| Author |
Message |
Sherry2
| | Posted on Saturday, March 24, 2001 - 5:08 am: |     |
Wow, I missed the conversation on the 19th about your grandmother, Colleen. Pretty wild how God works. And she was saved in Christ as an SDA too. If it was having a total accurate picture of every doctrinal issue that saved us, none of us would make it.
Reading EGW did not bring my folks into the church so I strongly disagree with that one. Some people are, some people aren't. Just like some people are saved and Adventist and others aren't. What brought my folks to SDA was first we weren't going to any church, my father was an alcoholic, and we were growing our own funny grass. :) But my Dad from reading the Bible once in a while was so ticked that Sunday-keepers worked and did other assundry things on that day because he read that the Sabbath should be kept holy. He wanted nothing to do with organized religion for it was full of hypocrits in his thinking. So when he heard of a church (from some druggie friends that found Christ through SDA) that they worshiped on Sat. which was the true Sabbath, it intrigued him right there. My folks didn't understand about EGW until after baptism, not before. Every case is different. I know our friend, when he came in, was hooked because of a Rev. seminar, and he had a special message to give the world - made him feel important and priveledged bottom line.
In Philip Yancey's book, Reaching out to the Invisible God, he talks about legalism as being a childish state of faith. When we are little, we had tons of rules: "don't touch that, don't eat that, wash your hands, don't cross the road without mom or dad, eat your vegetables...and on and on it went. These rules were important, but only for a season. As we mature, and are encouraged to mature, we learn to make those rules are own or ignore them when it really doesn't matter (i.e. don't touch the knives is childhood v wielding chainsaws or knives in adulthood because we have the maturity and control to do that). I wonder if sometimes Adventism doesn't appeal to some because it does give the lists, and maybe they've lived their Christian life so out of bounds, they are still like a child needing someone to say, don't do this, don't touch that. The problem is staying at that childish (which is different from the childLIKE faith that Christ lifts up) will result in spiritually stunted growth - only able to go so far, and definitely not as satisfying. Just a thought.
Well gotta run. |
Sherry2
| | Posted on Saturday, March 24, 2001 - 5:13 am: | |
I will say this, Lori. One thing that is true is I have found over and over again, studying the Bible equates to studying out the choice doctrines again and again and again and again. It was one of the contentions that helped me get disatisfied enough to leave. I wanted to study Ephesians and what true Christian living was, not just these choice doctrines. And I do know SDA's who no longer study the Bible for they don't feel a need (they might read it but they don't study it). They are solidified in the "truth" so they feel comfortable staying right there, or watching 3ABN. Ha! |
Doug222
| | Posted on Saturday, March 24, 2001 - 8:59 am: | |
Great posts Sherry, and thanks for bringing the discussion back to the original topic (or at least close to it). I like the analogy from Yancy's book. He must have been explaining the third chapter of Galatians, because Paul uses a similar example.
I would agree that the rules and restrictions of the SDA Church provides structure for those who are weak in the faith, but doesn't that discount the work of the Holy Spirit. My studying seems to indicate that God wants us to experience the miracle of grace. That transformation cannot take place if we have any part to play in it.
I have been in the SDA Church for 30+ years and must admit that I have not progressed beyond that "childish" faith. part of that is my own fault for not "studying" on my own as you call it, but part of it is the responsibility of a church that encourages its members to be satisfied with that immature faith. It offers its members a "complete" interpretation of what they should and should not believe, it provides the "inspired" extrabiblical work of EGW to cover those "difficult" areas, and it is very behaviorally oriented. Most importantly, it discourages (and even punishes)anyone from straying from its carefully defined system of beliefs.
With "so much" at the average member's disposal, where is the room for the Holy Spirit? This is why it is difficult for members to leave. Even when they see the need for a more mature relationship with God, there is a reluctance to leave the security of immaturity--kind of like that teenager who is afraid to leave home. Unfortunately, this is the sin of unbelief that the Children of Israel experienced in the wilderness and that the writer of Hebrews warns against.
I guess the bottom line is that I believe the rules and regulations of the SDA Church may be beneficial for some, in reality may be just another man-made attempt (and there are many in AND outside the Church) to substitute our feeble way for God's Perfect Way (Jesus).
In His Grace,
Doug |
Lori
| | Posted on Saturday, March 24, 2001 - 1:07 pm: | |
As a young adult in the Adventist church, I had come to the decision to NOT study the Bible and to NOT witness to others.
My reasons for this all pertained to "I didn't want to know anymore (Bible knowledge); I had already given up enough (sacrificed enough) already".
I was taught that the more you learned the more you gave up for God. And, that if you knew something and didn't do it then you were accountable for that knowledge and would be judged according to it.
I consciously avoided any witnessing on the Sabbath and dietary issues because I had friends that I cared about and I knew they would reject "my" message and I wasn't about to make them accountable for it.
I was persecuted enough because of my weird life style. No pork, no shrimp, no catfish--I can't even remember how many dinners we went to and the only thing we could eat were the rolls because all the vegetables were cooked in lard! (And to think of the number of people we offended because we did not partake in their meal). I was allowed to play in the band in highschool , but was never allowed to go to the football games and participate because they were "in the hours of the Sabbath"--I got some funny looks from my classmates over that!
Most of the comments in my yearbook my Freshman and Sophomore year were along the lines of--"you are a cute girl, you should be in the pep squad so you be a cheerleader later on".
I could have gone to the class parties on Saturday night, but what's the point when you are forbidden to dance.
A great number of vocational opportunites were unavailable because all the "testings" were done on Saturdays.
The texts that continually rang in my ears were "my people are a peculiar people" ---well, I could vouch for that one, I certainly was peculiar!!! and ".....persecuted for righteousness sake"---I felt persecuted!!!
It wasn't until a few years ago that I finally realized all of my persecution was of an internal origin. I don't think that is what this verse implied. And, my peculiarity was based upon a Christian peculiarity but rather on a relgious peculiarity.
On of the most atrocious things I can remember hearing was "the more you know Jesus the more that you will be in awe that he saved you", I thought that was the stupidous thing I'd ever heard!!! Hey, by the time that I had given up even more of life than I got to live now....I felt like that I would "deserve to be saved".
A little arrogant, don't you think?
It is quite humorous now to look back and ponder on the things I used to think.
I'm so glad that I'm not there anymore.
And, I have come to learn that when you really love Christ and when you learn more and more about Him then you are more in awe everyday that he died for this world and for you in particular!!!
Lori |
Allenette
| | Posted on Saturday, March 24, 2001 - 6:32 pm: | |
Valm: well, I would suggest you read "Rescuing the Bible From Fundamentalism" by John Shelby Spong for starters.
After you do that, we can talk ;-) |
Kelly
| | Posted on Saturday, March 24, 2001 - 8:33 pm: | |
The title of that book is a true statement--the Bible does need rescuing from the Fundamentalist Christians but only a person that believes the Bible is an inaccurate history book can agree with this man statements.
"Fundies" are the worst representation of Jesus Christ there is. Fundies are believers in Christ who are living their whole lives following a diversionistic tactic of Satan instead of the plan of God for their lives. Fundies are children of God that are doing the devils work.
Sadly, most Christians are fundamentalist. And sadly, they aren't doing the work Christ made them for.
Spong has it right that Religion is not Christianity.
As far as our witnessing goes--we are not to try to prove that the Word of God is infallible, this is not the question.
The question is: Do you believe in Jesus Christ the Son of God? We are to quote the scriptures of the Gospel message as we witness to unbelievers, we are not told to prove to them that the Bible is indeed Divinely inspired.
The efficaceous grace of the Holy Spirit will do it's work on the individual we present the Gospel to. The Holy Spirit will make this message known and understood to them. At this point they will decide to either be positive or negative to the Word. |
Chyna
| | Posted on Sunday, March 25, 2001 - 2:41 am: | |
dear Therese,
Ellen G. White spoke of Amalgamation not as in the sons of God in Genesis, but rather she was talking about the origin of Africans in the time spectrum, subscribing to probably what was a popular theory during her time, that Africans were part beast. its makes me shudder even to type these words.
Another note. Cults tend not to have many African-Americans in them because their founders usually had bad and gross things to say about them. Even now in Mormonism it's very hard to be black and a Mormon because I think Mormon doctrine said something about it being impossible for an African to become a pastor or something like that. Heheh, too bad EGW didn't know more about Asians, she could have turned off the whole Korean-Adventist population by some grossly racist doctrine as well.
thoughts, Chyna |
Chyna
| | Posted on Sunday, March 25, 2001 - 2:52 am: | |
Dear Lori and Doug,
That is my current popular theory on Adventism! In the lecture I was listening to Dante' praised Romans because they had a good LAW system, and that organized LAW promoted great STABILITY (peacetime, not war). And that is my running theory why Adventists put up with the "don't eat this, don't do anything after 6pm, don't cook, don't question, don't smoke, don't be imperfect." They have stability a sort of homeostasis, an inertia. Within their 'balanced lives' of legalism, strongly knit (sometimes choking) community, profession/legal/educational/spiritual lives all bound up as one identity Adventism, there is a stability. And as you both pointed out, there is no room for doubting or questions, it's strongly discouraged for thinking of anything outside EGWism, or SDAism (which are mostly the same). Yet, how many of us that are Christians have had doubts and the occasional doctrine that you just don't know what to do with? With a healthy Christian life, you will turn to God and give Him that big question mark of what does it mean? Instead Adventists fearfully think that a question mark is a rip and a tear in their faith, because the whole bit of Adventism is built on SAND and not the ROCK. Adventism is built on the precepts of a woman from the 1800's, not Christianity, and certainly not from the Holy Spirit.
more thoughts, Chyna |
Sherry2
| | Posted on Sunday, March 25, 2001 - 6:20 am: | |
Oh I would agree Doug. No room for much of the Holy Spirit. I sort-of came to that in my own walk, seeing the life and vibrancy of Christians from another church, and the lack of it in mine, and in me. And I somehow came to the conclusion that if I needed EGW to understand the Bible, then I wasn't studying for myself and was no different to Catholism. I reached that conclusion while still an SDA. It was then that I started noticing how the SDA commentary uses her material so you can check out chapter by chapter what she had to say on passages, and the realizing that no Sabbath School quarterly was excempt from quotes of hers. It was sickening to me as the Holy Spirit revealed it to me. All these baby steps that God was taking me through. I am always so amazed by His grace and providence for someone as me, and all of us. We're just "ants" if it were, yet He maintains a personal relationship with each of us who will have it. That is astounding.
Oh yea, Chyna...it is built on the sand. I just wish it would sink a little faster. Dale R. made a comment about people being drawn to SDAism through the seminars because it is so sensational with all the beast pictures and stuff, and giving answers for end time events. I think the human desire to predict the future is part of the flesh. If a church weaves a good line of proof text to proof text together and adds some other stuff to make it all seem to add up, and gives me specifics on what's going to happen in the future (i.e.Sunday laws) then that would be a big pull to the flesh I think.
Interesting thoughts Kelly. Could you tell me more about Fundamentalists and how that breaks down Christ's mission? I don't know what fundies are folks. Thanks. I agree - we are not called to prove inspiration. Abram didn't have a Bible, but he heeded God's call. And there are plenty of cultures that have heeded His call without a Bible, and only being led by the Holy Spirit. The Scriptures sure add an awesome element, but the things of the Spirit are to be understood by His Spirit in us. I know the reading of the Bible has been life-transforming for me because of the relationship with Jesus I gained from it. I'm encouraged so much through it. To go through a time of doubting the Word though is part of the walk too. How can faith be so awesome if it didn't have a start in doubts? How can forgiveness be so wonderful if it didn't have it's starts with realizing our depravity? |
Valm
| | Posted on Sunday, March 25, 2001 - 7:48 am: | |
Allenette,
I am well aware of Spong's book. And although I haven't read it a friend of mine has shared many parts of it with me. And I would say I probably am inclined to agree with some of Spong's message. So what is your point?
You come and go from this forum. And when you come it seems to be to bring arguement and ridicule of people's beliefs.
So I am asking you what do you believe? Perhaps your read the book and "then we can talk" is an avoidance. You are fine to come here with your one liners to stir things up but you don't wish to engage in serious study or conversation when someone tries to do so. So again I ask you what is your point?
Hey if you really are serious I'll get Spong's book and you can start a thread on it; and I would be happy to discuss his premises.
Valerie |
Allenette
| | Posted on Sunday, March 25, 2001 - 3:17 pm: | |
Valm: dont take me too seriously, at best I am the sand in the oyster at worse just a bemused, pesky lurker these days.
Formers come in all sorts of beliefs and belief systems these days. Thank you Mrs. White (TIC) |
Janice (Janice)
| | Posted on Thursday, January 23, 2003 - 4:42 pm: | |
I saw the post about "help, I have a SDA sister" and thought it was my post. I would like to find someone in the Mountain City, Tennessee area and the Creston, N.C. area who would be willing to personally contact my SDA family members for a personal witness. It is hard to witness when your e-mail is blocked and regular mail returned. No one answers the phone when my name displays on the caller ID either, and the fact that my mother and sister are 400 miles away doesn't help the situation. I have been told that my concern was "duly noted" and also told that I should honor their decision in choosing to remain SDA, I will say that Adventist living in itself isn't wrong, after all, we are suppose to take care of our bodies and obey God, but we need to know that God has more than the big "10" that I always have to hear about, examples like loving one another and bearing one another's burdens, accepting all food with thanksgiving and refusing nothing for it has been made clean, and my personal favorite: judge not a man in what he eats, drinks, or observes as a holy day or SABBATH, and it hurts that the SDAs don't seem to ever come across the chapter that speaks of one Lord, one faith, one baptism, and ONE church but choose to believe that all non SDAs are hell bound after not heeding to the enlighting of E.G. White's gospel,but putting that aside, my gripe comes in with the false doctrines and the idea that they are the only ones who will receive heavenly rewards because of their Sabbath observance, like worship has to do with earning salvation at all, we should worship him for his free gift of salvation, E.G. White is a false prophet, however, I have been told that I need professional counseling to help me deal with my problem, my problem, in their opinion, is the fact that I insist they listen to what God has to say and keep this Ms. White and her nonsense out of the equation. I thought everyone knew about the verse: seek and ye shall find, but not everyone understands that you have to ask the Holy Spirit into your heart first and foremost before he can ever give you the proper understanding of his word anyway. Read I Corinthians 2:14 for proof. We are told to try the spirits of a person professing to be a prophet as well to see if what they say lines up with God's word and if it doesn't we are commanded to take no heed of what they say, also, the false prophet is to be cursed and shunned (not lovingly embraced). Instead of listening to God's warning that I relayed to my family, my sister sent me scripture about the she-bear mauling the children that made fun of Daniel and warned me of what could happen if I didn't quit mocking E.G. White and show her respect by using a proper title instead of addressing her as "that woman", it offended her when I called her that and, for the record, I told my sister that quoting God's word and matching it up along side a lie was enlightenment and not making fun. She was furious with me for writing scripture in three of her SDA books that revealed falsehoods taught by SDAs and was told that these books had to be thrown away because I had chosen to deface them, I was in hopes that she would place them back in her church library so that others could be enlightened to the truth of what SDAs teach but her stubborn pride kept the truth from multiplying. One of the many false things I found in one of the books was concerning the physical punishment that Christ endured prior to the crucifixion. One SDA author stated that we Christians who believed that his beatings and whipping had anything to do with our salvation had been sadly misled and we are all a bunch of fools, I found this statement very amazing and very insulting to my intelligience, especially due to the fact that I have several sketches of Christ that were done by an SDA which has Isiah 53:5 written under one of them, by his stripes we are healed, if you read the entire chapter you will find that indeed he was wounded for our transgressions and bruised for our iniquities, he took it all on himself and in his dying words cried out IT IS FINISHED!!! This SDA author's nonsense is one more of many of the false doctrines that are so misleading. This same author went on to say that when we know that the beatings were caused by Satan, we are giving Satan credit for part of the salvation plan. Don't they know that Satan would have never allowed the crucifixion had he been privy to the real works taking place there? Oh boy, I sure hope that someone out there can relate to the things I am discussing here. I have many Christian friends that I discuss God and his word with but not that many Christians know about how the SDAs really function, and that works to the SDAs advantage because they are SLICK and cunning and very well trained to have an answer for almost everything, and what they can't answer, they conveniently skirt around to get to another more familiar subject to argue. I am reminded of one verse of scripture every time I try to witness to my SDA family members and that is found is I Samuel 15:23, read about what a rebellious and stubborn spirit is! I have been very depressed by everything that has transpired during this last year and to make it worse, I read that when I see certain things happening around me that the end and the imminent return of Christ is near, and I was led to believe that this was pretty much the mainstream belief of SDAs to look for the return or Advent of Christ but I got made fun of when I told my sister that the reason for my witnessing was the fact that my heart was concerned that my family wasn't ready for Christ's return, and I was told that I was being an extremist for having so much concern, like I am not supposed to be concerned about lost loved ones. I finally put the rubber to the road, as my preacher says, and asked point blank if they were to die right now would they know where they would spend eternity and promptly received a reply stating that no one could know. For those who don't know their position, please read John 20:31, what does the Bible say here? I have heard for the 100th time about that foolish doctrine of "investigative judgment" and it makes me sick to my stomach at how anyone could read "it is finished" and how Jesus sat down by the father's right hand till he made his enemies his footstool and try to imagine that he waited over 1800 years to get up and take his blood and apply it to my sins, folks, that is stupid, PTL, and makes God out to be a liar. The argument about the comma placement in the story about Calvary (you know, today you shall be with me, etc.)well, this is nonsense as well, try reading it again and putting the comma where Ms. White tells you to and see if it makes sense when you read it that way, poor sentence structure to say the least. Well, I guess I need to leave this discussion for a while and get on with the act of living, cooking supper, washing clothes and dishes, etc. God bless and I am looking forward to open discussions with you all. |
Colleentinker (Colleentinker)
| | Posted on Thursday, January 23, 2003 - 7:17 pm: | |
Janice, Welcome!
You have really been suffering with your sister and mom. It seems surreal or like a bad dream when the ones you love and with whom you thought you had a close relationship suddenly shun you and treat you as an enemy.
Yes, I understand your anger and frustration, and yes, I know all too well what those doctrines are and what they do to people!
You know, Janice, as Bill said on another thread, you really can't talk them out of their beliefs. They have to want to study, and they have to want to know truth. The most powerful weapon you have (and I mean that literally) is prayer. Pray that God will deal with their hearts and plant a desire for the truth inside them. Pray that they will want to study the Bible and know the truth. Pray that you will have the mind of Christ and His wisdom when you do interact with them. Pray that they will become confused or disillusioned with their new beliefs, and that they will begin to experience cognitive dissonance when they read passages in the Bible that disagree with their new-found beliefs.
Above all, pray that God will heal your heart and help you love them for him, that He will help you to surrender them to him and allow them to be His project.
I will pray for you and for them, too, Janice. I will pray that you'll have God's peace and that you'll have His wisdom to know how or how not to deal with them. Sometimes it takes a long time for people to begin to let the light of truth glimmer into the tiny cracks in their Adventist armor, but time is not a very big factor to God. He is already in the future, and he knows what they need in order to begin to know the truth. Certainly your refusal to follow them into Adventism will cause them some moments of thought.
We'll look forward to hearing more from you!
Colleen |
Another_Carol (Another_Carol)
| | Posted on Friday, January 24, 2003 - 5:55 am: | |
Janice, Welcome to the forum. You are not alone, been there done that. You will be uplifted by the prayers for you from this post, since we all know exactly what you are experiencing and understand your wanting for your loved ones to have what you have, if we could just give it to them but even if we could they would not take it because that is exactly what Jesus did and what have they done with that.
I must go to work now but will look forward to sharing with you . I like you am not an adventist but have been put in this position because someone duped my son-in-law into this religion and now the once happy family is no more. Still praying and believing that the answer is on the way.
Love and Prayers, Carol |
Terryk (Terryk)
| | Posted on Friday, January 24, 2003 - 10:08 am: | |
Well sorry to hear that here is another victim of the cult. I know and so does everyone here the frustration when we want others to see the truth. Jesus does not force us so we can not force anyone else. Like stated before me you just have to pray and I will pray that you can heal yourself and move on and pray that you can deal with them not seeing the truth. It is very hard to do. God Bless you sister we all share in your loss and sorrow and above all frustration |
Pheeki (Pheeki)
| | Posted on Friday, January 24, 2003 - 3:11 pm: | |
Janice, you have found a place of comfort here. Imagine the situation you find yourself in taking place in your own home. That is the situation I am facing. My husband has much the same attitude as your loved ones. I face a his anger if I even talk on the phone to my mother about it. She is supportive of me and will listen to what I have to say and has many doubts about SDAism. She tells me she doesn't know what to believe but always listens and tells me things she never understood. Today she told me that she never believed that the prophesy about the stars falling and darkness in the day had occurred like they said it did in New England. I believe EGW was trying to say we were in the end times.
Anyway, my husband has made many snide remarks to me about my new beliefs and has screamed at me and asked me to keep all anti-SDA materials put up so the kids won't see them. Everytime I get on the internet he gets angry at me, I don't get it, it is not as if I am doing something wrong. I am talking about Jesus.
I have received a lot of encouragement on this forum and a lot of food for thought. You have come to the right place. I will be praying for you. |
Lucias (Lucias)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 25, 2003 - 7:12 pm: | |
Janice,
It must hurt a lot. And I know you are concerned about your family. Reading your post it seems that communication has totally broken down and any attempt to communicate your concerns and beliefs is rebuffed.
Perhaps the best thing is to step back, take a deep breath, and let things calm down. Begin to work again on the relationships and not the theology.
Unless you can reestablish calm positive communication you can never break through.
Your life lived in a loving Christlike manner toward them may be the best way to show them they are wrong about their views.
I personally view Romans 14 as having a lot of relevance when I deal with my or my wifes SDA relatives. It deals with the weak and the strong and not condemning the weaker brother.
The weaker brother is the one who still believes one day is more important than another, and that eating certain foods is verbotten. This principle extends to an awful lot of SDA views in my opinion.
Let them believe the way they wish. Paul said its OK.
Now I know that there are doctrinal errors in the SDA church. But they all profess that Christ is the savior, though some wonder about his specific nature and other things.
Christ knows their heart and if they are truly trying, as best they know, how to follow him then even though they may be a little off the path he still saves them.
Yes you are correct, especially about Ellen, but I can tell you this. I was brought back to the Christian church, in part, by a devout Ellen White Believing Seventh Day Adventist woman. She has since passed on to be with the Lord and I have no doubt in my mind that even though she would never accept what I learned that she was Saved and Christ was living in her.
This doesn't mean to me we shouldn't try and reach those we left behind but we should try and do so with the love and grace of Christ.
Am I making sense to you ? I hope so. Its a very hard position you are in. |
Colleentinker (Colleentinker)
| | Posted on Saturday, January 25, 2003 - 11:11 pm: | |
Lucias, you make a lot of sense. I do believe that there are many Adventists who want to know Jesus and are committed to him, whatever they understand him to be. Those people God will continue to teach until they are able to embrace him in complete trust. I believe, as I've said before, that I was saved as an Adventist even though I didn't know it, because I was truly committed to Jesus and asked God to help people see Jesus in me. Adventists who love the church more than Jesus, though, end up pushing Jesus and truth away.
As Christ-followers we have a commission to pray for those loved ones who are in that position. Arguing and insisting on telling them "the truth" will not help at all. Only prayer will help. Sometimes, if they are very hostile and abusive, we have to allow some emotional distance to come between them and us. Even then, we still have to pray for them and ask God to help us love them for him. Sometimes the way we are to love them for Him is unclear, and we have to be willing to stand before God, willing to be his hands and heart as he directs.
Above all, we must give God the hurt and the pain and ask him to help us be willing and strengthened to bear the pain of injustice without retaliation.
It's very hard to have close loved ones who are hostile and intractable. Ultimately, we have to let them go to Jesus and give up our "right" to engage them in doctrinal discussions. Even though the desire for closure and understanding is powerful, we have to be willing to give up the hope that we will find those things from them. Jesus himself must be enough!
Praising Jesus for wasting nothing and redeeming everything we submit to him!
Colleen |
Doug222 (Doug222)
| | Posted on Sunday, January 26, 2003 - 12:27 am: | |
The hardest thing for many of us to learn is that the same God who delivered us from the bondage of Adventism will do the same for our friends and family members.
That is a foreign idea to most of us because the method of proselytizing (sp) that we learned was to convince others of how wrong they were and how right we are. When we come to a knowledge of grace, we do not lose those tendencies.
We need to keep in mind the experience of Moses. God chose him to do a great work, but it was to be accomplished in God's time and according to God's plan. The well intentioned Moses attempted to take matters into his own hands and made a mess of things. When God did finally move, he acted in ways that Moses never could have imagined--and made sure that Moses could not claim any credit. I don't think it is any different with us.
We have to learn that we are powerless to control other people and therefore trust them to the care of a loving God who is more than able (and trustworthy).
This is a lesson I am still learning. I look forward to the day when I can share Christ without debating/criticizing Adventism. Since I am unable to do that right now, I can only assume that God has called me to the wilderness for the time being so that he can prepare me.
In His Grace
Doug |
Janice (Janice)
| | Posted on Sunday, January 26, 2003 - 3:11 pm: | |
Doug222, I really like your input on the witnessing concept. Yes, I do forget to practice what I preach sometime.
God knows our hearts and is still able to move people, it is just that patience is not a virtue that I have mastered when it comes to waiting on the Lord. I think that just because I see the simplicity of the gospel that others should see it as easily as I do.
I must confess that I am 51 years old and probably would be another victim of the SDAs had it not been for God's intervention in sending me a godly woman that studied with me about last day prophecy which, in turn, led me to a deeper understanding of the urgency of the message and thus a deeper desire to study.
When people ask me questions, I want to be able to give an answer 'instant in season out of season' as the word teaches. I want to be able to lead a person to accepting the Lord as their saviour for I am told that this is almost as exciting as when we actually got saved ourselves. It is true that age begets wisdom but that is due to the fact that we have usually graduated from the 'school of hard knocks', I just pray that old woman's prayer that I received in an e-mail last week about "Lord help me to restrain from wanting to give that wisdom to everyone I come in contact with" because I have learned that if I can't tolerate the tongue of a 'know-it-all' then that should give me the desire to keep my mouth shut and ears open and realize than others probably don't like it either.
I have a question for everyone: Know why God gave us two ears and only one mouth?
Answer: Because we need to listen twice as much as we speak. I will try to remember that.
I will also try to write this long stuff down in short paragraphs, sorry if I seemed too defensive about the criticism yesterday.
I do love to talk about the Lord and what he has done for me, so, having said that, I guess I need to get ready for tonight's service.
Yours in Christ, Janice |
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