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Message |
Theycallmegrace
Registered user
Username: Theycallmegrace
Post Number: 1
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, November 11, 2004 - 9:58 pm: |     |
Hi all.
(Quick word about my username. When I first brought to my study group what I had found in scripture of the gospel of grace, I got nicknamed, "Grace"! Was this supposed to be an insult? I've always been confused about that : )
I've enjoyed reading your posts and look forward to becoming a part of this community. Many of you have already been through what I went through tonight. It was tough. I had sent my "Personal Testimony" (should be posted on the site soon) to my pastor and he came to visit tonight. He didn't seem to hear or understand what I was saying, and I had to be a little more forceful than I wanted to get him to remove my membership. I'm sure we both knew it was the right thing to do, but he kept trying to convince me that what I believed was compatible with sdaism and that I was just "having questions". I had to say (more than once), "No! I know what I believe even though I continue to study. I know I do not believe what I must in order to honestly call myself a SDA." (Frankly, I don't think he does either. The deeper I got in this thing, the more I realized so many in the church aren't sure what they believe or what membership means.)
Anyway, after he left, my husband went almost straight to bed. (The whole thing has slap wore him out and caused quite a bit of stress between us, but we are adjusting. He's still a member.) I was tense and anxious at first, worrying that I had signed my way out of heaven and into hell. Then, strangely, I began to feel almost giddy with joy. Then, as I went back to the scriptures, I found reassurance (Gal. 5:1) I still hesitate, I'll admit, so conditioned to "work". So fearful of being "deceived" as many around me no doubt feel I am. Please pray for me. (I promise not to always be so long-winded!) |
33ad
Registered user
Username: 33ad
Post Number: 116
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 1:14 am: | |
Welcome 'Grace',
Here we think that's an honorable name! I've been where you are now. It's tough, but Jesus is always there. Just keep trusting in him. We'll all be praying for you.
Welcome!
God Bless you
Loren |
Carol_2
Registered user
Username: Carol_2
Post Number: 184
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 3:45 am: | |
Welcome Grace!!! Thanks for sharing what happened last evening....you and your husband will be in our prayers. I know you will find strength here, as we have all been down that road....and still the baggage sometimes causes a little discomfort (after 3 years out for me.)
And you were not long-winded! We look forward to hearing much more from you.
Love and prayers, Carol |
Esther
Registered user
Username: Esther
Post Number: 77
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 6:02 am: | |
Welcome Grace! It's great that you have joined us here. I hope you will find support and care here. It has been so beneficial to me to be able to come here...and I know where you are as my husband and I are just pulling out officially too. Our elders are being a bit stubborn with us too.
I've heard it on here and other places that it takes at least two years to "deprogram"...and since all of us on here are still dealing with Adventism in one way or another, you're in good company!
Praying for you! |
Dd
Registered user
Username: Dd
Post Number: 201
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 6:16 am: | |
Dear Grace,
I am sorry that your evening was a tough one to get through but you made me think of John 1:16 when you described your giddiness.
"For of His fullness we have all received, and grace upon grace."
GRACE UPON GRACE...makes me think of one of my favoite places...the ocean...inspite of weather, life, external pressures - the waves keep coming. Blessings come to Christians as waves continue to come to shore. The Christian life is the constant reception of an evidence of God's grace replacing another.
I am so glad you are here on the forum to journey along side each of us. God, through His grace, has granted us the blessing of each other. I am looking forward to growing in His love through your presence on this forum. |
Ric_b
Registered user
Username: Ric_b
Post Number: 76
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 6:18 am: | |
Welcome. What a great nickname from your study group. Almost like a badge of honor!
Our pastor didn't even try to talk with us (although I'm basically glad of that). But so many SDAs we talk to don't understand why we "had to leave" just because we didn't believe a "few" of the same things as the church taught. While my own questions were growing, I wasn't discussing them with too many people. One close friend I talked to was a pastor (lived a couple states away). Although he was one of the most conservative SDAs I have ever known, he was completely convinced that I didn't need to believe in EGW in order to stay SDA. |
Hrobinsonw
Registered user
Username: Hrobinsonw
Post Number: 85
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 6:56 am: | |
Grace,
That is the best name that I have heard in a while. Welcome. Your study group has given you a special label. Enjoy it. Your testimony is warming to the soul. I am smiling as I type. |
Susan_2
Registered user
Username: Susan_2
Post Number: 1098
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 7:48 am: | |
Wow, my favorite girl name hey crissand you with. Until if we ever find out your real name I hope we on here can call you Grace. Yes, I realize that sometmes one must be a bit more assertive than s/he had planned on. I especially will pray for the relationship with your husband throughout all this. Under the topic prayer I will post something and I will include one of my favorite texts which you may want to apply to your situtation. It's nice to meet you and I'm looking forward to reading more from you. Dd, I go to the ocean nearly daily. It's a favorite place of mine, too. I go down there to read and to write letters. |
Pheeki
Registered user
Username: Pheeki
Post Number: 422
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 8:22 am: | |
Grace, I too left the church with a spouse and children firmly intrenched in it. Over the last almost 3-years the Lord has nearly totally delivered us from SDAism.
Every once in a while it rares it's ugly head again but I pray and it goes away. Just a month or so ago a pastor from the local SDA dropped in unexpectedly and uninvited to try to talk to my husband (not to me mind you...I had my membership removed and now am a heretic) because he slavishly played their music for years and years (never did they thank him, pay him or put his name in the bulletin...they took him totally for granted). So they want him back because their music is suffering.
Anyway...there I sat that Saturday afternoon watching cooking shows and relaxing as I ususally do and what does this guy do but come to my back sliding glass door. I freaked out and jumped up and turned off the TV...you see, for a moment I feared those of the circumcision...it was a programmed gut reaction to being caught with the TV on, on Sabbath! Anyway, my husband wasn't home so the guy waited for a while in his car in the driveway for him and finally gave up and left. It still creeped me out.
I think you will find most SDA (even pastors) don't reeaaallly want to discuss why you are leaving because it might cause them to have doubts too (you know the ones they are suppressing if they are true bibal scholars) and then they would lose their little neatly packaged life of SDAism, their job, their friends, maybe even family...they have a lot to lose as you and I both felt we did also.
I faced tons of persecution when I was leaving SDAism...a lot of it right in my own home. I was told if I left the SDA fold I was in danger of losing salvation...my oldest daughter told me she didn't want to hear anymore from the Bible that she was a believer in Ellen White! (Out of the mouths of babes!!!)
The pastor at the time was a man I don't even think is saved. He put his wife on the church payroll as visitation pastor (she didn't visit anyone) he was fleecing the church, only preached about once a month (if that) and when he got through with that church it split and was down to only a few members...but I digress. He didn't want to talk to me really, he emailed me once and I told him how I felt and all he wrote back was that he felt the same about some of the stuff I was writing. He happily dropped my name (took me 2-years to ask) without any arguing or sadness.
People still try to get my husband and kids to do special music but they haven't really done much. The best thing that the Lord did was get my kids out of the SDA school system. That was a true miracle! They don't want to go back either.
We haven't found a church because my husband feels he cannot worship on Sunday. We did attend one Sat. afternoon service and we both liked it...he has been in school and studying a lot so maybe after he graduates, God will finish the transition and find us a grace filled non-denom. church.
I have come so far after thinking there was no life after SDAism. God is good and will sustain you. I think the hardest thing I ever did was endure 4-hours in a room with my SDA preacher brother who tried to refute everything I had learned. I was so scared to get into it with him because I had only had the blinders off for 2-months, so I prayed and the Lord gave me the words and texts to show him what I believed and he didn't suck me back in as I was afraid he would. I was elated when that 4-hours was over...I felt totally filled with the Holy Spirit and the victory God had given me against deception. I know exactly what you are talking about Grace.
God bless and tell us how the blinders came off for you and how your husband is taking it if you don't mind. I seriously used this forum as my sounding board and a safe place to vent...I think that is how I kept my sanity (God led me here to friends) because I felt totally alone and forsaken by my friends and family.
God bless you in your journey...it is worth it...I had my reality ripped out from under me for Christ and it was all worth it to truly follow Him! |
Colleentinker
Registered user
Username: Colleentinker
Post Number: 938
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 9:07 am: | |
Grace, welcome! We're so happy to have you here. We would love to hear more of your story (yes, your letter will be posted--), but how is your husband reacting to your leaving?
Pheeki, thank you so much for sharing the overview of your last three years. I still pray for you and your husband. How wonderful, though, that he is beginning to see! I'll pray that God will guide you to a healthy church where all of you can grow.
You will have moments of great fear and doubt, "Grace", but remember to pray and return to the Bible as you did last night. I love the way God confirms our decision to stand up for Him and for truth by giving our hearts that indescribable joy you talked about!
Colleen |
Pw
Registered user
Username: Pw
Post Number: 180
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 10:53 am: | |
I can relate to pheeki's experience to some extent. When I said I was quitting the SDA, sure enough, the pastor shows up at my home. Of course he goes on about how I'm turning away from "their" truth. But he never even said anything about praying with me to continue in my walk with Jesus, only gave the condemning facts according to their beliefs. Even went on about how I will end up with the mark of the beast if I go back to Sunday worship. At that point I thought to myself, I'd rather be annihilated (by their beliefs) than spend eternity in a SDA's version of heaven. |
Madelia
Registered user
Username: Madelia
Post Number: 94
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 12:30 pm: | |
Dear Grace,
I love your name!! You are so courageous to speak about your beliefs. I wish I could be so brave. Even though I don't consider myself an SDA, technically I am a member. My husband is hard-core SDA and I doubt will ever change. So I really admire what you have done, hard as it's been.
Welcome to the forum! |
Susan_2
Registered user
Username: Susan_2
Post Number: 1103
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 3:44 pm: | |
Pheeki, Has you husband ever atended campmeeting services on Sunday? If he went to SDA schools did he attend chapel on Sundays? Does he watch Mark Findley or Doug Botchler on t.v. on Sundays? These are all church. That's one big issue I have with the SDA. It's o.k. for them to have church on Sunday but Chriians sure had better not or they are whores to the beast. Go figure. |
Flyinglady
Registered user
Username: Flyinglady
Post Number: 738
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 6:06 pm: | |
Grace, what an appropriate name for you. God's Grace, that is who you are. You are in a good safe place here. You can vent about what ever is bothering you, as all of us have done. God gave us this place to help each other in any way we can as we journey with Jesus. We do not have to travel alone. I have put you on my prayer list.
Pheeki, I have put you and your family on my list.
Madelia, You are on my prayer list also. You will find us in all stages of growth on this site. Leaving the SDA church is like going through the grief cycle. Just remember when you go through it that Jesus is carrying you. You may feel like you are alone, but Jesus carries you through times like that. We love you and want to hear more from you. I learned here how Christians really behave and treat each other. They have helped me learn how awesome God is.
Diana |
Vchowdhury1
Registered user
Username: Vchowdhury1
Post Number: 71
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 6:15 pm: | |
Susan, It's funny, I was thinking the same thing only yesterday. Its alright for sda's to conduct "evangelistic" & tent meetings on Sundays in order to trap new members into the sda church and hold bible studies on sundays, but yet somehow its NOT okay to attend a non-sda church on Sundays. Go figure. Does anyone have an explaination for this bent logic. I'm curious. |
Flyinglady
Registered user
Username: Flyinglady
Post Number: 740
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 8:24 pm: | |
Only because it is bent logic. There is no rhyme or reason to it.
Diana |
Susan_2
Registered user
Username: Susan_2
Post Number: 1105
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 12, 2004 - 11:01 pm: | |
Valerie, I had wrote this earlier but then I pushed the wrong button on this keyboard and now I have to do it all over again. I know full-well how come the SDA's
have that attitude. Now for everyone reading this I will try giving my best shot at explaining it. It goes back to the SDA termology of "Sabbath-keepers" and "Sunday-keepers'. One almost has to have been raised from babyhood in order to understand the meaning of those terms to a SDA. I'll give several examples of those terms. Recently an elderly SDA lady in my community told me that Sabbath afternoons are her most lonely and boring time of the week. I suggested she attend a different church in our community that holds Saturday afternoon services. Well, I was told that attending a "Sunday-keeping" church on Sabbath does not make those people "Sabbath-keepers" and that it is just as wrong to attend a "Sunday-keeping" church on Sabbath as it is to attend a "Sunday-keeping" church on Sunday. BTW, Valerie, she too uses the words, "those people" but she is referring to "Suunday-keepers" with the words "those people". I was also told that to attend a "Sabbath-keeping" church on Sunday is o.k. because real commandment keepers know the difference and even though they may attend a church service on Sunday they ARE NOT "keeping Sunday". The real commandment keepers KNOW the difference. And, having grown up SDA I even understand the lingo and understand just what she ment. Believe me, no one who was not engrained with this termonology for years upon years can truly understand the depth of the meaning of those terms. To give you another example I will share with you a story that was in the Review several months ago. It was a very short story in the back of the magazine, maybe only about a third of a page long. The author of the story told about a church he'd heard about that during the sports season was switching it's weekly service from Sunday mornings to Saturdays. The reason was because a lot of the members in this comgregation were obligated to partisipate in the local schools sporting events. They were either the kids from the local school or the parents. The church then decided it was important to be able to have its main weekly service so as many of the church members as possible could make it to church so they switched their church day. Then after the sport season was over (I forgot what sport it was.) the church switched back to having its weekly service on Sunday mornings. So, sadly the author of this article in the Review totally missed the whole point of worship. He let the faithful SDA's know that the SDA church and its people would never betray the Sabbath. That SDA's are not like the "Sunday-keepers" who have no loyalty to even "keeping-Sunday". It's extremely convoluted. It's warped. And, I totally understood what the author ment. But, what the bauthor missed and what the ever faithful SDA's who are in agreement with that is missing it that to those "Sunday-keepers" it was not about a day but about our Saviour and about worship. So, that is two examples of explaining how the SDA reasoning goes. The SDA's have their own lingo. "Sunday-keepers" and "Sabbath-keepers" are SDA terms that most Christians would not really understand the deep significance of what those terms mean. Another term they use is, "commandment keepers". EVERY SDA I know has the text memorized that says, "Here are they that keep the commandments of God...". That term, "commandment keepers" referrs only to "Sabbath-keepers" and by furthr extension only to SDA's. know this because if I point out to a SDA that there are many other groups who observe the seventh-day Sabbah as they do I will hear the SDA person hum and haw and get all squirrely and then finily s/he will tell me that even though others may actually have the truth of the Sabbath they still don't have all the truth so they are not part of THE TRUTH. |
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