have that kind of time, I'll just put this question out there. PSLORENZ | ||
| Steve |
Hi Palorenz, I've gone through quite a variety of feelings over EGW, as I'm sure many have. At first, when I heard of SDAism, I didn't give her much attention. Just before I joined and once I was in, I read many of her writings. My beliefs about her kind of evolved like this: 1. She was a Christian writer, who commented on Christianity and scripture. 2. She had some ideas that were not probably in line with good Biblical exegesis. She was a Christian who may have been misguided in some of her thinking. (This idea was probably based on my learning from Walter Martin.) 3. She had insights that she couldn't have gotten anywhere else. She was inspired. I came to this belief after joining and reading some things I hadn't really thought about before. It's amazing how "new" ideas can really grab you. 4. Not everything she wrote was of the same level. Some things were "definitely" from God, some things were from the times in which she lived. (I kind of used my idea of how we SDAs interpret Paul, on EGW.) 5. She was led to ideas from other writers. I came to this conclusion after reading The Life and Times of Jesus the Messiah, by Alfred Edersheim. I had always wanted to read that, but hadn't gotten around to it until a few years ago. I was absolutely amazed at some of the similarities between what he had written and what EGW had "written." 6. She stole. I started to understand this when I read parts of the White Lie, by Walter Rea. It was an eye-opener. But I thought I could put EGW on a shelf, because all my SDA theology was based on the Bible and the Bible alone. (Boy, did I have a lot to unlearn and learn.) 7. She was a mean-spirited, wealthy woman who had a worldly fortune to protect. I came to this conclusion after reading about her two literary assistants, Fannie Bolton and Marian Davis. I was amazed at the reactions these two women got from EGW when they pointed out simple, but serious problems in what they were involved with. 8. The angels that visited her, were probably not from God. When she claimed that "God" had held His hand over portions of visions, resulting in the DELIBERATE misleading of sincere seekers, I could no longer accept her as a Christian woman. She says that God is a deceiver. Well, if her God is a deceiver, then that could NOT be the God of the Bible. Our God is not a deceiver. There is one father of lies, Satan. And he is not our father. I'm still not at the end of my journey with EGW. There is still hidden EGW theology lurking in my mind. I'm thankful to be around some former SDAs who can help shed light on where my thinking is tainted by her in ways that do not agree with the Bible. Don't know if I've outlined my personal journey with EGW very well, but off the top of my head that seems to be the way I have viewed her, and the way I view her now. I also am curious to hear from others, and what their opinion of EGW has been/is. Remember what Elmer Fudd would say to all of this, "Wast one out, turn off the White." Steve | ||
| Colleentinker |
As our younger son says, "She was a false prophet." | ||
| Question |
Nice job Steve. I was run over by the SDA fire truck in 1977. I went to Union College to become a minister (gender slip), after two years I exited school discouraged. I dropped out of Church and have been back very little over the years. I still have friends and family members in that cultic movement. I could suggest several good web sites to help others figure out Adventism. www.ellenwhite.org This site does a great job with Ellen White but does a poor job dealing with some of her baggage like the Sabbath. www.get.to/the.truth The SDA-EGW Historical Society does a better job with the guilt (baggage) remaining after you leave the cult. This and the below sites understand and teach the correct meaning of the Sabbath unlike the site above. www.ex-sda.com also does a wonderful job detailing the faults of Adventism. www.bible.ca/7-plagiarism.htm is an awsome site detailing the effects of Ellen White within the system of Adventism. http://members.tripod.com/~Help_for_SDAs/index.html Is Janet Brown's web site and quite well done. Janet was an Adventist and does a nice job takling about Adventism. All of the above sites have a links section to give you even more references on the net. I could also suggest a powerful book on the cults called "Kingdom of the Cults" by Walter Martin available from any Christian book store or from the SDA-EGW Historical Society at 3298 Holdrege st, suite 100, Lincoln NE. 68503 for $20 including postage. Barnes and Nobel also sells this book for about $30. Take the time to read this book and you will understand the cults much better. | ||
| Jude the Obscure |
Hi Paul, The distillation of my experience with Ellen G. White is the following: 1. She was raised in a dysfunctional family and for that reason (not because she was knocked in the head with a rock) is the reason she led a dysfunctional life. 2. She never forgave the older girl who hit her with the rock nor the girl's family and spent the rest of her life "getting even" by vicariously pouring out the seven last plagues on anyone who disagreed with her theology. 3. She had a natural mystical gift for visions and dreams, but she did not allow the Holy Spirit to use her gift, and so therefore other forces moved in and used it. 4. She really did have an angel (muse?) of visions and dreams. But the angel made use of experiences she had and then "recycled" the material back to her in the form of visions and dreams. 5. She pirated the literary works of others, justified her robbery in the name of her angel, vilified anyone who attempted to point out her error. 6. She became wealthy by virtue of an army of book salespersons, both colporteurs and others, who sold her books to gullible people, such as my grandparents on both sides. 7. She lived out the remainder of her life in denial and unhappiness. All of which brings to mind a line from Shakespear's McBeth: "False lips doth conceal what the false heart doth know." Jude | ||
| pslorenz |
So, I see there definitely was a dark side to Camelot here. WOW!! I didn't realize. To be honest, I never really gave her much thought, of course, during these last ten years. Too busy with my new adventure in Christ. When I did think about who she "was", I assume she may have someone who may have had a real prophetic gift, but other people around her twisted all her "visions" into error. But, from what you all are saying, it was way worse than that. Paul | ||
| Jude the Obscure |
Hi Paul, You have to remember that this is my opinion only. It has taken me many years to arrive at it. And it is a conclusion I DID NOT WANT to reach. I had to drag myself kicking and screeming against every inch of evidence presented from Walter Rea, Ron Graybill, Ron Numbers, Fred Veltman, Des Ford, and many many others. Even those who backed her to the hilt -- such as her grandson, Arthur C. White, for many years head of the E.G.White Estate -- contributed to the demise of her false prophetic gift. She erred in moral principles -- basically literary theft -- and in false predictions. But worst of all, in my humble opinion, she pretended to ADD TO SCRIPTURE! This is the worst sin of all in my book. You'll notice I haven't attempted to go into proofs or "how I know" my opinion to be true. You need to satisfy yourself by your own criteria, you know. Blessings to you, Jude | ||
| Sherry |
It's so good to know I'm not alone anymore on all this. It was just this month my name came off the books, so this is all fresh pain for me. I still haven't made the final decision on Ellen. I'm leaning more toward she was false. I really want to get a hold of some of those old books she plagerized from (I do know that is a fact now). The story of Albion Ballinger was most encouraging to me, as I've questioned the 1844 for some time now. I think I cry almost every day because I am so saddened and part of me doesn't want to believe it is true either. Thank you for being here, group. | ||
| Sherry |
I should add that if anyone can help me locate some of those books, I would appreciate that greatly. | ||
| Jude the Obscure |
Sherry, Blessing God for your honest testimony. Good to have you here! In your quest for answers I would suggest that there are three things that stand out: 1. Grace 2. Grace 3. Grace And more grace to you, Jude | ||
| Colleentinker |
Sherry, I so understand your daily crying, (to borrow syntax from my 9th graders!) I remember how emotionally unstable I felt, and how very, very sad. I felt a deep promise of joy, because I knew that what I was learning was truth. I sensed I was on my way out of bondage and into freedom. But sad and scaredóI empathize with you. As Jude said, "Grace, grace, grace." God is with you. The Holy Spirit is your Comforter now. You are clean and whole, and you will LIVE! Colleen | ||
| Palorenz |
Sherry, Welcome to real Truth. Paul | ||
| Bruce H |
Sherry To find the books that Ellen White coppied from get the book THE WHITE LIE By Walter Ray, in it he has done all the homework and he gives you all the books and where to look in the book's. I have a couple of the books that she coppied from but a lot of them are out of print so i recommend going the the used book line on the internet. If you get the book The White Lie by walter Ray it has a lot of example of her copying. If you call our line 1 877 EGW MYTH and give me your Name and address and number I will send you the book Free. Bruce Heinrich | ||
| Plain Patti |
I just ordered that book from Amazon.com. Interesting it got bad reviews! :) (I wonder who might have done that!) (Readers were "seriously warned" not to read it!) BTW, I am looking for these books: Judged by the Gospel -- Brinsmead Shaking of Adventism -- Paxton EJ Waggoner, the Myth and the Man -- McMahon Anyone know where I can get them? Thanks! | ||
| Timo K. |
Patti, to get the books try Norman Jarnes. He is former Verdict editor and now is publishing "Outlook". He might have in store the books. Norman Jarnes, Worldview Publications, P.O.Box.2770, Fallbrook, Ca.92088 timo | ||
| Joni |
Has anyone heard of a book called "ARE 7TH DAY ADVENTISTS FALSE PROPHETS? A FORMER INSIDER SPEAKS OUT. BY SLATTERY. It was recommended to me by a dear friend. Just wondering if it was something to read. Who is Slattery? | ||
| Lydell |
Sherry, while the fact that she borrowed heavily from the writing of others is a truth that you must address. Unfortunately the problem with EGW goes far beyond this. The much more serious problem is that she blatantly contradicted the Bible on some most important points while all the time claiming to be a "servant of God." I encourage you to go to this website and read the comparisons of her writings to the Bible. This will be a faster study than that involved in looking up and comparing the references in all those books. But it will much more clearly expose the root of the problem with EGW. It's a tough read for someone who has just left Adventism, but another tool to cut you free from error so you can walk in the light of the gospel. (A few of these are merely curious differences, but most are really bad.) http://www.truthorfables.com/EGW-Contradictions.htm | ||
| Palorenz |
Bruce H, Can I get a copy of "The White Lie" free if a call too? Paul | ||
| Jude the Obscure |
Wow, Joni! I read that book about two years ago, and have since given it away to a "hardcore," who may well have just trashed it. What memories it brought up! You see, I attended college with Wallace Slattery and we were friends. I remember him as a super hardcore and blind as a cave mole in those days. And so his transformation into a former Adventist caught me off guard when I first heard about it. I was in Behrens bookstore to purchase a new Green-English Interlinear New Testament. I struck up a conversation with one of the clerks who happened to be quite knowledgeable about Bibles. In our conversation he discovered I had an SDA background. He asked if I'd ever herad of "ARE 7TH DAY ADVENTISTS FALSE PROPHETS?" by Wallace Slattery. "Slattery?" I burst out. "I went to school with that dude!" So I had to buy the book just to find out what old Wallace was up to. And did I ever! For the book, more of a booklet really, was more autobiography than anything else. But just as a critique from "the inside," it would be a worthwile read. You'll get some good insights from it. Thanks for ringing my doorbell, Jude | ||
| jtree |
Sherry, I do believe you can read most books online. The if you wish to purchase, that is fine, but then there is Bruce's offer. He and many formers here are wonderful people in the Lord. You gotta love em.... Here is one link to Canright's book "Her Claims Refuted: The Life of Ellen G. White http://members.tripod.com/~Help_for_SDAs/Life_of_EGW_Her_Claims_Refuted_Canright.html Here is a book online also... All Dressed Up by Pat Pine Darnell Pat's story portrays how her family became involved with Adventism in the 30's, and how the church affected their lives, from kitchen to bedroom, from schoolroom to boardroom. The last chapter shows how the Lord greatly blessed Pat as she studied her way out of that cultic religion. Whatever you do, don't miss that last long chapter! http://members.tripod.com/~Help_for_SDAs/All_Dressed_Up1.html I hope this helps, and God be with you! |
