| Author | Message | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 788 Registered: 3-2004 |
I have been reading the books I bought from LAM. I have finished G. Taylor's book and am now reading "Healing Spiritual Abuse". How interesting it is and it helps me understand the way I was raised. Here are some quotes I have found in the first chapter. "Spiritual abuse happens when a leader with spiritual authority uses that authority to coerce, control or exploit a follower, thus causing spiritual wounds." "Spiritual abusers are curiously naive about the effects of their exploitation." Some spiritual leaders gently coerce their congregations through skillful use of the language of intimacy and trust." "Many church leaders are skilled in this language of ntimacy and trust. With it they gain the support of their followers and are able to run the church as they please (does this sound familiar??)....it is significant, however, because it is a violation of trust. When a leader pretends to be a friend and uses this illusion to dehumanize and manipulate his followers, he is acting abusively." There is so much more I could type. I would recommend that everyone who is leaving the SDA church to read this book. Happy reading every one. Diana | ||
| Susan_2 Registered user Username: Susan_2 Post Number: 1164 Registered: 11-2002 |
Diana. I just finished Pastor Taylors book this week, too. I also have the book, Healing From Spiritual Abuse. So far every book I have gotten from LAM has captured my attention right from its start. Well not actually because Cultic Doctrines didn't make sense in the first half of it. The second half of the book though I could understand. | ||
| Susan_2 Registered user Username: Susan_2 Post Number: 1166 Registered: 11-2002 |
Or was it The Sabbath in Christ? I'm not sure but one of them I had a hard time getting through the first half of the book and I remember thinking the two halves should have been arranged opposite. Then I could have read the easy half first and I could have not bothered with the second half. As it was though I read the entire book. All the while I was readung the first half hoping the book would get more interesting. It did. | ||
| Tracey Registered user Username: Tracey Post Number: 91 Registered: 9-2004 |
What about the video, The spirit behind the truth? I just purchased that along with Cultic Doctrine. Has anyone seen this video? I am so excited to get it. | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 149 Registered: 10-2004 |
Yes, it is a very good video! It is hard-hitting, as it says on the cover. It should really open the eyes of non-SDAs and show them that it is a cult. And it should keep any non-SDAs from joining the SDA cult. It may also be helpful for questioning SDAs, but staunch SDAs probably wouldn't let it help them much. Jeremy | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 1025 Registered: 12-2003 |
No, it won't help staunch SDAs much. In fact, they have published (I don't know which publishing house) a book which debunks the movie practically line-by-line. In my opinion (and I haven't read the whole thing) it's just more propoganda, and only the true believers would believe the book. The movie is a bit sensational--the newest version has actually been toned down a bit. It doesn't include some of the more shocking images and quotes, including the one where Ellen White asks her son to send her feather bed to her--after having written counsels that feather beds and pillows, etc., are to be avoided because they stimulate the animal passions. Even with the deletions, however, it's a very powerful movie. Colleen | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 150 Registered: 10-2004 |
Yes, I have seen the online version of that book at one of the author's web sites. There may have been a couple or so valid (or semi-valid) points, but the points that I read were mostly false. Jeremy | ||
| Melissa Registered user Username: Melissa Post Number: 609 Registered: 7-2003 |
I also have the video. I found it interesting, but B refused to watch it. Not surprising, since I think we'd lump him in the "staunch" category. | ||
| Tracey Registered user Username: Tracey Post Number: 92 Registered: 9-2004 |
LOL at Melissa! "staunch" I tend to agree with Colleent that a video won't do it for C. But it's mainly for me anyway. Interestingly, last night we were talking about the dearheart Billy Graham (he was on tv last night)And C was surprised he was still preaching at 80 and how God has kept him so long and the mind to preach the gospel etc. And C just said how amazing to have led so many to Christ. so of course I just wondered if he realized that there's nothing SDA being preached.. What did you guys ever think of Billy Graham as an SDA? About him leading thousands to Christ.. I wish!! And then I (looking for opportunities to feed him the Word of God only) told him of a cousin (by marriage) in China.. Raised Buddhist, but the Lord came to her bed in the hospital and healed her and she gave her life to Him! So in saying that I said "I wonder if God spoke to her in Chinese or English".. Basically, it just led us to a really great discussion about the nature of God.. Not needing anything from us, but a willing heart, how he transcends time and space, and language (time, get it?? -- as in "days") And how if all we ever knew was Jesus, He was more than enough to live a life in Him led by the Spirit. I just look now for opportunities to speak the Word of God into his mind and life believing what it says, that it renews and transforms our mind. I pray my subtle, fox-like ways will break down walls. He also said that he has wondered how God would judge those that never heard of Jesus. And I told him that I believed God when He said He would return when everyone has heard the name of Jesus. That I believed God was fair and in some way, EVERYONE will have heard the gospel b/c if He allowed me to hear it, Why wouldn't everyone have the same chance?? He agreed and remembered a scripture about how man knows about God just by looking at nature or something like that. Our conversations are definitely better when I leave SDA out of it. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 1029 Registered: 12-2003 |
What did I think about Billy Graham as an Adventist? I was puzzled, quite frankly. I had heard that Adventists had presented him with the "Sabbath message", but he had refused to embrace it. The Adventists I knew were a bit puzzled about whether or not he could be saved--we thought he propbably would embrace the Sabbath before he died but would continue as he was for a while because not preaching the Sabbath made it easier for him to evangelize. On the other hand, we speculated he might never accept it, and in spite of all his great preaching, he would be lost. (Notice our speculations were all about what Billy Graham would or would not do, and not about what Jesus would or would not do?) Praise God for assurance! Colleen | ||
| Vchowdhury1 Registered user Username: Vchowdhury1 Post Number: 92 Registered: 7-2004 |
As for the good works of Billy Graham, I find it simply amazing that sda consider "embracing the Sabbath" a catalyst for being SAVED! What about accepting Jesus as their personal savior, and not committing adultry, or not lying, or not stealing, or respecting your parents, or not swindling people, or not putting anything before God... Its amazing how everything is wraped up in the day you go to church. Do you mean to tell me that you can be a servant of God (like Billy Graham) but still be lost because of a day? The more I think about it, the more ridiculous it is. So in that case sda should not have prayer meetings on Wednesday or Tuesday nights because that isn't the correct day of worship. The 7th day only folks. Also, lets cut out these Sunday night evangelistic meetings. Wrong day folks. Saturdays only, remember? I'm reminded of the story that Colleen told us about the adventist drug dealer. As far as sda's are concerned, this drug deal will get into the kingdom before Billy Graham because the drug dealer keeps the Sabbath! Again, ridiculous! Being over concerned about the 7th day Sabbath folks, remember, is an EGW concoction. What about all those saints that fell asleep before 1844? Are they ALL lost because they didn't have EGW's Sabbath "Truth"?? Even William Miller rejected the Sabbath, but remember, EGW said he will be saved. So, whats up with that inconsistancy? --Valerie | ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 477 Registered: 7-2003 |
As an Adventist I rather pitied Billy Graham and felt a quite bit superior to him (don't laugh, it's sad, but true). I saw him as someone that was probably doing his best, but was unfortunately without "the truth" and therefore part of Babylon. It didn't help that he was also drawing others into Babylon as well. I just thought it was too bad that Billy and the rest of his followers didn't know their Bibles very well. I thought they would either one day figure it out and come out of Babylon or they would reject truth and begin persecuting Sabbath keepers before being destroyed by God. I truly felt sorry for someone as sincerely deceived as Billy.......pretty pathetic, huh....... Chris | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 152 Registered: 10-2004 |
Valerie, EGW also said that anyone who rejected the 1844 message was lost and could not "get back on the path." And yet she said that angels were guarding "the precious dust" of William Miller, who rejected 1844 comepletely! What inconsistency, as you said. Jeremy | ||
| Madelia Registered user Username: Madelia Post Number: 109 Registered: 2-2003 |
Chris, your experience as an Adventist, and your attitude toward Billy Graham, is exactly my husband's attitude. I heard that a Billy Graham program will be aired this Sunday night and I plan to watch it. I've been thinking about the SDA's standing outside the LA crusade with their propaganda. I'm thinking the next time I hear of a Revelation Seminar, I should make copies of Dale Ratzlaff's booklet "The Truth about Seventh-Day Adventist Truth" and stand outside the seminar and hand them out! Except, my experience has been that the majority of those in attendance are already SDA's | ||
| Freeatlast Registered user Username: Freeatlast Post Number: 245 Registered: 5-2002 |
Madelia, what a fantastic idea! It should also come with a flyer that states something like: "The seminar that you just attended is a proselytizing tool of the Seventh-day Adventist Church, although they did not clearly indicate that to you in the seminar. This book will help you to understand why they try to keep that hidden until after you have joined their ranks, and why thousands upon thousands of former members have left this cultic church. The Bible tells us to 'beware of false prophets'. Please read this book carefully and prayerfully". etc. etc. etc. I would leap at the opportunity to be one of the people handing them out. There is an SDA church right around the corner from my house and I'm going to start watching the bulletin board for the Rev. seminars. | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 154 Registered: 10-2004 |
Yes, those are very excellent ideas both of you! If anyone wants to print their own copies, Dale's booklet "The Truth About Seventh-day Adventist 'Truth'" can be downloaded, printed, and distributed for free here. Jeremy | ||
| Vchowdhury1 Registered user Username: Vchowdhury1 Post Number: 93 Registered: 7-2004 |
Freeatlast and Madelia, What you mentioned in regards to passing out fliers against the cult of sda-ism brings back memories. I remember when I was a little girl attending the sda church (I think I must have been around 10 or 11 years old at the time this happened)there was this strange lady who dressed in all white, and her two grown-up children who stood out in front of the sda church that my parents and I attended and handed out fliers speaking against the sda church and its false prophesies and doctrines. The members of the congregation were told not to pay attention to them, ignore them and not even speak to them. When my church finally ran them away (the deacons would call the police on them every week because they were "trespassing"), they would sneak and put fliers on all the cars when we were still in service. At that time we all thought this lady and her kids were decieved, demons, hateful, spiteful, resentful, misguided, and tools of the devil. Now, I wish I could find the lady and apologize to her. She wasn't such a "crackpot" after all. In fact, she was right, we were wrong. She was just trying to let us know. Funny how life works. | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 797 Registered: 3-2004 |
I did not think of B. Graham at all until my brother was saved at one of his crusades in Anaheim in 1969/70. I was with my brother that night. After that when he was on TV, I just switched channels. What I had heard about him was that he had read Desire of Ages(I think that is the book) and really liked it, but would not become SDA. What ever he did and still does, God used him mightily and thank you God for that. It is amazing how my thinking has changed. I even watch the Crystal Cathedral on Sunday mornings. Have any of you in So Cal been to their Christmas program? It is beautiful, fantastic, wonderful and Christ centered. I went with a sister and my mother Christmas of 2000. Our God is an awesome God and I am so thankful for that. Diana | ||
| Dennisrainwater Registered user Username: Dennisrainwater Post Number: 105 Registered: 8-2000 |
I remember being told that Billy had 'confessed' to some high-profile SDAs that they were right, and that they have the true message -- and that one day, he'll join them. "But not yet...." Kind of sounds like what the "angel" told Ellen when she queried as to why the Sabbath had not been made plain as to its observance from Sundown to sundown, as opposed to 6pm to 6pm.... ("Ye shall understand -- but not yet, not yet...") Anyway, I also thought Billy was leading folks into Babylon. And how much worse was it for him, KNOWING he was teaching error, and all!! How arrogant we were!! So grateful for the pure, simple Gospel! Den <>< | ||
| Madelia Registered user Username: Madelia Post Number: 112 Registered: 2-2003 |
Freeatlast, I like your flyer. I'm going to reproduce that! And thanks for the link Jeremy. There is a Christian talk radio station here in Minneapolis, with a host who concentrates on false teachers one afternoon a week. I'm planning on sending him the video "Seventh Day Adventist Church: Spirit of Propechy" video and 3 of the Amazing Facts studies |
