| Author | Message | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1335 Registered: 3-2004  |
And who is the author of those spiritual deceptions?? It is Satan. He must really like it when he is not recognized. So let us continue to point it out. All we need is the Bible and Jesus. He is so awesome. Diana | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 306 Registered: 7-2004 |
I was reading some posts at R/S last night and noticed something that I think is interesting. It was either Colporteur or Walk_In_The_Light who was asking one of the gospel oriented Adventists to please not quote scripture to him, that he had been through enough of that from the FAs. What I felt was noteworthy was that every dealing with us FAs had been consistent. "Every FA sounds like every other FA," or something on that order is what he said. That's good news. I've never personally met any of you. We've never sat through the same Bible classes or attended the same Bible studies, but we agree totally about what the Scritures say, and respond pretty much the same when asked similar questions. That makes us good witnesses. When police officers are trying to piece together what happened during a particular event, they ask witnesses to tell them what the saw. Each person will tell you the story from their particular vantage point, but from their stories you get a good overall picture of the happening. I'm very proud of our witness with the people at R/S. We have no control over how the information is received, because the people reading have their own preconceived notions to deal with. If we remain calm and consistent, regardless of how it is accepted, one day that will sink in. I personally think the day is here for some. Have you noticed how God put new footsoldiers into place who picked up our banners and have been running valiantly with them. Some of the persons who are carrying forward for us are current Adventists who have come to the conclusions we had some time ago. They are clear, well-read, articulate, and obviously in-dwelt by the Holy Spirit. It is so amazing to see the Lord work in this way. I refuse to use names of our own who are still posting, because we want them there as long as possible. Father in Heaven, We are in awe of you. You have left nothing to chance, and it is clear that we were called, and that you have a purpose in all of this. There is no thwarting your purpose once you have begun to exhibit your will. We praise you, and are humbled that we were chosen to participate in this effort of yours to open the eyes and hearts of victims of delusion. Strengthen and energize our replacements, we pray. We pray you will continue to use us in the place, and at the time that is at your disposal. We want so much to see your work completed and to be able to go home to those lovely homes you have prepared for us. We all are saying, "Even so, come Lord Jesus." Amen. | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1338 Registered: 3-2004 |
Amen, Amen, Amen. Let us continue to pray for those current posters who are SDA and for those opposing them. Diana | ||
| Bob Registered user Username: Bob Post Number: 177 Registered: 7-2000  |
Here is an insightful quote from Chuck Swindoll on the damage done to one's family by legalism. I'm not sure of the reference. I think it is from his website: "You want to mess up the minds of your children? Here's how - guaranteed! Rear them in a legalistic, tight context of external religion, where performance is more important than reality. Fake your faith. Sneak around and pretend your spirituality. Train your children to do the same. Embrace a long list of do's and don'ts publicly, but hypocritically practice them privately . . . yet never own up to the fact that it's hypocrisy. Act one way but live another. And you can count on it - emotional and spiritual damage will occur." Bob | ||
| Lisa_boyldavis Registered user Username: Lisa_boyldavis Post Number: 36 Registered: 3-2005 |
Dear FAF's, I'm entirely ignorant, but what other sites are you talking about... what are the goals of the sites? Are they forums where SDA's are questioning their beliefs? Are they growing in Christ on these sites, or simply trying to answer questions that have been raised by the web sites addressing false doctrine of the SDA church? Are you finding people growing and changing, or are your warnings simply landing on deaf ears and blind eyes? Sometimes I wonder what the best approach is with my family and all other confused rebellious SDA's, try to convert them via facts and prayer, or wait for God's timing when their eyes and ears are open. My biggest trouble are with so many SDA who believe almost identical to what Ted and I now believe but still think they should stay in the church because all churches have problems.... I don't understand taking a name and not believing anything the name stands for. So, about these forums, are they needing persons like myself to combat their lies? I'm still on the books (until next Oct. when - after an entire year - we make it official). Lisa | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 169 Registered: 3-2005 |
Belva, I have noticed the same thing, with these evangelical SDAs, they are picking up exactly where we left off, and are making their arguments in a calm, reasoned way--It is amazing, the Holy Spirit is working in a mighty way! Stan | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 307 Registered: 7-2004 |
Dear Lisa, Follow this URL, http://www.revivalsermons.org/forums/index.php?sid=92fce09c75c4d3e6e55c9ecf7bd5d53f, and you will find yourself at a Pastor Richard O'Ffill's RevivalSermons Website. Until mid-February the posters were mostly SDA, and they discussed SDA issues. The Pastor has a grandson who attends Damascus Road Church. This is a formerly SDA congregation that studied the true Gospel, and the entire congregation dropped out of the SDA way. He was concerned about the salvation of his grandson, and his SDA friends were handling his concern the way most SDA's handle such things. Someone posted a message here, including the URL, stating that a bunch of SDA's were camping on the grandson and a few of us have been posting on their once exclusively SDA site every since. Last week four or five of us were banned when we brought the subject or Investigative Judgment and asked that it be validated using scripture only. Actually it was I who asked the question, but only after the good pastor opened the gate by mentioning the doctrine in passing. The people at RevivalSermons were invited over here a long time ago indicating that if they wanted to engage in open discussions of scripture and theology they would be welcome. At some point last week one of their number reported the things we had been sharing with each other, the pastor came over, took a look, and axed some of us. After we were banned we started this new thread so that we can still communicate with people who read only (the internet term is Lurkers). If you would like to find out where the battles have been raging, look for the threads under "From The Pastor's Desk," "Issues of Contemporary Worship," and "Town Hall." There was also a very lively exchange that took place on one of the weekly Sabbath School Discussions. You will recognize the threads we have engaged in mostly by the number of posts and/or multiples of pages involved in each topic. If, after you have come up-to-speed, you feel you are lead by the Holy Spirit we will welcome your endeavors and pray for you as you post. | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 308 Registered: 7-2004 |
Dear Lisa, Follow this URL, http://www.revivalsermons.org/forums/index.php?sid=92fce09c75c4d3e6e55c9ecf7bd5d53f, and you will find yourself at a Pastor Richard O'Ffill's RevivalSermons Website. Until mid-February the posters were mostly SDA, and they discussed SDA issues. The Pastor has a grandson who attends Damascus Road Church. This is a formerly SDA congregation that studied the true Gospel, and the entire congregation dropped out of the SDA way. He was concerned about the salvation of his grandson, and his SDA friends were handling his concern the way most SDA's handle such things. Someone posted a message here, including the URL, stating that a bunch of SDA's were camping on the grandson and a few of us have been posting on their once exclusively SDA site every since. Last week four or five of us were banned when we brought up the subject of Investigative Judgment and asked that it be validated using scripture only. Actually it was I who asked the question, but only after the good pastor opened the gate by mentioning the doctrine in passing. The people at RevivalSermons were invited over here a long time ago indicating that if they wanted to engage in open discussions of scripture and theology they would be welcome. At some point last week one of their number reported the things we had been sharing with each other, the pastor came over, took a look, and axed some of us. After we were banned we started this new thread so that we can still communicate with people who read only (the internet term is Lurkers). If you would like to find out where the battles have been raging, look for the threads under "From The Pastor's Desk," "Issues of Contemporary Worship," and "Town Hall." There was also a very lively exchange that took place on one of the weekly Sabbath School Discussions. You will recognize the threads we have engaged in mostly by the number of posts and/or multiples of pages involved in each topic. If, after you have come up-to-speed, you feel you are lead by the Holy Spirit we will welcome your endeavors and pray for you as you post. Belva | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 541 Registered: 10-2004  |
Wow, "JohnH" at RS wrote the following:
Jeremy | ||
| Lisa_boyldavis Registered user Username: Lisa_boyldavis Post Number: 42 Registered: 3-2005 |
Jeremy, Someone's in lala land for sure! Where could you even start with a cowboy like that? Lisa | ||
| Jerry Registered user Username: Jerry Post Number: 446 Registered: 6-2002 |
"Wow" indeed, but is it not also so very like false bravado. Whenever someone makes an inflexible, sweeping, absolute statement like that, it is almost always unsupportable with facts. I have met many, many non-SDAs who run rings around the most elite Bible Scholars I have read from BRI and elsewhere. On the other hand, lets disect the bolded statement
First you must understand the phrase ". . . what the Bible teaches . . ." By definition, it should be read ". . . what EGW and the SDA General Conference teaches about the Bible . . ." So, with that in mind, only someone who believes EGW can "know" it. Sort of like saying "Only people who believe the world is flat know that the world is flat." <<whew, getting dizzy . . . too many circles . . .>> | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 309 Registered: 7-2004 |
Lisa, I trust you have had a look around R/S and are getting comfortable looking things over. There is nothing like reading the posts of current historic Adventists to confirm you in you newfound joy in Christ. The very next emotion you feel is concern and love for the mislead. Even for the difficult to deal with you have a certain affinity, because you can see a bit of your former self in them. Belva | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 542 Registered: 10-2004 |
Regarding a flat world, here are the EGW quotes that I posted in the "We've Been Fooled" thread at RS: "A man was present who had expressed a desire to see me and talk with me in regard to the round and flat world. I sent him a message that when Christ gave my commission to do the work He had placed upon me, the flat or round world was not included in the message;" (ELLEN G. WHITE, Manuscript Releases Volume Twenty-one, page 414:2.) "We have nought to do with the question whether this world is round or flat." (ELLEN G. WHITE, Manuscript Releases Volume Twenty-one, page 421:4.) "It is better to pray and humble the soul before God and let the world, round or flat, be just as God has made it." (ELLEN G. WHITE, Manuscript Releases Volume Twenty-one, page 413:2.) "Let those who are presenting theories as to whether the earth is round or flat, leave this question, for God has not given it to them to solve, and earnestly inquire, 'What shall I do that I may have everlasting life?'" (ELLEN G. WHITE, Manuscript Releases Volume Twenty-one, page 419:6.) So Ellen White didn't know whether the earth was flat and said you couldn't know whether or not the earth was flat! It's crazy, because it had been proven and everyone knew (except for the few crazy people with the Flat Earth Society) just like today, that the earth was round WAY before that. They even had globes before she wrote that!! And here is the clincher: quotes 1, 2, and 4 of the above quotes were written in 1904 (the 3rd one was from 1887). But in 1900, EGW herself wrote that the world was round! "God rested on the seventh day, and set it apart for man to observe in honor of His creation of the heavens and the earth in six literal days. He blessed and sanctified and made holy the day of rest. When men are so careful to search and dig to see in regard to the precise period of time, we are to say, God made His Sabbath for a round world; and when the seventh day comes to us in that round world, controlled by the sun that rules the day, it is the time, in all countries and lands, to observe the Sabbath. In the countries where there is no sunset for months, and again no sunrise for months, the period of time will be calculated by records kept. But God has a world large enough, and proper and right for the human beings He has created to inhabit it, without finding homes in those lands so objectionable in very many, many ways. [...] The Sabbath was made for a round world, and therefore obedience is required of the people that are in perfect consistency with the Lord's created world." (Letter 167, 1900.) What does "people that are in perfect consistency with the Lord's created world" mean?? So, according to this quote, she was wrong when she later wrote that we couldn't know whether the earth was round or flat and that it wasn't part of her message that the Lord gave her! What an amazing contradiction. Also notice the apparent animosity she had towards the Arctic areas, etc., because they didn't fit her Sabbath doctrine very well.  There is also something else amazing from that same letter that I quoted:
There you have it folks. Ellen G. White says that the precise minutes and hours of the Sabbath are not important! Then how, pray tell, is the precise DAY so important? And if you have the wrong minutes/hours, you may be keeping Sabbath on the first day of the week, as the early SDA pioneers, including Ellen, did when they kept it 6pm-6pm, while condemning others for keeping Sabbath at the "wrong time"! Jeremy | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 310 Registered: 7-2004 |
I have another post from Walk that I would like to respond to. To set this up, he has been engaged in a back-and-forth with FreeAtLast over the law. We who have been in discussions with Walk in the past know that he continually quotes from Revelation--Here is the patience of the saints, here are they that keep the commandments of God and have the faith of Jesus. FreeAtLast admitted that he doesn't keep the commandments (what an honest man/woman!). After that Free asked Walk if he keeps the commandments. Walk has been avoiding a direct response. Here is a quote from Walk_In_The_Light: ---------- Is that a fair question? It is this type of leading and baiting question that you and other FA's ask that invokes the most bitter spirit. Please refrain from enforcing your personal agenda's by baiting SDA believers into self-contradiction. For the scripture says in 1 John 1:8 that If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth id not in us. The sinlessness of Christ only comes through faith in Christ. For noone could be pronounced righteous enough to save unless he has on the White raiment. The question remains however, will you gain this righteousness by obeying or being disobedient? Will you then be in the right counseling people that it does not matter whether they keep the Sabbath commandment or not? Will God accept your service if you do thusly? ---------- Dear Walk, How do you define obedience? Is it keeping the law, or is it repentance and surrender? It is one or the other--it cannot be both. Jesus told a story of a man that threw a party, and he invited all of his friends. They all had excuses and he ended up with a lot of prepared food, and no one to eat it. He then sent his servants out into the highways and byways to invite total strangers to the feast. The only thing the people who came to the feast had to do was put on the white robe that the servants gave them. My interpretation of that parable is that the first invitation went out to the Jewish people, that is where Jesus ministered--they were friends, but they snubbed him. Next he sent the invitation out to strangers (Gentiles like you and me). The white robe represents Jesus' righteousness. The feast is salvation. Put on Jesus' righteousness and the feast is yours to enjoy. No other requirements. Walk, I have a question for you. Do you trust Jesus enough to surrender all to him, even your pride in the law? Are you afraid that he can't truly clean up your life without your help? When Jesus comes again he WILL find a group of people on this earth wearing the white robes he has provided, and they will thereafter enjoy eternity with Jesus. What has suited them for heaven will be repentance from sins, and complete reliance upon Jesus for their salvation. Over and over in scripture the people of God are described as people who actively faith--faithers. You made the comment about the sinlessness that comes through Jesus Christ. Actually, you're almost there. Jesus was/is sinless. You are not. He has given you His sinlessness by faith (the white robe). There is no room for boastfulness in any of us. We don't get to wear our own clothes. We put on the clothes He gives us. If FA's are constantly baiting you about the law, it is because you set yourself up for those questions. When you communicate with us you are so intent on the law, actually about only one of the laws, that it seems you have forgotten that the only righteousness that is truly right is the righteousness that is the free gift of grace throught the substitutionary life, death, resurrection, and kingship of Jesus Christ. That is something I have often heard you and others refer to as "cheap grace." This grace has come to us as the result of the dearest price ever paid, so it is not cheap! Until you can acknowledge that your righteousness has nothing to do with you and everything to do with Jesus, you will find yourself in a round-robin of discussion with us Formers. Belva | ||
| Tealeaves Registered user Username: Tealeaves Post Number: 228 Registered: 5-2004 |
I have noticed that most SDAs will vehemently protect and defend even what they are not 100% convicted of, just because it is ascribed to SDAism. That makes me think that many of the SDAs who ARE questioning, are not doing so openly, but rather arguing and fighting tooth and nail against the former-SDAs, but probably actually researching and taking to heart some of what is said, even though it doesn't show on the outside. I know this was true of my husband (then just a friend) when I first met him. He resited and resisted all my ideas for years, because I was not SDA. now, 10 years after we met and 7 years after we married, he can say that he totally denounces Adventism. But I am here to say that he fought long and hard for the cause of Adventism, a cause he was not even sure of in his heart, out of fear of the unknown, and fear of condemnation. So when i see these SDAs on some of the sites battling and lashing out, I think that many of them are not nearly as convinced of their own words and ideas as they prtray themselves to be. So in that light, I think it probably IS worthwhile for us to continue the discussions, even when we think we aren't getting anywhere. Just my observations.... -tanya- | ||
| Jjustinn Registered user Username: Jjustinn Post Number: 13 Registered: 3-2005 |
Can anyone help me understand why no Adventists are responding to the texts in Deuteronomy? | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1345 Registered: 3-2004 |
Jjustin, Please refresh our memories which texts these are. Diana | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 312 Registered: 7-2004 |
Justin, if they did, they would have to admit that their Sabbath doctrine might be on shakey ground. Their reason for saying the Sabbath memorializes creation is because they would have you believe that mankind was celebrating it from the time of the Garden of Eden onward. They don't want to face the fact that Moses may have made a rhetorical comment in the Exodus account by making the "for in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, and rested the seventh day" statement. More than a few of the SDA doctrines that they would have you believe are eternal are built on shifting sands. The same is true of the the reiteration of the 10 commandments in Deuteronomy. If they acknowledge that list, then they have to take a step back and rethink the other list just a little bit. | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 543 Registered: 10-2004 |
There is another post on RS that is so shocking that I have to post here. It is from "BibleTruth":
We are supposed to exalt the law above all (worship the law)?!?! And he makes it sound like there are 3 (other) gods (tritheism). Jeremy | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1346 Registered: 3-2004 |
One of the posters on the R/S site, who is currently SDA, if I remember correctly, just got banned from that site. His name is Stephen. Let us continue to pray for the posters standing up for Jesus Christ and for the SDAs, that they will listen and accept Jesus only. Diana |
