| Author | Message | ||
| Lindylou Registered user Username: Lindylou Post Number: 42 Registered: 1-2005 |
Hi all, I just came across an article in the March 05, copy of the National Geographic. The issue was emphasizing the topic of the brain. The article, entitled: "Extreme Expression" talks about the condition of hypergraphia. ("A manic disorder characterized by an irrepressible urge to write and write and write.") Here are a few quotes: Hypergraphia : "the condition is more commonly a symptom of manic depression, mania and other mood disorders. It is most often associated with temperal lobe epilepsy, a disorder that may also lead to hyper-religious feelings and a sense that even the most rivial events are filled with heightened meaning and cosmic importance.. The hypergraphic patient's compulsion to write all the time is not, alas, accompanied by any increase in talent." The article highlights the experience of a woman who developed this mental disorder when she suffered an emotional trauma in her life. "The nagging need to write something down would wake her in the middle of the night to scribble in the dark, surrounding herself with a litter of scrawled notes." Does this remind you of someone else? I found it fascinating to see the parallels between the symptoms of this disorder and one EGW. Being hit in the head and almost dying would account as a trauma that might bring on temporal lobe epilepsy. (No increase in talent might account for the reason to copy other people's work.)  | ||
| Dt Registered user Username: Dt Post Number: 12 Registered: 4-2005 |
I have also been fascinated by this and have read it in other places. It is interesting that others with this condition combined with (Catalepsy or Temporal Lobe Epilepsy) also had "visions" and visitations very similar to what EGW described and almost used her exact words in describing their writings as some of the most important ever written with a message for all mankind. (Blah, Blah, Blah) One woman wrote all over the walls of her home lists and lists of everything in her life. Read much of EGW's letters and you will see a lot of lists. | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1406 Registered: 3-2004  |
Thanks for that information. I am so glad God put in me a dislike of hearing her mentioned in church a looooong time before I actually was put out of the church. I am interested in how the brain works and disfunctions when it is injuried. God made us wonderfully and he is so awesome. Diana | ||
| Jan Registered user Username: Jan Post Number: 28 Registered: 1-2005 |
Go to this website and you can read directly about EGW and hypergraphia: http://millennium.fortunecity.com/lincoln/666/headinjury/ Under "Behavioral Symptoms: you will find information on hypergraphia associated with temporal lobe epilepsy. Keep reading down and you will also find the interesting characteristics of: Repetitiveness and Hypermorality When I mentioned this on the Revival Sermons website I was told I am "of the Devil." | ||
| Greg Registered user Username: Greg Post Number: 110 Registered: 2-2005 |
Here are some more links on this topic for your consideration. http://www.ellenwhite.org/egw79.htm These two are from the UK. Note footnote #4 on the second one. http://www.askwhy.co.uk/truth/470Mystical.html http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/A3851093 And the response from the White Estate: http://www.whiteestate.org/issues/visions.html I have first hand knowledge that at the Johns Hopkins School of Medicine, the neurologist who lectures on temporal lobe epilepsy uses Ellen G. White as his example of both hypergraphia and hyperreligiosity. Greg | ||
| Bobalou Registered user Username: Bobalou Post Number: 17 Registered: 2-2005 |
I had a friend who after a terrible automobile accident was sort of a genius with numbers. She loved baseball and could tell you how many runs, hits, errors etc. from way back. She lived out her days in a nursing home because she couldn't manage everyday life. I truly believe Ellen had a brain disorder and James and others used her to their advantage. I do not believe she could have deceived the many on her own. | ||
| Bob Registered user Username: Bob Post Number: 213 Registered: 7-2000  |
In view of the Final Judgment, for her sake I hope her writing and clams were because of a brain disorder beyond her control. God is a merciful God who would take that into consideration. It might be a different matter for those who shamelessly manipulated her illness for their own selfish ends! Bob | ||
| Bob Registered user Username: Bob Post Number: 214 Registered: 7-2000 |
In view of the Final Judgment, for her sake I hope her writing and claims were because of a brain disorder beyond her control. God is a merciful God who would take that into consideration. It might be a different matter for those who shamelessly manipulated her illness for their own selfish ends! Bob | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 1827 Registered: 12-2003  |
I think Ellen started with a disorder James manipulated and took advantage of, but her "visions" ceased as she reached her mid to later years. Then she began having her "dreams" guided by the same handsome young man and sometimes accompanied by other classic occult phenomena such as the smell of roses, etc. She lived for years after James died--she was quite able to perpetuate the control and messages from God to her advantage until she died. It seems to me that her power went to her head. In some way she put herself on dangerous ground--somewhere in there I believe she ceased being a victim and became independently deceptive and open to influences not from God. Praise God for delivering us! Colleen | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1409 Registered: 3-2004 |
Whether EGW was used or let herself be used is beyond my control. Or she knew what was happening and continued it after her husband died. All I can say is, I do not believe in her any more. As Colleen says above, Praise God for delivering us!!! God you are awesome. Diana | ||
| Dt Registered user Username: Dt Post Number: 13 Registered: 4-2005 |
Greg and Jan, thanks for the links. Once again the experts can't ever agree. Don't you just love the way the White Estate always rides to the rescue with unbiased critical analysis? Such as this: "On September 1, 1983, the trustees of the Ellen G. White Estate appointed a committee to examine all pertinent information available concerning the nature of Ellen Whiteís visions and render an opinion. After a thorough examination, this committee, consisting of eight professors in the Loma Linda University School of Medicine and Nursing, including three neurologists, and a well-known psychiatrist from northern California, concluded" That is definitely an unbiased group. Professors from LLU. Six-figure earners with tenure...What's not to like? I have some questions I would love to ask of a person like this in a open forum, such as: 1. why couldn't God EVER give her something original? In 1863 she had her big health vision. It was the middle of the Civil War in which thousands were dying from Typhoid and Dysentary (soldiers and civilians). Both were very easily prevented through proper sanitation. How about something as simple as pasteurizing milk? People were dying of everything imaginable and all she could tell them was not to eat meat and thereby avoid masturbating. Examine the great prophets of the Bible and you will find original messages from God to radically change the direction of the church or the world. | ||
| Dt Registered user Username: Dt Post Number: 15 Registered: 4-2005 |
Oops. Forgot to add that, adding to Colleen's comments, if she had no illness then there is absolutely NO EXCUSE for stealing from other writers and lying about it. Let alone then selling it for a profit. Someone in church commented recently that in writing the GC Satan tried to kill her twice to keep it from being written. I had to laugh. She was ALWAYS on the verge of death. Just quitting vinegar consumption made her and all around her think she was going to die. Hardly adds to her credibility. | ||
| Jan Registered user Username: Jan Post Number: 29 Registered: 1-2005 |
Can someone please give me some information Ellen White's twin sister and what happened to her? How did she relate to Ellen? | ||
| Bobalou Registered user Username: Bobalou Post Number: 20 Registered: 2-2005 |
The greatest theme in the New Testament is Salvation by Grace. Yet Ellen prophesied for 44 years and her angel never told her about it and evedently she glossed over it. Think about it. She continued all that time telling them that salvation comes by works. Jones and Wagner had to inform her/them in 1888 that all that time they were wrong. And members still don't get it. Actually most of her "prophesying" was just pure meddling and she was able to bind and sell that junk. I should burn my shelf full of worthless nonsense, but I hesitate because I do use it for reference at times. | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1410 Registered: 3-2004 |
Dt. Satan had to make it look authentic. If she said he tried to kill her, then that would give her more credence, wouldn't it. And in spite of all the proof that she lied, plagairized, had other write for her, she is still believed and the GC leaders are the leaders of the pack in upholding her. Not that the members cannot think for them selves. But when they have been programmed to believe her and her "salvation way of life" it is hard to break away. Bobalou, I threw mine away just about a year ago and when I need a reference I ask Jeremy. He is a sweetheart and looks it up for me. I do not ask him very often. Thank you God for putting in me a dislike for EGW many years ago, more than 30. You are truly awesome. Diana | ||
| Dennis Registered user Username: Dennis Post Number: 373 Registered: 4-2000  |
Dt, Good points about Ellen White's infamous 1863 health reform vision. Certainly, this vision did not address the serious public health problems that were present at that time. Instead of pointing out a pasteurization process for milk products, she simply advised that cheese should never enter our stomachs, ad infinitum. Interestingly, the first booklet that Ellen White wrote after the 1863 health reform vision was entitled, "AN APPEAL TO MOTHERS: The great cause of the physical, mental, and moral ruin of many of the children of our time." All the case histories given in that book resulted in their entering "Christless graves." None could overcome masturbating. I find the following description of a male that practiced masturbation rather humorous, "He could not hold his head steady. His eyes had a glassy appearance, his hands trembled, and when he walked, his knees shook; he staggered like a drunken man, and often seemed ready to fall." (Appeal to Mothers; Steam Press of the Seventh-day Adventist Publishing Association, Battle Creek, MI; 1964). My favorite quote in the booklet is the following about those who masturbate: "Such are just as surely self-murderers as though they pointed a pistol to their breast, and destroyed their life instantly." (Ibid) As Dr. Ronald Numbers aptly pointed out in his 1976 book, Ellen White believed in the popular nineteenth-century concept of vitalism. This view taught that one only has a pre-determined amount of "vital force" in his body and thereafter death comes quickly. Therefore, according to this theory, prudent human beings would limit and/or ration their sexual expressions, etc. Ellen White further warned that those engaging in "self-abuse" would suffer from "...various diseases, such as catarrh, dropsy, headache, loss of memory and sight, great weakness in the back and loins, affections of the spine, THE HEAD OFTEN DECAYS INWARDLY." (Ibid., Emphasis mine) Scary stuff, right? :>) In their introductory remarks, the trustees of the SDA Publishing Association recommended the following distribution for APPEAL TO MOTHERS: "It would perhaps be well for every member of the family to possess a copy for his or her own personal possession." To my knowledge, Adventists have never published another book or booklet with the suggestion of having personal copies for EVERY MEMBER of the family. Apparently, this is the most important book that Adventists have ever published. Dennis J. Fischer | ||
| Dennis Registered user Username: Dennis Post Number: 374 Registered: 4-2000 |
CORRECTION: I inadvertently typed "1964" instead of 1864 as the date for AN APPEAL TO MOTHERS. My apologies! --DJF | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 1832 Registered: 12-2003 |
Dennis, you make me laugh! I know this is serious stuff, but your summary statements are often so ironically logical! It just amazes me what rationalizing we (well, I) did in order to maintain some sort of loyalty to Ellen. And such great points, Dt and Dennis, about the "health message". Could it be possible that God actually worked through the honest efforts of Pasteur and Lister (who introduced antiseptic surgery) while their contemporary who was acclaimed as God's messenger muddled around with reform dress and counsels against cheese and baking soda? Really, it boggles my mind. I just recently read someone stating yet again that Ellen was far "ahead of her time" with her health message. It's all rather embarrassing and humbling and freeing to realize just how deceived I was. Praising God for His mercy and truth, Colleen | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 586 Registered: 10-2004  |
I know. The woman actually taught that you would go to hell if you ate bread made with baking soda! That's just...there's not much more to say about that! Heh. And she called this nonsense "the gospel of health" and actually said that it was for the salvation of SDAs and the world! Jeremy | ||
| Seekr777 Registered user Username: Seekr777 Post Number: 122 Registered: 1-2003  |
Jeremy, can you give me the two quotes . . . one where she says you will go to hell if you eat bread made with baking soda and the other where she says "the gospel of health" is for the salvation of SDAs and the world? Thanks, Richard rtruitt@mac.com |
