| Author | Message | ||
| Pheeki (Pheeki) |
Did I mention my non-preacher brother who was no religon since he left high school? OH, he was schooled 100% SDA until the last 2 years of HS but then rejected all of it. Anyway, he went through a divorce later in life and started searching. He decided to return to the SDA church but first he was going to ask some questions. He asked the pastor of a rather large SDA church here if the church taught EGW was a prophet. The pastor said, "She never said to call her a prophet, people did that." He then asked, "Do I have to read her books?" He said, "Of course not, but if you do, do not read her compilations because people have taken her writings and placed them out of context." He joined and they don't talk about EGW at all at this church. It is a pretty grace oriented church, they wear jewelry, have outings on Sabbath, progressive music... Still I feel he was misled. He told me he doesn't give a damn about EGW he just goes there. He doesn't even know anything about what she said in her writings, etc. I will tell him some of the things she wrote and he says "what?!" He has totally blocked out (forgot) what we learned in elementary school, etc. He has always done what he wanted on Sabbath, shopping, tv. He said he used to think I was being legalistic. So, yet we have another example of people in a church and they have no idea what it really represents. I do have to say that my brother has his own relationship with Jesus and seems to be doing very well spiritually but he doesn't rely on the SDA for that. I am sure there are lots more like him. | ||
| Colleentinker (Colleentinker) |
There are, Pheeki. The thing that concerns me about them is that they are proclaiming loyalty to something that they do not understand. Such Adventists are still bound by the spirit of Adventism, and they have trouble looking critically at the organization they support by their membership. They also have trouble reading the Bible without an unconscious Adventist interpretation informing them. If they really have a relationship with Jesus, though, He will gradually lead them to increasing knowledge and integrity. Doug, I share your reactions to that article. It is, of course, official Review loyalty. I totally agree with your assessment of the Adventist gospel, too. When I was an Adventist, the three angels' message always confused me. Somehow those texts never seemed to say what Adventists said they said. Wow, I get a sort-of breathless heaviness in my stomach when I read articles like that. They bring back years of confusion, guilt, annoyance, etc. I am so thankful that there really is absolute truth and that The Truth has chosen me and called me and all of us to Himself! Colleen | ||
| Pheeki (Pheeki) |
well said Doug222. The stained glass window at the SDA church I attend is not a picture of Christ but...drum roll...the 3 Angels! So they are commissioned to preach the everlasting Gospel but they interpret that to be keeping the 10 Commandments, particuarly the 4th (because we all know everyone else ignores that one)but what they don't realize that Jesus didn't teach the 10 Commandments (they had keepers of the Law to do that)and the apostles did not teach the Law, why do they? | ||
| Susan_2 (Susan_2) |
Doug, I read that Review article, too, only in my moms magazine. Most of what is put out by Pacific Press makes and logical sense. The conclusions on any given topi just jump from here to there, no logical flow to a conclusion. | ||
| Roseheartgirl (Roseheartgirl) |
Yes Pheeki an Doug222, you put what the 3 Angels message means to SDA's in a nut shell keeping the 10 commandandments with the 4th commandment comming in the middle which contains the seal of God( though dosn't the 5th commandment come in the middle?). Throw in the health message( which almost killed me as a child) with it, and their imputed righteous by faith theology; that you can become perfect.( I don't think so!) Enable to become perfect; keep the ten commandments especially the 4th one; along with the health message which will give you a clear mind to discern how to keep the 10 commandments. Oh wow! this is really confusing isn't it, and to follow along with. Oh yeah you also got to throw in EGW in there somewhere to, just to make it a little more confusing. I think that alomst covers it. I am sure gald I don't believe in such confusion anymore. | ||
| Loneviking (Loneviking) |
And don't forget the swipe at the idea of an eternal hell and immortality of the soul. Never mind that the major cries of alarm over the New Age are coming from the Evangelical/Fundamentalist side of the Christian community---they are still about to be duped! I am amazed at the stupidity and effontry of SDA authors who think they are the 'end all and be all' of Christianity. I'm glad I very rarely have the Review show up in my mail box as I wind up seething about something in it every time! | ||
| James_Jean (James_Jean) |
It seems strange to me that the Adventist church has problems displaying the cross, but goes out of it's way to display the three angels'. Even in there teaching the three angels' take center stage over the cross. I have to remind the group of Adventist that I meet with on Tue. mourning what Paul had to say in the following verses. I Cor.1:17; Gal.6:12, 6:14 Eph.2:16; Phil.3:18. The Cross of Christ divides the world into two camps, the belivers on the right and non-belivers on the left. This was symbolically acted out at the crucifixion of Christ. So let's take up our cross and follow Him. Yours in Christ James | ||
| Lori (Lori) |
THE REAL GOSPEL (in one text!) blows the Adventist death theory. John 3:16 "For God loved the world so much that he gave His one and only Son that anyone who believes in him shall never perish but have eternal life." The concept of "eternal life" is life that has no ending. It also says that we shall never perish---to believe in soul death you have to believe that you perish--temporarily, yes, but nonetheless you perished!! Without this insertion--never perish--you could possibly accept the concept of soul death by postponing the gift of eternal life until after the return of Christ. However this is not the case. It states "you shall never perish". The phrase "shall not perish but have eternal life" does not just denote salvation!! It offers us something else!!! Something that is unshakeable!! It says, "you have eternal security IN ME from the moment you believe"!!! | ||
| Sabra (Sabra) |
Doug, It almost looks to me like the man is trying to convince himself. I think the Holy Spirit is trying to get through to these people but they can't even hear Him. So they go back and forth in their minds and write these weird articles. | ||
| Colleentinker (Colleentinker) |
Lori, great point! Thank you! Colleen | ||
| Sabra (Sabra) |
oops, I posted that on the wrong thread! How did I do that? | ||
| Susan_2 (Susan_2) |
Yesterday at the SDA churh I picked up a brouchure printed by the North American Division ofSDA' titled, "What's a Seventh-day Adventist"? I thought after all these years I'd like to know. On the page titled, "Believing" it says this, "Adventists believe a Trinity of three persons-the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit-make up one God. THEY (emphasis mine) made salvation possible when Jesus, the Son, came to earth as a baby in Bethlhem and lived a sinless life in accordance with the Father's will. When Jesus was crucified for the sins of the people of the world and arose from the dead on the third day, victory was won for everyone". Then it continues, "When he returned to heaven following the resurrection, Jesus left behind the Holy Spirit to serve as our comforter and counseer. He promised to return to earth a second time TO COMPLETE HIS PLAN OF SALVATION and take His people to heaven. Adventists are among the believers who look forward to that day". Then it goes on to say that the early founders of the SDA church "rediscovered" the Sabbath. Then the brouchure ends with a bragfest of how many health institutions they have, how many schools and their awsome plublishing endevours. But, I believe that God, the Triune God is not to be referred to as THEY but rather as He. And, what about that part that the second coming of Jesus is to complete His plan of salvation. I really think this green, glossy and beautifully printed brouchure when read carefully would lead someone to not want to join in with the SDA rather than encouraging them to become SDA. If any of you want one of these brouchures you can probably pick one up at your local SDA church and read it for yourself. Or, you can e-mail me (Colleen, I was thinking of you) your U.S. Postal Address and next week I'll grab one for you and mail it. Let me know what you think about this brouchure. | ||
| Denisegilmore (Denisegilmore) |
Susan, You stated in part: ""Adventists believe a Trinity of three persons-the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit-make up one God. THEY (emphasis mine) made salvation possible when Jesus, the Son, came to earth as a baby in Bethlhem and lived a sinless life in accordance with the Father's will." In Genesis 1:26, The Triune God says: "Let 'US' make man in 'OUR' image, in 'OUR' likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground." That is likely the reason they say what they say. Who knows? Just a thought. As to the rest of their stuff....ummmm, no comment. NO COMMENT my right eye! Their statement (so well hidden in the text of the article) of "To complete His Plan of Salvation." is BOLOGNA. Jesus said: "IT IS FINISHED" Peace IN Christ Jesus! denise | ||
| Susan_2 (Susan_2) |
Denise, you sure are one sharp cookeie! I had not thought of that text, "Let us make man in our image". Except for that text I have not ever heard of the Triune God referred to in the plural form, only the singular. Do we have any totally super Bible scholars on this forum that can clear this up? I am now courious about that. And, yes, te statement about finishng the work of salvation a sentnce hidden in a paragraph about what SDA's believe.The brouchure really irritated me when I read that the early SDA founders "redicovered" the Sabbath. This is not true. they only discovered it for thmeselves, having learned of Sabbath observance from the Seventh-day Baptists who had by that time been observing a Saturday Sabbath for around 400 years. | ||
| Colleentinker (Colleentinker) |
The Old Testament is clear that God is One. The interesting thing about the name "Elohim" which is often used for God in the OT (Richard learned this in his men's Bible study on the names of God) is that is is a singular Hebrew name, it is a name of God, but it requires a plural verb. God is a Trinity, but he is One. It's a paradox we cannot completely understand, but it is true. He's not three Gods; he's Three in One. He is One! Colleen | ||
| Susan_2 (Susan_2) |
Colleen, have you seen the brouchure I mentioned? If you want it then you can e-mail me a mailing address and I will send it to you. Referring to the Father, The Son and the Holy Spirit the brouchure states,"THEY made salvation possible when Jesus, the Son came to earth as a baby in Bethlehem and lived a sinless life in accordance with the Father's will". Then it goes on to say,"He promised to return to earth a second time TO COMPLETE HIS PLAN OF SALVATION and take his people to heaven." Everyone on here should arm themselves with one of these brouchures so when speeking to our SDA loved ones we can point out what the SDA church says it believes. | ||
| Colleentinker (Colleentinker) |
No, Susan, I haven't seen it. I totally believe you, though! I'll email you later! Colleen | ||
| Susan_2 (Susan_2) |
I have the current issue of The Signs of the Times in front of me. This is the April 2003 issue. Once again the SDA author is implying that Jesus was just like anyone else while He was on this earth. Let me share a paragraph with you. This is taken from an article titled, Making Sense of Death" on pages 10 & 11 written by author, Celeste perrino Walker. Here goes, "To me, salvation would still be awsome even if I thought that while Jesus was on earth He knew what He had to do and how it would end. Even if He had no doubts about His ability to carry the plan out, His going through with it would still have been an awsome sacrafice. However, I find it truly staggering that He had no such assurance. There was no safety net in place. If He failed, he would never see His Father again. He had no guranatees that there would be a happy ending". Now, to be this is BLASPHAMOUS!!!! Don't these people EVER read their Bibles? Any comments? Maybe you all can find the Signs on-line and read the entire article for yourselves. I read it because my mom gets it and I snuck her issue home so I could copy that paragraph on here to share with you on this forum. It's o.k. as I know she will be very happy that I took a SDA publication home with me to read. | ||
| Sabra (Sabra) |
Hmmmm, since He didn't have a clue, wonder why He told the disciple BEFOREHAND that He would rise the on the 3rd day! | ||
| Susan_2 (Susan_2) |
Not only that, but what about the prophecies in Isiah telling of the coming Messiah? And, then the Christmas story? The wise men and the shepherds bowed down to worship the newborn King. And, the angel Gabriel (my sons name) told Mary and also told Joseph that she was with child, the child being our Saviour. There are numerous instances in the Bible, both OT and NT that make the Divinity of Jesus quite plain. However, the SDA denomination persists teaching that Jesus was fully man and didn't become Divine until after HIS resurrection. This is probaly the most of all the SDA doctrines that just makes me want to throw up when I think of the UNtruths promoted by the SDA church. The rest I can deal weith butnot this one because it totally denies Jesus being God. |
