| Author | Message | ||
| Valm |
This is to everyone out there. It is time for me to come to a close. I have been hurt far too much to come here and continue to have this. To you Cindy, Thanks for you apology. I wish you to know once again that when I said what I said it was both in the context of being very distressed and not in the context of humor but my utter frustration with this discussion as well as the complete lack of understanding as to why you seem to encourage GA in promoting this doctrine. Yes I am VERY VERY HURT. And I ask you to consider if a meant spirited commented was directed at you if you would find it in the same light. And if you would not wish people to not encourage your attacker. Let me remind you that I came to you for an apology but neither of these men have come forward with the slightest. Cindy you have come forward to praise these men for their posts but have offered little support for anything I have posted when most of my posts are proclaiming the promises God has given to us. YES I AM HURT. TO GA AND BILLT. Your posts smack of sick humor under the guise of just trying to be funny and backed up with equally sick premise that the Bible justifies such. Yes you have hurt my emotions tremendously as this is a place I come to seek solice from the nastiness that the world has to offer and for spiritual support. Perhaps GA you do not need a support group, but then again you have never been an Adventist, have you? What is your point coming here? Are you seeking recruits to exploit? I am sick of your doctrine and sick of your hurtful nastiness. You haven't even been man enough to respond to scripture upon scripture but resort to bullying a lady!!!! Perhaps the two of you take great pleasure in what you do but as I tell my boys bullies are just cowards. Most of the nastiness you have said to me, you were not even men enough to say to my face, you refered to me as someone or talked about me to another. You are not even able to face a woman directly under the protection of a screen!!! I was asked to give one Bible text that demonstrated that we are not preelected and I, little emotional mommy, flooded the netword with text after text after text. With very little editorialization. and when I did this GA I went from being in your eyes, "GOD"S Chosen" to one who was devilish, a manipulator, uable to understand the Bible ect. .... How your opinion changed as if you are the judge and jury!!!! For those girlfriends out there who have given me their kindness, support and love, THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU. You have my email keep in touch.. Maybe we can start our own forum? KELLY DEAR. I have asked the Tinkers to give my email adress to you as I am not comfortable in publicly giving it on a forum. Please write me, you have touched my heart with your story and wish to give you encouragement, whether you remain an Adventist or not. ChukieJ and Jay, thank you for your posts. You would be great to get to know but I can not do it under the present hostile environment. Colleen and Richard. God Bless you in you ministry here. I wish you well and do not envy the decisions you have to make. I wonder why you have not taken a firm stand on this issue but respect this. For myself I can not come back to this forum knowing that this doctrine in the slightest bit might be supported by the moderators of this forum. This is my personal stance based on what I view as my honoring God. It is my hope that once this blows over, you will get a new group of people here that you can minister to. I wonder how many came and went not wishing to get involved. But I know as for myself, I would not be comfortable coming back to a place where the potential for hurt is so great. Once again God Bless You. CHYNA. God Bless you. I admire you. I hope that you read the book I recommended and wish you well in your medical carreer. I just saw a baby today with inoperable heart defects, questionable renal function, negative BAER, neurologically blind, and a head way way to small to assume other than gross mental retardation. He was sent home at 9 days old to die in his parents arms. You will encounter many people in your carreer at times in you life when you just think you have it all figured out you will be introduced to another tragic situation. It was no coincidence that in my reading of Shanks book that the very pages I read on my lunch break were those where Shank confronts Calvins thesis on innocent children like this babe who will die before they ever reach a point of conscience choice. And with that theory in your heart, what will you be able to do to offer spiritual support? I urge you because you have touched me also. And I wish such a sincere young lady with your aspirations much happiness and reward in her carreer and service to God. You take care and God Bless. Now with this, I say GOODBYE TO EVERYONE. I hope that others are treated better than I have been. Valerie | ||
| Chyna |
dear valerie, I don't know if you'll read this or not. heated discourse ... it gets heated because spiritual things are important to all of us. for me, I don't have a clear stance on predestination, what was important to me was that you might be open to seeing why other people believe differently on that matter. the reason why everyone was so passionate discussing it is because we all think it is important. and we think there are several biblical things to consider. but it wasn't passion directed against you, it was against the doctrine. and I feel like maybe you are making the same misunderstanding ... that if someone possesses a belief that you abhor, that you cannot stand to be with them. but it's not true, Valerie. I hang out with nonChristians, Buddhists, and Hindus, Adventists :) all the time and they possess several beliefs that I'm directly opposed to, but I don't dislike them because of their beliefs. more likely I feel compassion for them. I do understand where you are coming from. when there is a ton of dialogue and much stuff to wade through it feels overwhelming. which is why predestination is such a complicated issue for many. for you, it is clear cut, but it is not clear cut for so many people. maybe it's not easy to see now, but maybe later on, if you read back on the posts, I don't believe any were meant personally against you. I think the feeling kind of snowballs on itself especially on the Internet where tone cannot be easily known. esepcially when the text is read with a mindframe that is already set. I know this because sometime I feel defensive when my posts are questioned. yes, there is tragedy all around, and we can't make sense of it because we don't see the big picture. we don't see how everything fits in God's plan. I do reiterate Job, and please read it because Job has done nothing wrong, and yet God lets the devil torture him, kill all of his children ... also, I've really enjoyed your "company" on this forum, and your voice and opinions. I think one of the most important things to remember on this forum is that people come from all walks. you are important to us, and we do value you and what you post. I do take breaks from this forum, and I hope for you this will be a temporary break, and you will come back when you feel it's right. that's what I do. especially when I'm feeling really upset about Adventism or the hopeless feeling I get thinking about my ex. love, Chyna | ||
| Chyna |
in terms of finding this place a place of sound teaching or not, please do recognize our commitment to sound biblical teaching, whether you agree with the conclusions or not, we will always refer back to scripture here on this forum. | ||
| Billtwisse |
Chyna, I appreciate your candid honesty and spiritual discernment. The Holy Spirit spoke through you. Richard believes that the level of discussion was becoming destructive and dishonoring to Christ. I agree completely. However, it is tragic that those who would engage in a reasonable exchange of ideas on a higher (dare I say 'more spiritual') level of fellowship cannot find a good cyber-home. It is very wrong to expect those who have firm convictions based on scripture to avoid defending those beliefs with passion. If those who oppose respond with the same type of conviction, and a spiritual exchange of insight takes place, that is wonderful. It is when the exchange goes personal--questioning the other's motives and objectives--that the discussion loses all relevance. Why would anyone want to continue if the basis of interaction is a continual suspicion of the motives of the opponent? Many times in my life, I have engaged in somewhat lengthy studies and exchanges with other pastors, scholars, and 'ploughmen.' Often I have been convicted of error on something and the other person has been convicted in the same manner. There is no progress in understanding God's revelation without boldness in expressing conviction on both sides. --Twisse | ||
| Graceambassador |
Dear Chyna: Thank you for your understanding! I am glad neither Jesus nor Paul when they were called by their enemies names that were not depicting of their character, ceased from teaching what God called them to teach. That's why we have a "Cannon" today. I've found out a long time ago that people who attacked me for my beliefs and the way I present it have forgotten that Jesus called the religious people of His days names that were not very flattering. Also Paul calls many others names that would not win any FAF's standard of courtesy contest. I DID NONE OF THAT HERE! I WAS SOFTIER THAN JESUS OR PAUL! This is not to justify lack of courtesy. Often, these people are intrigued and touched by the message. This is not to justify lack of courtesy. Because of some undisclosed problem, however, people tend to resist to agree and become very angry. I have discovered that sometimes a "hard-core" unbeliever in the family who they are praying for is placed as the "object of my posts and teaching". This in turn makes the hearer have a the sense that I am teaching that that loved one will never be saved. Actually, as I stated so clearly, I am saying the opposite: WE CANNOT SAY THAT SOMEONE IS NOT "NOT SAVED" (purposeful double negative) BECAUSE THERE ARE VERY RARE CASES IN THE BIBLE WHERE GOD STATED THAT A PARTICULAR INDIVIDUAL WAS NOT SAVED. So, I actually preach an OPEN GOSPEL BY PREACHING ELECTION! Again, I understand their rage, and I understand being technically expelled from this forum. I HOPE one day those that are enraged with me will come to the understanding that I was not "expelling their sons and daughters from the kingdom". In the meantime, I will keep fulfilling God's calling in whatever way shape or form He has called me. At this point, it is to minister via Internet. It would be foolish on my part to think that the Internet would somehow exempt me from opposition! I've been opposed personally! Physically! If people are corageous enough to oppose me personally, let alone hidden behind a screen name and behind the protection of a computer screen! I pray for the ministry of the Tinkers, I pray for my opposers and I pray for myself in the Work of the Lord. Sincerely Grace Ambassador Milton Almeida | ||
| Richardjr |
Dear GA Uncle Milt, I just tried to e-mail you and my server would not let me get through to you. I am confused. Was it Satan blocking it, or was it God blocking it? Or could it be it was just plain old Juno? Most likely it was the fallen incompetence of Richardjr. | ||
| Graceambassador |
Dear Richard: Here is an easy address: it is my business address. Just copy and paste in your "to" field of the email editor you use: graceambassador@ameritech.net This is only one of the many I use. I have many others for different purposes, but this is my business one that buzzes me over my cell phone, etc.. Grace Ambassador Milton Almeida | ||
| Therese |
Valerie, Sorry to hear you are leaving. You have a been very helpful to me with you insights and support. Thank you. Please consider staying on the forum and only posting and responding to individuals you feel confortable dealing with. That's what I do. You have a lot to offer others and we can support you as well. God bless, Therese |
