| Author | Message | ||
| Praisegod Registered user Username: Praisegod Post Number: 72 Registered: 3-2004 |
Sharon, I believe many of us just "stumbled" across this site. Don't you love God's coincidences? A hearty FAF welcome! Praise God... | ||
| Kme Registered user Username: Kme Post Number: 31 Registered: 7-2000 |
Welcome, Sharon. I believe I can speak for all of us formers and say that we have felt those same feelings. However, don't be surprised if you experence waves of anger as well as compassion. All of our hearts grieve for someone still entangled in that web of deception! I believe you'll find much support and compassion here. There are some very interesting stories of how people stumbled onto this site. I for one was part of another 7th day keeping congregation when we decided maybe keeping the Holy Days was not a requirement after all! Finally, someone from that church sent me an article about people who have left the SDA church and still remained Christian instead of giving up on God all together and it gave this web address. (Incidently, this 7th day church thought that SDA's had really comprimised their position on several doctrines in order to be recognized as an Evangelical church!) It is difficult to not have any particular group to identify with as member. There is a certain sense of security knowing that you belong to a World-wide organization that you can call on from wherever you might be, even if you don't agree with their theology. I got to the point however, that I no longer wanted to be counted in their numbers to impress people with! Have a blessed day and weekend! Praise God for choices. Kme | ||
| Kme Registered user Username: Kme Post Number: 32 Registered: 7-2000 |
Sorry Sharon. After re-reading your post. I realized you had left SDA church 10 years ago. I'm sure you're well ahead of me in progress! It's just been a few years for my family. Maybe your healthy view of things will be mine as well someday! Always glad for imput from different experiences. It's a learning process. Kme Kme | ||
| Tealeaves Registered user Username: Tealeaves Post Number: 28 Registered: 5-2004 |
I know a lot of people who go to what I call "SDA halfway house" type churches. CHurches that meet on Saturdays, are full of SDAs who are disappointed either with the experience of the SDA church, or the doctrines, but can't quite extricate themselves totally. My husband and I went to one of those for a while. The pastor used to be an SDA pastor but was booted because he wanted to pay part of his tithe directly to a charity of his choosing rather than to the SDA church. He also wanted to do a lot of outreach that the congregation didnt want to do. I just couldn't stay in that environment, though. It is certainly more healthy than the SDA environment, but seems to be saturated with a sadness, disillusionment, and confusion. It is like they are in a perpetual grieving process, or at the beginning realization stages of a 12-step program, and suffering from the "spiritual DTs". | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 97 Registered: 3-2004 |
It was not until I left the SDA church that I recognized how superior I felt. I missed that feeling so I wrote to a former SDA pastor and asked him about it. He said it was very common for SDAs to feel superior because they are in the "remnant" church and have the "truth". Now that I do not feel like that it is surprising how I can relate to other Christians. It is a nice warm feeling when I am talking to other Christians. I cannot explain it any other way. Diana | ||
| Qweary Registered user Username: Qweary Post Number: 5 Registered: 3-2004 |
Flyinglady, I just read your post # 97 and you're right on! I realize NOW what a superior attitude I had, too! We were RIGHT! The "Remnant" church had the "TRUTH"! We were THE ONES!! The church we have been attending these past 10 years has been a haven of hospitality as they were growing out of the CHURCH OF CHRIST denomination. When we first attended, they were just growing out of the "silent women" syndrome. I wanted them to CHANGE NOW!! I was used to leading out in Sab. School, song director,a teacher both in SDA church school and in the Sab. School. Had a lot of JUDGMENT adjusting to do, believe me!! They bore with us and a sweeter FAMILY you couldn't find!!! PTLord! What welcoming arms! They were a real lesson in LOVE for us. How wonderful to teach literacy with those sweet Catholic nuns! Go for a "Walk to Emmaus" with the Methodists. Listen to the 1st Baptist evangelist, Sing with the community choir for Easter and Xmas, Pray with the pastor of the Valley Christian Church across the street which joined us for "40 Days of Purpose." Praise the Lord for the hugs from the Lutherans!! Thank God for bringing us from the "SDA SHEEP Fold" to the Family of God!! We study the BIBLE alone among Brothers and Sisters in CHRIST. Praising the LORD! with you, Qweary | ||
| Qweary Registered user Username: Qweary Post Number: 8 Registered: 3-2004 |
Flyinglady, I just read your post # 97 and you're right on! I realize NOW what a superior attitude I had, too! We were RIGHT! The "Remnant" church had the "TRUTH"! We were THE ONES!! The church we have been attending these past 10 years has been a haven of hospitality as they were growing out of the CHURCH OF CHRIST denomination. When we first attended, they were just growing out of the "silent women" syndrome. I wanted them to CHANGE NOW!! I was used to leading out in Sab. School, song director,a teacher both in SDA church school and in the Sab. School. Had a lot of JUDGMENT adjusting to do, believe me!! They bore with us and a sweeter FAMILY you couldn't find!!! PTLord! What welcoming arms! They were a real lesson in LOVE for us. How wonderful to teach literacy with those sweet Catholic nuns! Go for a "Walk to Emmaus" with the Methodists. Listen to the 1st Baptist evangelist, Sing with the community choir for Easter and Xmas, Pray with the pastor of the Valley Christian Church across the street which joined us for "40 Days of Purpose." Praise the Lord for the hugs from the Lutherans!! Thank God for bringing us from the "SDA SHEEP Fold" to the Family of God!! We study the BIBLE alone among Brothers and Sisters in CHRIST. Praising the LORD! with you, Qweary | ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 334 Registered: 7-2003 |
Tealeaves, your pastor wasn't Bob Bretsch was he? Chris | ||
| Susan_2 Registered user Username: Susan_2 Post Number: 583 Registered: 11-2002 |
About the superior attitude because of being "in the truth". I know very personally many JW'S. The JW'S have a very superior attitude because everyone else is in Babylon. At least the SDA's consider Christians of other denominations Christian, just not as totally in all truth as themselves but the JW's see no more Christianity in a Lutheran, a Baptist, etc. than they do a Buddhist, a Hindu or an atheist. The JW's have what I call "code speek". They use the same termology as Christians but the words have completely different meanings. | ||
| Sharon2 Registered user Username: Sharon2 Post Number: 4 Registered: 6-2004 |
I have recently viewed a video on Heidi Baker, a missionary to Mozambic (sp) who has taken in and is raising more than 500 street children. The Lord told her not to ask for money, so she doesn't. He has miraculously provided. This woman has a PhD and is so unimpressed with herself. I saw her working in the streets, working in the dump, giving away everything she needs for her own family. She prays and the blind do see, the lame do walk, AIDS babies are healed without medication, food is multiplied, hostile crowds of Muslims stop in their tracks and come to the Lord! Then I saw her preaching in America, so full of the Holy Spirit that she was falling on the floor looking silly and drunk like the disciples when they came out of the upper room on Pentecost. I want that kind of abandonment in the Lord--that I don't care what other people think or say because I am the Lord's ridiculously faith-filled servant and I do anything He asks attitude. The power of God can work through that kind of humility. It's been more than 10 years and I have come a long way from my Adventist--let's act superior and be controlled by our well-educated intellect attitude. I am so happy in the Lord and I want more! Today was a great Sabbath. Sharon | ||
| Tealeaves Registered user Username: Tealeaves Post Number: 30 Registered: 5-2004 |
Chris, yes, It iss Bob Bretsch, do you know him? I haven't been to his current church for years now, but I have a friend who goes to that church even now. Do you live in this area as well? | ||
| Kme Registered user Username: Kme Post Number: 42 Registered: 7-2000 |
Tealeaves I might know his son. Does he have a son named Don? Kme | ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 335 Registered: 7-2003 |
Yes, I know pastor Bretsch. He was our pastor at College View Church in Lincoln, NE before moving to the NW. I have followed his career since then via the intranet and I currently get his weekly newsletter from The Center. I'm not quite sure where Bob stands on sabbatarianism. His congregation still meets on Saturdays, but he regularly refers to it as "Saturday" as opposed to "Sabbath" in his newletter. I would be interested to sit down and have a discussion with him sometime. It's interesting, my SDA in-laws were very good friends with Bob and Bev when they lived in Lincoln and now they won't speak of him at all. Chris | ||
| Dennis Registered user Username: Dennis Post Number: 85 Registered: 4-2000 |
Chris, According to his weekly newsletters, it appears to me that Bob Bretsch is still transitioning away from Adventism. He is trying to arrive at a comfortable theology that his old semi-SDA friends and his new non-SDA friends can embrace without much objection. The future of his church, Bob claims, is not with SDA holdovers. However, for the short term, he apparently doesn't want to discourage their legalism (i.e., tithing and sabbathing). They are vital to his church budget. I think the term "halfway house" fits well. It would be a difficult task to keep both sides happy. My assumption is that he no longer upholds the SDA Sabbath, food laws, soul sleep, etc. I think he finds it necessary to temporarily "babysit" a few disgruntled Adventists. Dennis J. Fischer | ||
| Dennis Registered user Username: Dennis Post Number: 86 Registered: 4-2000 |
PS: Interestingly, Bob Bretsch and I have preached in many of the same SDA churches in eastern North Carolina. He arrived there as an intern after I had transferred to the Georgia-Cumberland Conference. Bev is from the Charlotte area. --DJF | ||
| Tealeaves Registered user Username: Tealeaves Post Number: 32 Registered: 5-2004 |
Bob Bretsch is a great guy. We really like him, hea has a good heart. We keep in touch from time to time. It would definitely be interesting to sit down with him and really talk about his beliefs. I know at least one family currently in his church that, as far as I know, still consider themselves SDA. They used to teach in the SDA church etc. I don't think they were "disgruntled" with the SDA church, I think they were just following their heart, and looking to experience God in a new way.I think they still feel good about attending on Ssturdays. But the avoidance of the SDA doctrinal issues etc is what leads me to get that "SDA halfway house" feeling. It is like everybody tries to pretend there isn't an elephant in the middle of the floor. They just walk around it, and hope it doesn't poop on the rug, forcing them to acknowlege it. I get the impression that the SDA church doesn't know what to do with the pastors who leave the SDA church and start evangelical churches based on their convictions. They want to label everyone leaving the SDA church as "disgruntled and injured" but that just isn't always the case. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 277 Registered: 12-2003 |
I interviewed Bob Bretsch in 97, I believe, when Adventist Today did a story about his church. That was seven years ago, and even then I had that sense of his being entangled in the cling-on beliefs and attachments of Adventism. It's interesting to hear that apparently that same "feeling" continues. I really do believe that when people leave Adventism, they ultimately have to give up to Jesus all the "sacred cows" before they can experience true freedom. Because of the spirit of deception that underlies SDA doctrines, all of the Adventist practices (such as Sabbath, required tithing in order to be blessed, etc.) are spiritually tainted for one who comes out of the church. Leaving the practices means leaving the subtle fear that they might really be required. I believe God ultimately calls each of us to trust only Him and to leave behind the marks of what we once thought constituted salvation. By the way, welcome, Sharon2! Colleen | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 108 Registered: 3-2004 |
I just realized the other night how long God has been working on me. I quit paying tithe a long time ago because every time I got a raise in pay my rent went up also. Then when I paid my tithe, I would have to pay a late fee with my bills. I did not pray about paying tithe, but I remember thinking that God wants me to pay my bills. As for keeping the Sabbath, I quit that a long time ago also. I had chronic fatigue syndrome and had only enough energy to go to work. That meant that on weekends I needed to shop and do housework as well as rest up to go to work on Monday. The way I see it now is that God was preparing me for the change I have made. I was blessed and never without a job, even though I was very sick. As I look back on that period of time I think of the story of the footprints in the sand. God was carrying me all that time and still does sometimes. Praise God for His goodness. God is awesome. Diana | ||
| Melissa Registered user Username: Melissa Post Number: 341 Registered: 7-2003 |
Tithing is a hold-over even non-SDA churches struggle wih. Just this past year my pastor has come to realize the tithe is no longer for the church. I have a friend who was telling about another local church that never teaches tithing....they said their giving would go down because people are taught to give as God directs. And in some, that means more than 10%. Now that was an interesting thought... I also found considerable freedom with my giving when I stopped trying to be rigid about percentages. I found God knew my means... isn't that funny! I'm always amazed when i think I surprise God. I'm glad I can laugh at my silliness and stupidity. It is amazing to realize, Diana, that it has been God carrying us all along.... | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 284 Registered: 12-2003 |
Amen, Diana and Melissa! God is carrying us even when it seems like we're not in a tight spot. I wonder what we'll discover when we can leave time and see everything about our lives from an eternal perspective. Colleen |
