| Author | Message | ||
| Krista Registered user Username: Krista Post Number: 31 Registered: 8-2004 |
As I unravel the SDA doctrines to find the truth, an interesting subject to me is heaven, where SDAs say we will all keep the sabbath. A friend recently gave me some verses in Revelation about this.... any other ideas to help to explain there is no sunset in heaven? Thx!  | ||
| Helovesme2 Registered user Username: Helovesme2 Post Number: 33 Registered: 8-2004 |
How about Rev. 21:25 "On no day will its gates ever be shut, for there will be no night there." helovesme2 | ||
| Melissa Registered user Username: Melissa Post Number: 539 Registered: 7-2003 |
Not only is there no sunset, there is no need for the sun or the moon because the glory of God light the city. Rev. 21:23 and 22:5. Does that mean there is no sun or moon...if so, how are days to even be counted since there is no night? | ||
| Dd Registered user Username: Dd Post Number: 170 Registered: 7-2004 |
Krista, Does your friend say we will keep Sabbath in Heaven? If so, what verses were used to support this belief? Loves and Melissa, Thanks for the great verses. Are there any others? | ||
| Vchowdhury1 Registered user Username: Vchowdhury1 Post Number: 58 Registered: 7-2004 |
Now, In what is my understanding, when I was in the sda church, is that what was meant by saying that "everyday will be sabbath" is that we will spend everyday of eternity worshiping the Lord. Now, of course, I don't know if this is biblical, it could be something out of egw, but it sounds logical because when we get to heaven, we will always be in the presence of the Lord. Also, in heaven there will be no sorrow, no sickness, no death, etc. And, a lot of us will be re-united with those loved ones who had passed on, AND we have eternal life so how can we help NOT to worship everyday. I think by saying that it will be "sabbath" everyday is speaking of perpetual worship. I don't think that it has anything to do with sunsets or a physical day. I think it will be a "mind set" more than anything else. In fact, people who attend church on Sunday say the same thing. But of course they are talking about worshiping, not really a physical day because some people who go to church on Sunday actually "keep it" almost exactly like some people "keep" the Saturday "sabbath". There is an old Gospel song called "Walk Around Heaven All Day". In one of the verses it says "every day will be Sunday, sabbath will have no end..." | ||
| Melissa Registered user Username: Melissa Post Number: 540 Registered: 7-2003 |
I know B says we will keep THE 7th day sabbath in heaven and points to a text in Isaiah to "prove" it. I believe I have heard other SDAs say they were taught the same thing. When asked about the verses above, he acknowledges he doesn't know how they will keep time, but insists the 7th day sabbath is eternal. | ||
| Vchowdhury1 Registered user Username: Vchowdhury1 Post Number: 60 Registered: 7-2004 |
I would really like to see that text in Isaiah, IF it really exists. Sda's were "taught" a lot of things that proved to be wrong. Could the interpretation of this text be something out of the egw interpreted Clear Word Bible? I would not be surprised. | ||
| Helovesme2 Registered user Username: Helovesme2 Post Number: 34 Registered: 8-2004 |
The verse so often quoted is, Isaiah 66:23 "From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come and bow down before me," says the LORD." helovesme2 | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 834 Registered: 12-2003 |
Notice that the (in)famous Isaiah verse also says we will bow down from one New Moon to another, as well. Yet we know that 2 Peter 3:10-13 says that when all is ended, the heavens will disappear with a roar, and the elements will be destroyed by fire and will melt in the heat. The heavens also will be destoryed by fire. Revelation 21:1 says there will be a new heaven and a new earth because the first ones had passed away, and there will be no more sea. When we are finally physically redeemed and the kingdom of heaven is completely established, what we experience in the physical world will be completely different. We don't really have a clue what it will be like, but we do know that everything we see in the solar system and on this planet will be destroyed. We cannot superimpose a weekly Sabbath onto the texts that proclaim there will be no night, no sun, and that the heavens will be destroyed and made new. But then, the New Moon festivals as well as the weekly Sabbath were shadows of Christ; the reality is found in Jesus. (Colossians 2:16) So, in a non-literal sense, we will be observing the New Moons and the Sabbaths--we'll be observing them by experiencing the eternal Sabbath of being in the physical as well as the spiritual presence of Christ. We are so limited in our understanding, stuck as we are in time and in three dimensions! But God has revealed all we need to know for life and godliness. (2 Peter 1:3) Colleen | ||
| 33ad Registered user Username: 33ad Post Number: 58 Registered: 10-2004 |
Valerie, When Jesus returns, time ends. We will not count days, weeks, years or centuries. For God, time does not exist. He is in the Future and the past at the same time, No begining and no end. It's a very difficult concept for our finite created minds to grasp. But I think Isaiah 66 is referring to what Paul refers to in Hebrews 4:9,10 "There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; for anyone who enters God's rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from his." I believe that creation will be purified by the fire of the Last Judgment at the moment of the glorious Advent of our Saviour Jesus Christ and that it will be restored and regenerated and that it will constitute a New Creation, according to the promise of the Lord: "Behold, I make all things new" (Rev. 21.5). "New heavens and a new earth wherein dwelleth righteousness" (II Peter 3:13).Then we enter our "Sabbath Rest". And it's not the SDA Sabbath. Praise God! Loren | ||
| Melissa Registered user Username: Melissa Post Number: 541 Registered: 7-2003 |
I agree Colleen and Loren. Every time I read that Isaiah text, I always have the same thought: It's really no different than saying from week to week or month to month we will be praising God, not once a week or once a month. Basically every day week to week, month to month. It doesn't even seem natural in it's extracted state to try to use that to say it's talking about a weekly or monthly observance, but a continual situation. And that doesn't even consider the context isn't even talking about heaven, if you read the verses around it. | ||
| Pheeki Registered user Username: Pheeki Post Number: 405 Registered: 1-2003 |
Actually, Hebrews 4 says we enter God's Sabbath rest the minute we believe the Gospel. | ||
| Sabra Registered user Username: Sabra Post Number: 234 Registered: 10-2001 |
I'm pretty sure Is. 66 is talking about the new earth. Remember the Sabbath was given to Israel. Israel was told that the Sabbath would be for all their generations. God knew they wouldn't accept Jesus (as a nation) so He spoke correctly in saying that it would be for all generations. The Isaiah passage also says that anyone living under a hundred will be uncommon and babies wont die and the animals will get along, no more war etc...... This is not heaven. I don't know, but I can't find anywhere in the bible that Israel ever goes to heaven and in fact, they don't even teach such a thing. They are promised that land and that is their inheritance. I beleive that the followers of Christ go to heaven for 7 years and return with Christ to rule and reign with Him on the earth over the cities and towns according to our rewards. I believe that we are citizens of heaven but given resurrected bodies so that we can minister on earth. What else would we need resurrected bodies for? Looks like during the millineum there are people being born still and dying and life is going on here with Jesus as King. And it looks like the Jewish people are still observing the Sabbath and feasts, not real sure. It all makes sense to me that way. I'm open for any other interpretations. | ||
| Sabra Registered user Username: Sabra Post Number: 235 Registered: 10-2001 |
I meant to say the milleneum, not new earth, sorry | ||
| 33ad Registered user Username: 33ad Post Number: 59 Registered: 10-2004 |
Of course you're right Pheeki;-) | ||
| Krista Registered user Username: Krista Post Number: 32 Registered: 8-2004 |
Great posts! Very interesting. Dd, my friend said that there wouldn't be a weekly sabbath in heaven.. (Rev. 21:22-25 and Rev. 22:5). 33ad, I've always understood that there will no longer be "time" as we know it, but you really described it well. I truly believe the Bible and I love this verse: 1 Corinthians 2:9 ~ "But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him." | ||
| Pw Registered user Username: Pw Post Number: 166 Registered: 6-2004 |
I don't think a sabbath will be observed in the new earth either, mainly due to the issues written about no longer having a sun. Therefore time will not be a 24 hour day and night situation because there will be no night either. Whatever the case may be, being there is all that matters! | ||
| Susan_2 Registered user Username: Susan_2 Post Number: 1033 Registered: 11-2002 |
I just finished reading the Hawaii SDA Conference website. They have a link to accessing the sunset and sunrise tables. So I went to that. It says to calculate your exact sunrise and sunset times in Hawaii you first have to know your exact longatude and latitude. Then you get the math formulas to do the calculations. Now, honestly, don't you all out there in Cyberland think this is a bit much? Can't the Hawaii'an SDA's just look at the sky and see for themselves if it is the Sabbath or not? Are they really expected to do all that math? | ||
| Raven Registered user Username: Raven Post Number: 63 Registered: 7-2004 |
Well, Susan, they could... But don't you remember the old days, especially as a restless teenager, when you had to know the exact second of sundown? Sometimes I've compared the "official sundown" time with the sky, and it's often still a bit light out. In fact, that reminds me... when my mom was in our home to stay with our daughters a year ago this past summer because we were out of town, she was there over a Friday night. Our kids have never observed the Sabbath in our home and they were watching TV. I had warned them about how Grandma would want Sabbath observed and they needed to respect her wishes. When we returned, it was hilarious to hear our younger daughter complain that Grandma wanted that TV off because it was "sundown" when it wasn't even dark out yet! I had forgot to explain to them that sundown according to the "sunset calendar" does not mean it's dark! | ||
| Doc Registered user Username: Doc Post Number: 147 Registered: 2-2003 |
If you need to know the exact second of sundown, then is it when the rim of the sun touches the horizon, or when the upper tip finally disappears, or is it when the sun is exactly half way down? It is very important to know these things. When I talked to DÈnes, he asked me about the Isaiah passage, and about the ark of the covenant still being in heaven in Rev 15: 5. I had forgotten about there being no sun and no night in the eternal state, so that is useful. This all strikes me as incredible hair-splitting, but anyone have an answer to the ark in heaven question? I suppose it could just be a symbol for the concept of "covenant," because God then pours his wrath out on the earth which has rejected him - based on the new covenant in this case. Just pondering the answer to my own question. Thanks, Adrian |
