| Author | Message | ||
| Grace_g Registered user Username: Grace_g Post Number: 3 Registered: 7-2004 |
Hello all, I have been lurking for a while, and eagerly waiting the opportunity to post. Then, when I got my login and password, I got snowed under with work! My name is Grace, and I am in the process of exiting the SDA Church. Here's a quick overview. (I hope you all don't mind that I keep it general. My family and friends don't know that I am in this process, and I don't want to be 'outed' on the internet.) Background: Born into a 3rd generation Adventist family. Very devout. Went to SDA schools all through to my second year of college. Always lived in Adv. communities ie: Loma Linda, etc. How my exodus started: Married a non-Adventist. Surprised me that I would even consider it. My parents, tho not initially supportive, (and I don't blame them) grew to love and accept my husband. When we were dating, we both studied church doctrine in an effort to see if he would feel comfortable attending church. Read _White Lie_ and got worried, but did nothing from it. Five years later, crisis in my immediate family made me re-evaluate SDA theology. Found EGW reserach on the web; considered the evidence, and decided she was not a prophet. Decided Sabbath was not mandatory. Spent two years "out' not atending any church. Had a child; back in the church with the child. Just easier, and baby needs Christian environment. Getting re-familiarized, etc., decide to do more research to solidify where I am. Re-read doctrines; discover and analyze IJ doctrine and am *appalled*. Figure out that this is NOT the way, and decide to make a change. Can't be a social Adventist only. Present: We have found an E-free church that we really like, and have been attending for the last month or so. I guess 'process' is misleading. I'm actually not attending the SDA church anymore, *but* I am in the process of breaking news to friends and family. This will be the hardest part, and I've decided for now that I'll just keep this process to myself as I shore my strength up and become more grounded in the Word. I really feel that God has been calling me through this entire process. I have a peace and joy that I always wanted, but never knew how to obtain. It is an amazing thing to be freed. This process is bittersweet, tho, in the beginning stages. I've been dealing with a lot of feelings of grief: loss of identity, self, etc. Blech! The good news is that was LAST month, and this month is going better. I expect there will be ups and downs along the way. It has been so helpful to read of others people experiences. I'm so looking forward to offering and receiving support on this forum, and feel so blessed to have the opportunity to participate. God Bless, Grace | ||
| Grace_g Registered user Username: Grace_g Post Number: 4 Registered: 7-2004 |
ps: Thanks to all of you who have already warmly welcomed me! | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 396 Registered: 12-2003 |
Grace, thank you for sharing your story. I so understand your feelings as you've been leaving; I struggled with that identity issue big time. I became depressed and felt I was losing myself. God is so faithful! He will help you tell your family, and He will help you know when and how to do it. It will probably not be easy, but you'll feel better afterward; pretending or avoiding around people you know well is just plain miserable. Ask God to help you know how and when to tell them. Praise God for calling you to himself! Colleen | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 229 Registered: 3-2004 |
Welcome Grace_g. You will find support and acceptance here for whatever is going on in your life. We will all pray for you, rejoice with you when you rejoice and will be your online friends. This is a good place to be. Welcome, Welcome, Welcome. Diana | ||
| Susan_2 Registered user Username: Susan_2 Post Number: 684 Registered: 11-2002 |
Welcome, Grace. I hope the church you attend has a good Sunday School for your child. I am always so amazed from this discussion board how similiar our experiences are with our kin. Wouldn't it be awsome on here to read a story about someone changing churchs from SDA to something else and reading that their SDA relatives respomded with, "Oh, that is so wonderful that you have found a body of Christians you like to worship and praise the Lord with." Sadly, we don't hear that from our SDA kin. Good luck and welcome. | ||
| Grace_g Registered user Username: Grace_g Post Number: 5 Registered: 7-2004 |
Colleen, my biggest fear is telling my father. He is a wonderful person, and practices Adventism with a sincere, loving heart. He will be disappointed. And I can't say I blame him. I think it's only natural for a parent to feel disapointed and fear in a chid breaking away into the unknown! lol. Parents prepare children to fly, and when they do, it can be bittersweet. He lives far away from me, so I think it's best to wait until we are together for holidays, and I have had some practice time on breaking it to him under my belt. Diana, I have noticed how supportive this forum is. It was one of the things that made me so eager to join. Thanks for the welcome! Susan, I have to say I'm disappointed in the Sunday School for my girl. I participated in the Cradle Roll class where we were going, and she loved the music/lesson curriculum. She often sings the songs during the week, and I think its a great way to teach. Our new church is based on the Willow Creek model, and the Sunday School [I get a delayed stress reaction every time i write that! lol] is more of a daycare than anything. I know she misses Cradle Roll. It was hard for us to leave her there by herself that first Sunday! Ironically, I think it was worse for my husband. We're so used to staying w/her during class. But it has been nice to study the Word with my husband at my side, without having to refree a child. We can both concentrate so much better. As she gets older, though, I think the children's ministry gets better. So there are tradeoffs, but great growth at the end. Grace | ||
| Susan_2 Registered user Username: Susan_2 Post Number: 687 Registered: 11-2002 |
What is Willow Creek? | ||
| Dd Registered user Username: Dd Post Number: 9 Registered: 7-2004 |
Grace, I, too, have been sitting back, reading, studying...and am new to FAF. I hope it is as comforting for you as it is for me to know that you are not alone in this journey. This forum (and the stories) have been a great blessing. Welcome. Have you ever heard of Bible Study Fellowship (BSF)? It is a non-denominational study. It is Bible only. There are "rules" that no references, religions, books, TV, politics...can be mentioned or discussed. God has used BSF the last 6 years in my life to really make it clear how much He loves me! How wonderful His grace is! How my belief and acceptance of Him and His grace is my ONLY source of salvation. It is an international Bible study with groups around the world studying the same subject. This year's study (starting in September) will be on The Acts of the Apostles (it goes until May 2005). You can find out about BSF in your area by getting on the internet and entering Bible Study Fellowship. Go to their site and enter the info needed and they will give a list of all the meeting spots close to you. Besides it being such an awesome study...they have a children's program. It is NOTHING close to what you have experienced in Sabbath or Sunday school. It is truly unbelievable and I cannot even describe it well enough to give it the credit it deserves. The program starts for 2 year olds up to school age. They are not babysitting your child but teaching them the same Biblical principles you studied yourself that week. My son went with me and LOVED it. BSF also has evening classes for men and school age children. My husband went and took our daughter for awhile when we lived in an area that had a men's group. It was their date night. Once again, the children's class was the same Bible study as the adults (my husband's study was the same as mine and it was a great experience to be in the Bible together). The very best thing I have found from BSF is how to apply all those principles to my life today. Growing up in SDA schools like you, I thought I knew the Bible...the old stories you have known have such deeper meaning and insight than any Bible class or SS I was ever in! Anyway...those are my thoughts. Thanks for being on the forum with me. Your story and mine are seem to be almost exactly alike. The sharing of your story and thoughts are a blessing to me. Thanks! | ||
| Grace_g Registered user Username: Grace_g Post Number: 6 Registered: 7-2004 |
Susan, Willow Creek is a non-denominational church in Illinois, that some say revitalized the Evangelical Christian church model. Here are some articles from Christianity Today: http://kedesh.christianitytoday.com/cgi/texis/webinator/search4/?pr=default&order=r&query=willow+creek+association&submit=Search&cq= Some of the hallmarks of a 'Willow Creek Model' are: - contemporary worship service - use of modern media, eg powerpoint slides, etc. - non-traditional church architecture - one main building that is multi-purpose as opposed to sanctuary centered - lots of small groups tied to life-style setting, giving members a way to connect personally in a big church - teaching of the word through onstage drama's - a church that is marketing and graphic savvy ie, have branding, mailings, etc. The things that I like about the church we attend is the small group setting. I am longing to connect with other parents w/toddlers who are also Christian. What an adventure we have to share. lol. I also like the fact that our church offers a traditional service alternative. I still jump out of my skin every time I hear a bass or drums go off in the sanctuary. I look around, waiting for someone to get into trouble! It proves to be quite distracting! ;) I also like that the Pastor, on the day that we first attended, started a 32-week series on Corinthians 1 and 2. They are going through line by line, verse by verse. No other authority but the Word!! [And when the Pastor says something I disagree with, I can, because he's human, not a prophet!!] God really sent us there. It's a great place for me to start. My husband grew up in a church that studied the Bible expository style, and it's exactly what I need right now. I have never been in an Adventist church that did that! Dd, thanks for posting and sharing about BSF. I'm going to their site now to find out what things they have in my area. It might be a great complement to our Efree church. I'd love to hear your story--is it posted somewhere? Grace | ||
| Grace_g Registered user Username: Grace_g Post Number: 7 Registered: 7-2004 |
Dd, Ha! i did a quick search and found a BSF class that meets 7 minutes away that meets on the day that my daughter and I are home together. Wow! I'll visit this Weds. and let you know how it goes. How exciting. Grace | ||
| Hallanvaara Registered user Username: Hallanvaara Post Number: 51 Registered: 1-2004 |
Warm wellcome, Grace. You have come to right place. I searched years for truth and felt horrible agony Ącause it seemed to me I canĄt find it. Then God led me here, something clicked in my head (it was the last question: Sabbath) and absolutely, totally big relief and sensation of freedom gained me. My life hasnĄt been the same anymore. I know IĄm saved and my Lord is living in me. Not me anymore but Christ in me. It so big difference being a member of ChristĄs body than being a SDA. IĄm sure that your father is going to hurt but that is something you canĄt help. You can explain thoroughly why but SDAs usually takes these things in certain way. I hope he is a wise man and understands that you donĄt leave Christ although you leave SDA denomination. Tuija | ||
| Dennis Registered user Username: Dennis Post Number: 114 Registered: 4-2000 |
Grace, A hearty FAF welcome! | ||
| Pw Registered user Username: Pw Post Number: 25 Registered: 6-2004 |
Leaving the SDA is never easy, in fact it will seem like you are betraying them. But that's the tactics of a cult because they will condemn your decision rather than pray that you will continue to grow elsewhere. I didn't have family members to contend with when I left in 1986 after a one year membership, but the pastor made a special trip to my house and threw the scripture at me "Come out of Babylon, my people" referring to my decision to leave and start "Sunday keeping". Once again the SDA doctrine was taken out of context to use as a burden. Your spiritual eyes will be opened in a wonderful and exciting way that we all missed under the SDA veil. | ||
| Patrickfoy Registered user Username: Patrickfoy Post Number: 5 Registered: 3-2004 |
Hi Grace-Welcome-I don't write in much but I too recently left the SDA and I am new to this form. With each day of study and prayer, I find that not only did I do the right thing(leave the SDA) but in reality, we are called out by the Holy Spirit.Praise be to our Lord and savior Jesus Christ. What a wonderful God we serve. I will add you to my prayer list. Patrick | ||
| Dd Registered user Username: Dd Post Number: 10 Registered: 7-2004 |
Hi Grace, BSF takes a break in the summer months. If you go tomorrow, noone will be there! They start up again in September. I wish I lived close (where ever that may be) to watch your daughter for you as the first time you go is "orientation". They need to know who will be there so that they can make sure they have enough leaders. Also, the first Wednesday of every month (except summer, of course) is an orientation day. At that time they go over the study and how it works and the rules of not discussing anything to do with any and all religions and etc that I described before. Look again on the web site for a contact number. It may be an 800 number that will then tell you who the contact person is for a particular BSF. Call that person this summer and let them know you are interested and find out when their first orientation is. Then look for someone to watch your daughter from 9:00 a.m. to 11:00 a.m. that first week. The way it is set up is that they give you reading "assignments" and questions to answer during the week. Then on Wednesday you go and meet together (some BSF's have 100 women some I have heard have 600 women!!) to sing a few songs and listen to announcements. Shortly after 9:00, the large group breaks up into smaller discussion groups. In your group of 10 - 15 women, who are grouped into approximately your same age and are from many different back grounds and religions, you will go through each question and discuss together the questions. It is amazing how the Holy Spirit directs each individual to find something different and specific to their own circumstances! Very powerful. At 10:00 the groups break up and meet together once again and listen to a lecture from the teaching leader on the very passages you studied all week by yourself and then earlier that morning with your discussion group. At 11:00 (on the dot) the study is finished. On your way out they hand you notes to read on the same subject you just spent the last week studying and then discussing that day. With the notes comes a new set of readings and questions for the next week. It is more indepth than any Bible class you ever experienced in school, SS, or church growing up. BSF also offers seminars that teach you HOW to study scripture on your own. That is something that was never taught in my SDA environment. They wanted to spoon feed you into what you should know to be a good Adventist. BSF (and through the Holy Spirit in my life!) has given me an unquenchable desire to be in God's word. I'd love to know if you are in BSF come fall. Keep in touch! Whatever you decide, we have the wonderful promise that the Holy Spirit will progressively lead us into all truth (John 16:7,12-15). It is obvious that the Holy Spirit is indwelling in you because of your desire to know who Jesus is in a deeper way. Best wishes and my God bless your journey. I will share my "story" with you when time allows. It is almost a mirror of your story! | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 398 Registered: 12-2003 |
Grace, Dd's idea about BSF is really a good one. I know quite a lot of women who started attending BSF as Advenitsts, and as the years went by, they began to read the Bible without the overlay of EGW intepretations, and they ended up Christ-followers in Christian churches. I don't know about your particular EV Free church, but I do know that in ours, while the babies do get "day care" as opposed to a teaching Sunday School, the teachers and aids are instructed that throughout all their interactions with the babies (changing, playing, etc.) they talk to them about how God loves them, He made their toes, etc. As they get older, they do more and more games and educational activities that incorporate Bible stories and Christian principles. They also have singing and worship. By the time kids are in 5th-6th grade (the point our younger son was when we joined our church), they have an amazing Scripture memorizing program, yearly retreats, etc. I've NEVER seen such Bible instruction in an SDA church! (Just by the way, I realize that Sabbath School, especially those very early years, really are a form of brain-washing, because those children learn Sabbath-keeping, required tithing/offerings, etc. from before the time they can talk through the media of those Sabbath-school songs. [Remember "One-two-three-four-five-six for us"?!] Also, having the parents sit with them keeps the parents from their own study.) Speaking of Bible studies, I've also heard wonderful things about Community Bible Studies from people who have attended those. CBS is also an orgnaization with studies in many different cities; it is structured very much like BSF and also disallows any denominational interpretation or references. Sometimes there are also local churches that have awesome Bible studies. (Not always, I realize--but sometimes!) I personally know of one that I can recommend to anyone in the Inland Empire region of So. Cal--Trinity Chruches Women's Ministry. Elizabeth Inrig (PhdD. from Trinity Western University and a master's degree from Dallas Theological Seminary) writes them, and they are true, inductive Bible studies. They are conducted similarly to BSF studies in that first, the women meet and hear the passage taught by Elizabeth, then they break into small groups for detailed discussion of the lessons. We just completed the book of Acts this spring--an amzaing study! I had never understood the significance of the details of the formation of the church before. This fall we will be beginning a year in the books of 1 & 2 Timothy, Philemon, Titus, and Colossians (I think I got them all!) There is really NO substitute for being in consistent Bible study! Colleen | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 399 Registered: 12-2003 |
Oops--I forgot to give the full name/place of the church above: Trinity Evangelical Free Church, Redlands, CA. (You can link to the church website from this one.) | ||
| Susan_2 Registered user Username: Susan_2 Post Number: 691 Registered: 11-2002 |
Grace, your bit about telling your dad has really been tugging at my heart. My dad passed away nearly two years ago at age 93. He had been raised from birth SDA. After I began attending the Seventh-day Baptist regurally, well, let's just say that's about as far from Adventist that my dad could handle. So, when I started attending a local Lutheran church I just kept it to myself for several years until I actually I was confronted from my mom about being gone every Sunday morning. In my situtation I have just decided the less said about religion/Christianity to my SDA loved ones the better. They just get too spun. | ||
| Grace_g Registered user Username: Grace_g Post Number: 8 Registered: 7-2004 |
Hallanvaara, Susan_2 and Pw, Yes, there will be many emotions when I finally speak with my father about this! Although I don't think he will feel betrayed, as much as he'll feel disappointed. We have a pretty good adult to adult relationship, and as long as I can keep the discussion at that level, I'll be fine. ;) Having learned about the wonderful gift of grace through Christ, I have just decided to implement that in dealing with others as much as I can. I'll just meet him where he is with accepting this news. I can do more than that. It's also the way i feel about my friends and family who are still SDA...I do not feel the need to actively prosyletize, but if they ever feel compelled to ask for advice or direction, I'll chime in!  I love so many of them. I don't have hard feelings against them. Patrick, thank you for adding me to your prayer list. I need all the prayers I can get. Dennis, thanks for the warm welcome! Dd, thanks for giving me add' 411 on BSF. I could just imagine myself in the church parking lot wondering "where is everyone?" I'll calender it for the fall and be sure to look it up. Colleen, I believe our EV Free church Sunday School is modeled in much the same way as you described. It's just such a well-oiled, professional machine, it was a bit hard for us to get used to. Our SDA church had maybe...150 active members, and the facilities were aging. This church has a ton of members, and is brand new with full amenities and thoughtful design and architecture. Leaving my daughter was such a change. It was such a shock to be able to study with my husband! I agree it's better...but still what a change! Thanks for the info on CBS. A Dallas Theo. Seminary pedigreed Pastor was one of our requirements for a new church. My husband grew up in a Bible church pastored by a DTS alum, and we both really like the approach they take to teaching. It's hard to get any work done with all this socializin'! Grace | ||
| Ladylittle Registered user Username: Ladylittle Post Number: 20 Registered: 4-2004 |
Hi Grace_g, Welcome! Please pray much before talking with your Dad and be prepared in case he does decide you've betrayed him and all that's holy. I have a close relative with whom I've had a really great, open relationship. I expected that if anyone was going to take it well he would. WRONG! As far as he is concerned I've betrayed him, and God, and am torturing him just by the fact that I believe what I believe, and differ from what I used to believe. Ask God to give you special wisdom and courage, and to also be with your Dad and help him, . . . and while you're at it you can pray for me and my relative also! Mary |
