| Author | Message | ||
| Denisegilmore Registered user Username: Denisegilmore Post Number: 208 Registered: 10-2000 |
Belva, Here is another good article on baptism from Acts 2:38: http://www.zianet.com/maxey/reflx180.htm Love in Christ. denise | ||
| Praisegod Registered user Username: Praisegod Post Number: 270 Registered: 3-2004  |
Welcome brenttn. We are always so glad to have new faces come out of lurk mode. The fact that you mentioned Joyce Meyer reminds me of some SDA stories. Back in the days when I was still firmly SDA and had no idea God was moving me out, I arranged to attend a Thursday night meeting when Joyce came to our town. As strange as it may seem, I went there with my husband and my SDA pastor, who likes to check out popular evangelists. I had never been exposed to contemporary music before. It was quite a shock to someone traditionally SDA! At that point in my Christian walk, I had no knowledge whatsoever of the Word of Faith movement or any criticisms of Joyce. I just knew that I had heard her occasionally on radio and TV and she spoke to sanctification issues that had ministered to me. Anyway, I decided to return Saturday morning after being encouraged by my pastor to do so. To accomplish that I had to get coverage for my SS class. At this time I was just starting to learn about the Holy Spirit. If you know anything about attending meetings for well-known speakers, you know you must go early to get a seat where you can see without binoculars. So I showed up early and was standing outside with a crowd of people. This was the first time in my life that I had ever experienced a tremendous hovering of the Holy Spirit over a crowd. Everywhere you turned, people were connecting with strangers and the entire topics of conversation were on Jesus. I was reflecting on my time in SDA meetings and how never had I heard a group of strangers just chatting about their Christian walk. I was just blown away. When I went to sit down, I started talking to two women next to me and a lady in front of us. It became obvious quickly that the women in front of us was not a Christian. The three of us ministered to her and brought her to a knowledge of salvation. When Joyce came out on stage, the very first thing she did is hold an altar call because she said that was what the Holy Spirit had asked her to do. She hadnít preached or anything yet! The lady we had ministered to literally ran down the aisle to be the first one there. This was all so new to me. I had just never, ever experienced the power of the Holy Spirit before. God used these meetings to show me that the book of Acts was still real. Fast forward about a year and another Joyce Meyer meeting. This time I was with my pastorís wife and another woman who is married to a conference official. The pastorís wife got to talking to someone behind us and it turned out the row behind us was all SDA. As I chatted with an SDA behind me, I found out that their church had healing miracles taking place, the Holy Spiritís presence was showing up powerfully in meetings and that their pastors spoke in tongues! (not openly or known to most.) Now, about four years later Iím hearing this is a ìmodel churchî for this conference. I have NO idea whether they have cleared out the charismatic element or whether itís there and the conference just doesnít have a clue. I only went to one meeting during that series but the conference officialís wife took her daughters. Her 10 year old started speaking in tongues after attending! But then, I wasnít surprised because her mother was one whom the Holy Spirit met before she didnít even believe God moves with manifestations. She is not the one I mentioned before, but another SDA who spoke in tongues without knowing it can be for real. She remains SDA because of her husband being a conference official, but I believe she catches enough Sunday churches and conferences to feed her soul and hear more about Jesus. Praise GodÖ | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 71 Registered: 3-2005 |
I'm sorry to have to issue a caution flag in all this. Joyce Meyer is part of the false "Name it and claim it" movement. Experience is not proof of anything. We have to base everything on the clear word of God. The Charismatic movement is riddled with false practices and false doctrines. The Word Faith movement of which Joyce Meyers is a part has caused more people to be ruined in their faith than helped. This is well documented by many good books. Welcome to FAF Brenttn, and sorry to sound negative, but Joyce Meyers is dangerous. Stan | ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 763 Registered: 7-2003  |
For those who would like references, here is a link to a Christian Research Institute position paper on JOYCE MEYER. Here also is a link to a whole page of free papers and other resources on THE WORD OF FAITH MOVEMENT Chris | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 73 Registered: 3-2005 |
Chris, Thanks for the links. There is documentation of weird phenomena, very similar to what was manifested with EGW. I was reluctant to post as I did, but my concern is that people will go from one strange lady prophetess to another one with the eventual disallusionment that will certainly happen. Also Paul and Jan Crouch have been pedaling this Word of Faith nonsense for a long time. Every time I tune across Joyce, I get a very uncomfortable feeling. Stan | ||
| Praisegod Registered user Username: Praisegod Post Number: 273 Registered: 3-2004 |
I can understand your concern for the Word of Faith movement. When I was first checking out Sunday churches I happened to visit one listed as non-denominational that was obviously preaching that and even though I wasnít even out of Adventism at that point, I could see that error. Itís also quite easy to find by turning the dial on the TV although I donít get TBN on my TV.. Personally, the times I have heard Joyce Meyer, she has not said anything heretical. But I do know she has made statements that are because of the documentation you can find on the web listing quotes from books etc. I am concerned, though, about us also learning to focus not upon what is wrong with ministries but what is right with them. Focus upon the place of Jesus within the ministry. Who knows the step that the Holy Spirit is using to removing us from Adventism. Plus many of us did find Jesus first even within the SDA church. Brenttnís first post mentioned Joyce Meyer, not knowing the feeling probably of many on this website. Iím a bit concerned that a fellow former may end of feeling this is not a safe place to post their walk out of Adventism. None of us can change how the Holy Spirit worked with us. Praise GodÖ | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 75 Registered: 3-2005 |
Praise God, I appreciate your concern about a new person coming on and not feeling free to express themselves. That was why I was very hesitant to post as I did. I would not have even come on line about this until I saw your very positive post about Joyce. Then it started to sound like a full endorsement of her ministry, and that is why I thought a caution flag was warranted. As to lets just focus on the positive; the same thing could be said about focusing on the positive aspects of EGW such as Desire of Ages, and Steps to Christ, as I know of people who became Christians by reading those books. But I am sorry if I made our new member feel uncomfortable. Brenttn, You are welcome here to express your views. Stan | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 475 Registered: 10-2004  |
And now I feel I must clarify something.  Some of the most blasphemous and worst things EGW ever wrote are in Desire of Ages and Steps to Christ. Something which makes me very uncomfortable about Greg Taylor's book or even giving it to SDAs is the fact that he says that those 2 books are wonderful books. That is just not true. They both teach a false gospel all throughout, along with many other heresies and blasphemous statements. I understand that you were not giving a full endorsement of those books, Stan, but I felt I needed to clarify that they are indeed very dangerous books, as some people seem to think that those 2 books are OK/good/not too bad, etc. Of course, anything written by a false prophet is going to be dangerous and full of falsehoods and deceptive mixtures of truth and error. Jeremy | ||
| Melinda Registered user Username: Melinda Post Number: 17 Registered: 2-2005 |
Stan, I am curious if you have been to any of JM's meetings or listened to her tapes? I have listened to some of her tapes and some things I agree with and some things I don't. It is kind of like when you are looking for a new church to attend. You won't always agree with everything. Melinda | ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 771 Registered: 7-2003 |
| ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 772 Registered: 7-2003 |
| ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 773 Registered: 7-2003 |
| ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 774 Registered: 7-2003 |
| ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 775 Registered: 7-2003 |
| ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 78 Registered: 3-2005 |
Chris, Thank you for the above quotes. Melinda, you ask me if I have listened to JM's tapes. I have seen her on TBN enough times, and have read enough about the heretical word faith movement to make me stay a long way away. I am going to say it this way, Why do you want to substitute another EGW for the equivalent false prophetess. That should be apparent from Chris's quotes above, and from some of the exact weird phenomena seen with EGW. There is something about watching her on TV that just does not have the ring of truth. I just fear that many former SDA's can get deceived by another false gospel. With concern, Stan | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 79 Registered: 3-2005 |
One other point: Remember the song by the Who "I Won't Get Fooled Again". Also, there was a parable Jesus told, about the man who was cleansed from an evil spirit, but when he was swept clean, other evil spirits came in and he was worse off than before. Just a word of caution about "Charismania" as Dr John MacArthur calls it. Stan | ||
| Dennis Registered user Username: Dennis Post Number: 344 Registered: 4-2000  |
I recently discovered that the Mary Kay cosmetic company, headquartered in Dallas, Texas, utilizes Joyce Meyer's publications for their independent beauty consultants for motivational purposes. I understand that the late Mary Kay Ash was a religious woman. Consequently, her cosmetic company continues to promote some religious values to their saleswomen. Unfortunately, Joyce Meyer's views are very far from biblical Christianity. It is ideal to leave her books unread and untouched on the bookstore shelf. Dennis J. Fischer | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 82 Registered: 3-2005 |
Dennis, As usual, another very thoughtful post. I have really appreciated all your posts during the last 18 months that I have been lurking on this site, and now participating. God Bless You. Stan | ||
| Brenttn Registered user Username: Brenttn Post Number: 2 Registered: 2-2005 |
Ok, Now I am confused, I just saw that someone accused Melinda of elevating Joyce Meyers to EGW status? WHERE DID SHE SAY ANYTHING OF THE SORT? For that matter where did I say anything that brought such a STRONG and almost hateful tone from you folks. I am not afraid to post, and never fear that your negative posts would keep me from posting, however, in my post, I only stated the simple fact that I finally surrendered to Christ at one of Joyces meetings. And I stated that God used Joyce to bring the wakeup call. Hrm, just a side note. Those pamphlet quotes are from 91, is it possible that something you wrote 14 years ago might not accurately reflect your theology today?????? As PraiseGod posted, I did not know the strong antagonism this group held towards Joyce Meyres, and I did not intend to invoke any hostile feelings when I gave my experience. I only posted MY EXPERIENCE, and how dare anyone say it isn't so because of the person who God chose to use. Now I won't say that I agree with all of Joyce's teaching, just as I don't agree with any denominational teachings. I don't think that any of us have got it all together from a theology point of view. I do know this, I am thankful that I am not where I used to be, and I am looking forward to where I am going to be as I continue to listen to God in His Word and through His Spirit. Name it Claim it, no I know that the materialism that this movement demonstrates is not what Jesus intended when he spoke in Matthew 7:7-11
As Christ said Seek FIRST the kingdom of GOD and you can rest assured that this is the one thing that the Father will never deny you. He will not give you stones or serpents, He will give you the kingdom (not material things,) but Kingdom living here on earth with the Fruit of the Spirit from Galatians as the testimony of your kingdom living. | ||
| Susan_2 Registered user Username: Susan_2 Post Number: 1733 Registered: 11-2002 |
Actually, I have never even heard of Jpyce Meyer until now. So, I have no opinion at all. I have no clue who she is or what she is about. |
