|Posted on Saturday, August 14, 1999 - 10:29 pm: || |
I found the web site by Mark Martin very useful in
documenting the prophecies that did not come true and errors of Mrs. White. It is in the links setcion or type in www.sdaoutreach.org, and go to
the section of a true prophet? Also verse Jer 23: 30-32 is good. The evidence is clear E.G. White
was not a prophet.
|Posted on Wednesday, August 18, 1999 - 5:41 pm: || |
I've known for some time that EGW was a false prophet. Last week I spent some time looking at all the bible verses pertaining to false prophets. It hit me like a ton of bricks. If she wasn't speaking for God, who was she speaking for? It never dawned on me that her words could be from Satan. I think someone mentioned this in an earlier post, but I'd never let it sink in.
This might explain something I've been experiencing for years. I've been wanting to bring it up, but it sounds a little strange. When-ever I am in an SDA church (weddings, baby dedications and funerals) I get the weirdest feeling in my stomach, like I might be sick. This is really a physical symptom, I'm not making it up. It also comes over me when I'm discussing doctrine with an SDA. Is this just anxiety, or could it be that evil has a "foot in the door"? Please let me know if any of you have had similar experiences. Do you think I'm just freaking out? I've been curious about this for a long time. When I came to the realization that her prophecies must be from Satan, it got me thinking.
Would love to hear from any of you. Susan
|Posted on Wednesday, August 18, 1999 - 9:36 pm: || |
I know just what you mean, Susan. After talking with an SDA - even a member of my own family - I almost feel like taking a shower afterward to wash away all the negativity and unlove.
Of course, I was a member years ago myself, and I remember my own spiritual confusion and unloving attitude. The negativity I gave off must have been horrible.
I really do just get a sinking, sick feeling in the pit of my stomach when listening to SDAs. I think you are the first person other than myself I have heard mention this. I wonder how many others experience this?
Every person on this planet is either on God's side or Satan's. There is no in-between group who are partly following after Christ and partly following afrer Satan. As Jesus said, those who are not with Me are against Me; you cannot serve two masters; etc.
Ellen white was throughout her life a willing servant of Satan. Her works and the church she helped set up teach "another gospel" - not the gospel of Jesus Christ. In all my years as an SDA I never knew Jesus. The religious tenets given me by Ellen White's writings erected an insurmountable barrier between Jesus and me. In no way was Ellen White engaged in God's work. It was in Satan's employ that Ellen White labored.
|Posted on Wednesday, August 18, 1999 - 9:55 pm: || |
Susan--yes, I've had similar experiences except not usually with the physical symptoms. Last summer the same realization hit me--if her prophecies were not from God, who were they from?
The answer can only be one thing: Satan. Deception, whether it is direct revelation from evil or whether it is falsehood spoken to get control over people and to secure power and money for one's own causes, is from Satan. But the fact that hit me last summer was that she must have gotten many of her prophecies from Satan. You know how later in her life she often referred to her angel guide, the handsome young man who usually appeared in her dreams? I suspect that could have been what the Bible calls a "familiar spirit."
The almost unbreakable bond Adventists have to the church, whether or not they beleive the doctrines, the inability for many to really grasp the glory of the New Covenant, the "you have to be one of us to really be appreciated" attitude many have all suggest to me that ADventists are in bondage.
We finally decided that if Satan was behind the prophecies and the deception of Adventism, then Satan has a claim on anything Adventist. Adventists, I believe, are bound by a Satanic claim. We decided that we had to renounce Adventism, not merely leave it. Our family prayed that God would take away the spirit of Adventism from our hearts and put the Holy Spirit in the place the spirit of Adventism had been. When we did that, for the first time we knew absolutely that we were no longer Adventist. From that time we have had no emotional ties to the church at all. In addition, the truth of the gospel and the truth of the subtle but pervasive deception in Adventist theology have become clearer and clearer.
At this point in our journey, we do not go to Adventist church services when we visit relatives. We feel that since we believe it is Satanic, why should we put ourselves in that environment? I'm absolutely convinced that this explains why it's so hard to discuss doctrine with Adventists.
A local pastor here told us that his church rented the sanctuary of a local SDA church until they were able to get their own church. He said they struggled with oppression every Sunday during their services in the SDA church.
No, Susan, I don't think you're freaking out. I think you are absolutely aware of something real. Pray about your observations and questions; I know that the Holy Spirit will help you to know the truth about your experience.
|Posted on Thursday, August 19, 1999 - 9:45 am: || |
David and Colleen, Thanks for your messages. It's so comforting to know that others can relate and that I'm not "losing it".
Just looking at Zech.10:2, "The idols speak deceit, diviners see visions that lie; they tell dreams that are false, they give comfort in vain. Therefore the people wander like sheep oppressed for lack of a shepherd." In the NIV notes it says, "diviners. Included among false proghets, they were the OCCULT counterpart to true proghets." I guess when one is walking in THE Light, evil is more recognizable.
Colleen, I only attend SDA church functions when invited by family members (like I said before, weddings etc.). You said that you guys don't go to SDA churches at all. How do you get out of this without causing to much hurt? I can just hear it now when I explain to my mom, "sorry I can't attend the baby dedication. We don't go where Satan is". She would flip out. I know there must be a more tactful way. Don't get me wrong, I want to stand for truth. I just don't want to cause more problems for already rocky relationships. Know what I mean? Would appreciate any advice! Thanks again for all that you and David had to share. It helped SO much!
Remember the line from a popular hymn? (the title doesn't come to mind) "On CHRIST the solid rock I stand, ALL other ground is sinking sand, all other ground is sinking sand" EGW was and is truly sinking sand. Praise God my assurance is in Christ alone!
|Posted on Saturday, August 21, 1999 - 10:20 am: || |
I am reading some of these posts with interest, and never thought I would be taking an EGW apologist stance, but...I am thinking that labeling the SDA church or EGW as satanic or so inspired is a little strong. I am not sure it has to be Christ or Satan, after reading The significance of Ellen White's Head injury from ellenwhite.org, I hold the view that EGW did suffer from her mental condition possible frontal lobe epilepsy. (very interesting article @ www.ellenwhite.org/headinjury.htm)I think this is also the view of Dirk Anderson.
Anyway I do think there are some good people in the Adventist church (maybe just a few), but I guess it depends which sect within the sda church we are speaking of. The Historic Adventist seems to be the one in the most trouble.
I don't think any one church has all the doctrines right or have all the right answers.
Well just my two cents worth, but I don't think that evil is lurking in the corridors of the sda church.
btw~I just finished the Cultic Doctrine of the SDA and thought it was execellent!
|Posted on Sunday, August 22, 1999 - 7:58 am: || |
I do believe there are many honest people in Adventism who have accepted Jesus. I believe that God gently guides everyone who operates out of integrity and a commitment to truth and brings them to himself. I also believe that not even the committed trly experience peace and rest in Christ as long as they remain Adventist.
I truly belonged to Jesus as an Adventist, and I prayed from the time I was a pre-teen that God would use me to help people see Jesus. But it wasn't until I got to the place where I could see and admit the problems in Adventism and be willing to give it up that the truth about the freedom of the gospel and my security in Jesus became real. What I've experienced since leaving it all was unexpected and unimaginable.
I'm sure Ellen's head injury played into her "visions." But Ellen wasn't the only problem with the church. Her husband and all the other founders of the church capitlaized on her "prophetic gift" and made sure that she had tesitmonies and visions for every point they wanted to incorporate into doctrine. Even her son Willie, as an adult, would tell her whenone of her "testimonies" was needed. She allowed herself to be used by the powerful men in the early days of the denomination, and she, in return, apparently was granted a large chunk of power and control. Furthermore, James White made huge amounts of money on her books. James and the others made sure the people thought of her as a prophet and used her words to control the people and to direct the doctrinal formation of the church.
I do not believe EGW was an innocent victim. She herself said that if anyone rejected her testimonies, they were rejecting the word of God and would be judged accordingly.
In short, she was not a prophet of God, and the fact that the church founders used her to add authority to their own ideas and to pad their pockets still leaves the church in the position of being founded in deception. It was not founded on the true gospel of Jesus. It was founded on "another gospel," and all of the founders were culpable. That still gives Satan a claim to the church. He is the author of deception, not God. And you cannot have a church or organization or human that is in any camp except one of these two: God or Satan. There is no other camp. Either one stands for truth and integrity or one stands for deception and falsehood and sells his souls for power or greed.
I believe that the reason so many people are in agony about staying or leaving after they're convinced she was not a prophet is the spiritual claim that is on their souls because they have believed deception. Not that they believed by choice, necessarily. But whether by choice or by inheritance and indoctrination, we still have to choose to walk toward truth and leave behind all the trappings of deception.
The Holy Spirit shows us one step at a time what we have to deal with at any given moment. He doesn't expect us to see everything at once. He just enlightens and enables us to accept one kernel of truth at a time, and slowly, as we gain insight and trust, He helps us to see and understand more and more of the truth. Our job is to act on the truth.
I'm praying for all of us!