| Author | Message | ||
| Max |
I can answer you, Maryann, Neither your posts nor those of any other person (that I've personally read) have ever accused anyone of "obliterating the law of God." Max | ||
| Patti |
I wrote this post a few weeks ago in answer to some SDAs who were claiming that the law is still binding and use the following text as evidence: "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled." Notice it says that not one jot or tittle will pass from the law. This would necessarily include the sacrifices, the yearly and monthly sabbaths, circumcision, all of the rituals of cleanliness, EVERYTHING in the Torah. You see, we cannot merely pick and choose what is still binding upon believers and what is not. Jesus clearly says that NOTHING will pass from the law. NOTHING. But He does not stop there. "...till all be fulfilled." So we are left with only 2 choices here: 1. Jesus did not fulfill the law. In this case, then everything, every jot and tittle, every little fine point of the law is still binding upon the Christian. We should still sacrifice, follow the rules for cermonial cleanliness, not cut the corners of our beards, put the women outside the camp during their postpartum recovery, stone to death the adulterers and homosexuals, etc., etc. 2. Jesus fufilled the law and the prophets. If He did, then "ALL" has been fulfilled. The shadows have passed, the REALITY is here. "Behold I make all things new." We have a more certain word of prophecy now. We have the concrete, historical, finished and perfected work of Jesus Christ. When we have the Sun (Son), we are no longer living in the shadows. Jesus Christ is the fulfillment of ALL of the law. And by His singular obedience, the many (including you and me) are made righteous. By faith. By faith ALONE. By trusting in the efficacy and sufficiency of His work for us. Jesus stated that His mission was to fulfil the law and the prophets. When we question ourselves concerning our salvation, we do not ask, "Am I doing well enough to please God?" Instead we ask, "Was He successful? Did He perfectly accomplish this?" If not, then our all of our faith and our hopes are dashed to pieces. If not, then we must live by every jot and tittle of the Torah. We cannot merely pick and choose which part of the law we want to keep. (Hmmm. Let me see; I will take the Big Ten and a side dish of Leviticus 11. I don't care too much for Matthew, but I will take 1 Cor. 13) "For whoever breaks the least point of the law is guilty of it all." Of course, that is only IF we choose to believe that Christ DID NOT fulfil ALL of the law and the prophets on our behalf. But if we believe that He perfectly accomplished His mission, then the law has no claims on us. "There is no condemnation in Christ Jesus," and when we are in Christ, the law can make no accusation against us. "By the obedience of ONE, the many will be made righteous." We have fulfilled the law perfectly in Jesus Christ, and the accusations of the law are silenced forever. | ||
| Cindy |
Patti, This fulfillment of the law seems fairly easy to understand, doesn't it? So sad so many don't finish the thought of Jesus in this verse that says, "till all be FULFILLED." I was always taught, and had the emphasis put on, the words, "Think not that I am come to destroy the law and the prophets"; and, also, "till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law." End of message from Jesus!! But I see now how He is the fulfillment of everything commanded in the Law and promised in the Prophets!! An absolutely wonderful message of "It is Finished!" Grace always, Cindy | ||
| Patti |
AIN'T IT GRAND, CINDY?!!  | ||
| Max |
Any human theory which uses the righteousness of Christ as a cover for sin is unscriptural and antiscriptural. Here's what Scripture has to say: NIV Romans 6: 1 What shall we say, then? Shall we go on sinning so that grace may increase? 2 By no means! We died to sin; how can we live in it any longer? 3 Or don't you know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4 We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life. 5 If we have been united with him like this in his death, we will certainly also be united with him in his resurrection. 6 For we know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves to sin-- 7 because anyone who has died has been freed from sin. 8 Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. Blessings! | ||
| Cindy |
It definitely is grand, Patti!! And we can rejoice in this most excellent finished work of Christ!! From 2 Corinthians 3: "SUCH CONFIDENCE AS THIS IS OURS THROUGH CHRIST BEFORE GOD. NOT THAT WE ARE COMPETENT IN OURSELVES TO CLAIM ANYTHING FOR OURSELVES, BUT OUR COMPETENCE COMES FROM GOD!" "HE HAS MADE US COMPETENT AS MINISTERS OF A NEW COVENANT--NOT OF THE LETTER BUT OF THE SPIRIT; FOR THE LETTER KILLS, BUT THE SPIRIT GIVES LIFE!!" and..."NOW THE LORD IS THE SPIRIT, AND WHERE THE SPIRIT OF THE LORD IS, THERE IS FREEDOM!!!!" Grace always, Cindy | ||
| Patti |
So true! Because our hope is not based upon anything inside of us, but upon the worthiness of the Lamb! | ||
| Max |
Any human theory which seeks to use St. Paul's proclamation of freedom in Christ as an excuse for lawlessness and as a license to sin is horribly misusing the text. For NIV 2 Corinthians 7:1-4 says: ^^Since we have these promises, dear friends, let us PURIFY ourselves from everything that CONTAMINATES body and spirit, perfecting holiness out of reverence for God. ^^Make room for us in your hearts. We have WRONGED no one, we have CORRUPTED no one, we have EXPLOITED no one.^^ Blessings to all! | ||
| Max |
On the one hand any human idea that our hope is based on anything other than Jesus Christ is anti-scriptural. Here's Scripture: NIV Colossians 1: 21 Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your EVIL BEHAVIOR. 22 But now he has reconciled you by Christ's physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation-- 23 if you continue in your faith, established and firm, not moved from the HOPE held out in the gospel. This is the gospel that you heard and that has been proclaimed to every creature under heaven, and of which I, Paul, have become a servant. More next post. | ||
| Max |
On the other hand, Scripture is equally adamant that Jesus Christ IS within us! Here's proof: NIV John 17: 20 "My prayer is not for them alone. I pray also for those who will believe in me through their message, 21 that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me. 22 I have given them the glory that you gave me, that they may be one as we are one: 23 I in them and you in me. May they be brought to complete unity to let the world know that you sent me and have loved them even as you have loved me. Blessings! | ||
| Max |
God bless you Patti, Cindy and Maryann! It's been sheer delight trading Scriptures with you! Max of the Cross | ||
| Rayna |
Max, if you believe that Jesus is in you then you must be sinless. But you see he dwells in our hearts only by faith in the truth of the gospel. Jesus is in heaven before the throne of God. We are still sinners in this life, even with the Holy Spirit present in our lives. And I do believe that the righteousness of Jesus does cover our sinfulness before God. If not, we will stand alone in our sin before God. We will always be sinners in this life. Are you a sinner Max??? Then the righteousness of Jesus must cover your sinfulness before God. If you get to the point that you do not need the righteousness of Jesus to cover your sinfulness, you don't need Jesus. This is the religion of the Jewish Pharisees. I am afraid I am still the publican. I trust only in the mercy of God alone for the sake of Jesus. | ||
| Rayna |
This is definitely where we differ. But I agree to disagree. Rayna | ||
| Max |
Morning Rayna, Can a person delink or separate the righteousness of Christ from the sinlessness of Christ? Especially when Scripture does not delink or separate them? "The law ... can never ... make perfect [sinless] those who ... worship." Hebrews 10:1. But, "By one sacrifice he [Christ] has made perfect [sinless] forever those who are being made holy." Hebrews 10:14. Now does one not deny Christ and his sacrifice if s/he denies the truth of these two Scriptures? How can one say s/he is righteous by faith alone but not sinless [perfect] by faith alone? How can one claim the righteousness of Christ by faith alone but not the sinlessness of Christ by faith alone? The righteousness of Christ = the perfection of Christ = the sinlessness of Christ, inseparable forever. And it is the whole package -- righteousness / perfection / sinlessness -- all of Christ alone by my faith alone that I believe. For, by one sacrifice Christ has made sinless forever those who are being made holy. This grace is real and pure and not entangled with my own sinfullness / imperfection / unrighteousness. Nothing in my hand I bring, simply to the cross I cling. If I claim the righteousness of Christ by faith alone, but not the sinlessness of Christ by faith alone, then I am missing out on the fullness of God's grace alone. | ||
| Patti |
The Law of Jesus did not replace the Law of Moses. Grace replaced law. Salvation has never come by law. It is by the mercy of God ONLY, in forgiving unworthy sinners. Gal. 3:21 For if a law had been given that could impart life, then righteousness would certainly have come by the law. 22 But the Scripture declares that the whole world is a prisoner of sin, so that what was promised, being given through faith in Jesus Christ, might be given to those who believe. 23 Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed. 24 So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law. (ANY law!) Don't let anyone put you back under the domination of the law. The law only brings condemnation and death. Grace saves completely. sola fide (faith alone) sola gratia (grace--mercy--alone) sola Christe (Christ--not the work of the Holy Spirit in us--alone) | ||
| Max |
Galatians 21:23-25 does not support the contention that "The Law of Jesus did not replace the Law of Moses." The law of Jesus is the law of love written not on stony tablets but on the fleshy tablets of our hearts. This is a spiritual reality which permits Paul to write later in the same epistle: NIV Galatians 6: 1 Brothers, if someone is caught in a sin, you who are spiritual should restore him gently. But watch yourself, or you also may be tempted. 2 Carry each other's burdens, and in this way you will fulfill the law of Christ. 3 If anyone thinks he is something when he is nothing, he deceives himself. 4 Each one should test his own actions. Then he can take pride in himself, without comparing himself to somebody else, 5 for each one should carry his own load. 6 Anyone who receives instruction in the word must share all good things with his instructor. 7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. 9 Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up. 10 Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, especially to those who belong to the family of believers. | ||
| Patti |
Gal. 3:21 For if a law had been given that could impart life, then righteousness would certainly have come by the law. | ||
| Max |
The law was not given to impart life. It was given to drive us to life. That life is Christ. Life is made possible in us by his death. Thus ์is Christ in you, the hope of glory.๎ Colossians 1:27.๎ | ||
| Colleentinker |
Hebrews 7:12 says, "For when there is a change of the priesthood [Levitical priesthood to Jesus, the Melchizedek priesthood], there must also be a change of the law." And Hebrews 8:10 quotes Jeremiah 31:31-34 when it says, "I will put my laws in their minds and write them on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people." And Jesus said, "A new command I give you: love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another." (John 13:34) I really want to plead with us all not to embroil ourselves in arguments about words and definitions and theology. The single most important thing for us all to proclaim is that we are saved by the grace of Jesus through faith in him--alone. And our lives are never the same again when we have allowed the Holy Spirit to give us a new birth, because He writes his law--himself--on our hearts and teaches us how to live. We live by the power of the Holy Spirit after that, even though we are forever (until the second coming) imprisoned in sinful flesh which is always in tension with the Holy Spirit who has brought us to life and who works in us. We will always have sinful flesh pushing us to do things we don't want to do. And we will continually find ourselves doing things we don't want to do. But God works with us, even with our sinful flesh, and he sees us as righteous because we've accetped him. And he works in us to change us to become more and more what He wants us to be. The two realities co-exist: we have sinful flesh which pushes us to sin, and we have an indwelling Holy Spirit who continually works in us to help us submit everything to God and to learn to live in trust and rest and intimacy with Him. Praise God that he saves us and accepts us as we are: sinners! And praise God that he doesn't abandon us to our sins but continually, gradually, changes us according to his sovereign will. In His love, Colleen | ||
| Max |
Christ in us is like hunger. It's always there. We can resist for awhile. But eventually it must be satisfied. Else we'll starve to death. |
