| Author | Message | ||
| Jude the Obscure |
Lynn, I see that nobody's going to fool you ever again! Not as long as you hang on to that gospel of yours. What a resource you are on this website! -Jude | ||
| Jude the Obscure |
Darrell, Loved your post! Powerful insight, the Ten Commandment analogy with stony hearts. "So the 10 commandments was written on stone because of the hardness of their (our) hearts. What do you think?" I think you should post more often. Do you have the time? Jude | ||
| Jude the Obscure |
Dear everyone, A thought just hit me before I have to go to bed (it's 11:30P already!). My thought? Any idea that letting one's "freedoms [in Christ] lead one "full circle to lawlessness" is the most clueless of all cluelessness. It can be nothing more than an enticement -- based on fear, if not terror -- to fall back on the law. The subtle serpent's deception hidden here is the idea that "the law" is more trustworthy than Christ! Could anything be uglier and more venomous? I don't want to impugn the messenger (who is simply mistaken), only the message. Read Romans, friends! Then read Galatians! Do it before you read another formeradventist.com post. And if you have any inkling at all that freedom in Christ could lead "full circle to lawlessness" know that you are on the thinnest of ice, and that if you break through it, you will land in hell. I know, I've been there! Christ pulled me out. And, I'm sorry, but I'm not about to go back! Nothing but Christ's blood to you all, Jude | ||
| Bruce H |
Jude You are right. When I died to the Law I saw it as Holy Rightious and good. I saw that I could not keep it so I died to it. If one says well I am no longer under the law I can go and do what I want then this is a person who has not died to the Law, for He loves what is contrary to the Law, and you cannot die to a law that you love what is contrary to it. Freedom in Christ leads to Justification and rightiousness, Period, and later down the road Glorification. Amen!!!! Bruce H BH | ||
| Maryann |
Hi everyone, Itís a beautiful Sabbath morning, one of seven that our Savior provided for us each week. This is a goldmine. Iím going back in the archives copying this stuff, getting a feel of these postings so I can read it when Iím not at the computer. I actually ran the printer out of ink! Thank each and everyone of you for you contributions. You know, some of us once in a while post something that may be unclear or even wrong and that is great. Bouncing our thoughts off the forum has the possibility of shaking some crusty ideas loose. A principle I learned some where that has been an untold help, and responsible in part for my success in my career, is that you can learn just as much or even more from those that donít know how to do it as from those that know how to do it, you know it's human nature to see ooowg-ly in the other first. Somehow, as a teenager, I just knew SDAism wasnít the way you did it. Still, even now I get confused as to where EGW ends and the Bible begins. I just learned a couple weeks ago that the serpent that got Eve didnít have wings. By the way, do any of you remember which link off Daleís web posted the... Were you told these lies by EGW? Iíve unsuccessfully hunted for it. To my reason for posting today is in relation to the above ìMoral V Ceremonialî law. Mom gives the pat SDA thing you all know. She says she doesnít care about the Torah, thatís ceremonial and the Bible is clear that the 10 commandments are the ìLawî and the other things were Mosesí things posted outside the Ark. Then comes the, ìtear your hair out argumentî, like Des Ford did to Dale Ratzlaff and every other respectable Sabbath keeper does, well, then itís okay to kill, steal, etc, etc. Could all you obviously scholarly wonderful students of the Bible PLEASE post a study on proving that there is no distinction between LAWS LAWS LAWS LAWS LAWS LAWS LAWS !? Pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeze. If not, Iíll be forced to ask for donations from yíall for a wig!!!! Thanks in advance. Jude...That was a great title, ìFormeradventist.calmî, what do you think of, ìFrom the Sweatshop to the Riviera in Christî? May have to do two, huh? Resting in our Saviors perpetual Sabbath... Maryann | ||
| Lynn W |
Maryann, another option you might want to try so you can save ink is to cut-n-paste from here to your word processor. You can do large chunks all at once. Then later, you can read it off-line. You'll still be at your computer, but not on-line. As to using you liberty as a license to sin, Paul already dealt with that. He must have heard the same pull-your-hair-out retorts from the legalists of his day. I'm sure he got tired of it, too. | ||
| Lynn W |
ROMANS 6:14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law, but under grace. 15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be! 16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness? Paul teaches in 6:14, without any ambiguity, that we are not under law but under grace. He also anticipates the very same protests that Adventist still have whenever they hear this argument. The Great Controversy, ch. 36, pg. 585, says, ìIf the law were not binding, why should any fear to transgress? Property would no longer be safe. Men would obtain their neighborís possessions by voilence, and the strongest would become richest. Life itself would not be respected. The marriage vow would no longer stand as a sacred bulwark to protec the family. He who had the power, would, if he desired, take his neighborís wife by violence. The fifth commandment would be set aside with the fourth. Children would not shrink from taking the life of their parents if by so doing they could obtain the desire of their corrupt hearts. The civilized world would become a horde of robbers and ssassins; and peace, rest, and happiness would be banished from the earth.î Revelation Seminar lesson 11 (supplement) asks the questions, ìAre New Testament believers now exempt from these ëlawsí and free to curse, swear, and worship idols?î and, ìHas the death of Jesus taken such prohibitions ëout of the way,í freeing us to indulge in such practices?î Paul has already answered these questions. But while answering them in 6:15, he still asserts in the same breath that we are not under the law. Being free from law does not give us license to sin. Verse 2:12 has shown us that we can still be guilty of sin without the law. How can this be if we are not under the 10 commandments? People who cannot look beyond this set of rules, are thinking on a small scale. The truth is, we answer to a higher law - the law of love and grace as shown in 13:10. 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. 7:1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth? 2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband. 3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man. 4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God. 5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death. 6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter. 7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: ... What law are we ëdead toí? What law are we ëdelivered fromí? Paul tells us... 7:1 ...for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet. Isnít this one of the 10 commandments? Question: Why is it whenever the Bible uses words like law & commandment along with terms like do & keep, Adventists say that is referring to the 10 commandments exclusively; but whenever the Bible uses these words along with phrases like ìdelivered fromî or ìnot underî, they insist it is referring to everything but the 10 commandments? Here is every occurrence of the phrase ì ten commandmentsî in the Bible: Ex. 34:28; Deut. 4:13; Deut. 10:4. As you can see, none of the New Testament writers ever made such distinction in their writings. |
