| Author | Message | ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 881 Registered: 7-2003  |
Okay, I'm really kicking myself this morning. I did an interview with the St. Louis station that is interviewing former SDAs all week and I was asked to describe the IJ (not my listed topic). I realized after I hung up the phone that I referred to the IJ as a "future judgement" of believers works to see if they are "fit for Heaven" or in modern terms "safe to save". According to SDA theology, the IJ is only "future" for those of us who are still alive, but even that is uncertain. Since it began in 1844 it is possible that Jesus is judging the living the right now according to SDAs. By calling it "future" I believe I unwitingly minimized the threat and fear that SDAs live under. Doh! That's really killing me. That's what happens when someone who really hates morning interacts with people at 6:45 a.m. I hope another guest gets to correct my mistake on this. But other than that, the host of the show seems very knowledgable about Adventism and seems very friendly to the former point of view. Please pray for the folks who will be on during the last couple of days. Chris | ||
| Taybie Registered user Username: Taybie Post Number: 25 Registered: 4-2005 |
Be encouraged, Chris. The Lord blessed your time on air and He will do any correcting, if necessary. I am sure you were an immense blessing to the listening audience! He is WORTHY!!! Shontay | ||
| Melissa Registered user Username: Melissa Post Number: 954 Registered: 7-2003  |
You know, Chris, it will be the whole of what you had to say, not a single word that people will retain. You understand the nuance of what you said, but as a non-SDA not versed in adventism, that detail wouldn't have struck me near as much as being "fit for Heaven" or "safe to save". Those terms would have really hit me as completely unBiblical. I'm just like you and would just churn on that single "mis-speak", but it is really your overall message that will leave an impression. God will use it all for his glory, in his time ... as we say all the time. Don't let Satan rob you for the good you did. | ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 882 Registered: 7-2003 |
Thank you Taybie and Melissa! Really. Your words are very calming. I absolutely hate making facutal errors, but at least on this forum I can do a follow up post correcting myself. When there's no way to truly correct my error I tend to just obsess over it. I'm definately obsessing right now. That's one of the areas of my life that I really need to turn over to Jesus and just trust Him with my anxiety. Intellectually I know he can use me even with my many imperfections and errors, but emotionally I always acutely aware of my inadequacy. I really appreciate the support this group provides. Chris | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 502 Registered: 3-2005 |
Don't worry Chris. It is never easy doing those kind of interviews. Tim Behrends, who did the interview used to have a morning show in Los Angeles on KBRT 740 AM. He used to talk about veggie-burgers that LLU served. Stan | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 2257 Registered: 12-2003  |
Chris, I wouldn't worry! God is and was in charge, and He will help people to hear what they needed to hear. I'm frequently astonished at what different "takes" people have on the same Bible study, for instance. Everyone is in the same room hearing the same words, but God teaches each person what they need to know. His Spirit is the one who broke the curse of Babel and made the apostles able to speak other languages, and, I believe, he also helps people hear. What matters is that you were willing to be used by God, and He will multiply the truths you spoke and correct whatever details needed to be submerged. You can trust Himóand I'm grateful that you were willing to speak for Him! We all love you, Chris! Colleen PS--"future judgment" isn't such a heinous mistake, anyway. The point is that God supposedly doesn't "know" who is "safe to save" at the moment of their deaths. People have to die not knowing and be surprised later. You did just fine, Chris! | ||
| Dennis Registered user Username: Dennis Post Number: 425 Registered: 4-2000  |
Chris, I am sure you did a great job on your radio interview this morning. I too wish that I had worded some things differently when I was interviewed last week. I was asked at least a half dozen questions that were not related to my selected topic. I am consoled by fact that God uses even our imperfect words to proclaim Biblical truth and to expose the heresies of Adventism. God is truly awesome! Dennis Fischer | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 2259 Registered: 12-2003 |
Dennis, do you mind sharing a bit about your interview? What was your topic, and what kinds of questions did the host ask? When I did my interview last week, my subject was soul sleep/the human spirit. Since the main host, Tim Berends, is a former WWCG member, he admitted he still had questions about the subject, and he let me talk most of the time. His questions related to the subject. I could tell he was digesting it for his own sake. He asked me to pray for Adventists at the end of the interview. God is awesome--I praise Him that He gives us small roles to play in His story. Colleen | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1695 Registered: 3-2004  |
For all of you who were/are being interviewed I have been praying that God would put the words in your mind and mouth. God has a purpose for each of you who were and are going to be interviewed. Thanks for standing up for Jesus. He is awesome. Diana | ||
| Goldenbear Registered user Username: Goldenbear Post Number: 99 Registered: 12-2004 |
Hey Chris, What station was it? Do they stream? Archive? I for one, would be interested in hearing what the formers had to say. | ||
| Foreverscout Registered user Username: Foreverscout Post Number: 67 Registered: 3-2005 |
Yeah, what station, is it playing in Seatle, WA? Maybe I could get it slipped to my brother Bill along with his coffee, or whatever it is he has in the morning. Prayerfully, Foreverscout | ||
| Pw Registered user Username: Pw Post Number: 474 Registered: 6-2004 |
The IJ teaching doesn't make any sense no matter how it's described. Even the most rigid SDA's don't have a real grasp on it. | ||
| Melissa Registered user Username: Melissa Post Number: 955 Registered: 7-2003 |
They may not have a grasp on it, but they know it's "true" because it's taught by the church. At least that's the spin I got thrown when pressing someone to show it Biblically. Even after reading Cultic Doctrine, he still supported it as Biblical. Some people just wanna believe. The station was in St. Louis, I believe. | ||
| Pw Registered user Username: Pw Post Number: 475 Registered: 6-2004 |
A few months ago on another forum, I was debating with an SDA about the IJ and he claimed it's not even taught anymore in many SDA churches. I found that to be astounding, as since when did that issue become unimportant. Even if they claim it's to be "true", how is it now swept under the rug if it's so essential? | ||
| Pheeki Registered user Username: Pheeki Post Number: 594 Registered: 1-2003 |
It was taught as of 2-years ago in SS. I too thought it wasn't taught but then I walk smack dab into a dry erase board with the IJ all over it...straight out of Sabbath School. | ||
| Melissa Registered user Username: Melissa Post Number: 956 Registered: 7-2003 |
The only time I heard B's pastor teach 3 years ago, topic was IJ... His "solution" was to just make sure you're "prayed up" and you don't have to fear the judgement. Sounded so simple.... | ||
| Pw Registered user Username: Pw Post Number: 476 Registered: 6-2004 |
It just shows how the SDA church is not in unity with it's teachings. One SDA poster from Australia tried to convince everyone that they never use EGW writings in any of their messages or teachings and has no influence on their beliefs. Talk about living in denial. | ||
| Lydell Registered user Username: Lydell Post Number: 698 Registered: 7-2000 |
Diana, thanks for your prayers. When I was on I got into the need for Bible study after we leave the SDA's. It seems to me that we all are desperately wanting to know true doctrine when we leave the church. But my thinking is that we really probably can't begin to understand much doctrine until we study the Bible to find HIM. To me, the SDA picture of God is that of a distant authoritarian foster parent. The member is placed in the position of being a foster kid. He has no feeling of permanance living there. There are all these rules for him to follow. But he's a kid and he breaks rules, of course. So, I broke a rule, did I apologize adequately? Which rule is the most important one? How many times can I break a rule before I get kicked out? That sort of thing. But the Bible shows us that the Lord is an intimate and loving adoptive Father. As adopted kids we have a new name ("saved by grace") that replaces our old name ("sinner"). We have a new name and are part of the family. We are kids...we are definitely going to break the rules(sin), intentionally or otherwise. But as an adopted child, we have a loving Father who is going to work with us, train us, and help us to understand who we are so that we don't even want to do the wrong things anymore. That comes from Bible study, prayer, and just spending time with God. To me, until we have this view of Father, we have no reason to feel that we can trust Him to teach us truth, to be patient with us, to shield us from getting into more error, or to lead us to a church body. How is doctrinal truth going to be found if we only have the onesided picture of God's justice? We need to understand the mercy side as well. You know, I honestly think this twisted view of God is why so many of us struggle so much with finding a church body, with the fears that we feel. A foster parent WILL kick you out if he doesn't like what you are doing....doesn't matter if you feel you are doing it for right reasons. But a loving Father?....you can expect Him to go after you if you head the wrong direction and turn you around. Well hopefully that made sense. Colleen, I wanted to ask you something. Tim asked me a question that has me puzzled. It just seemed out of the blue and I didn't know what to respond, and really didn't care to respond because I didn't want to go into that subject. Anyway, he said something about understanding that sometimes the SDA's will hold meetings and not tell people who they are. I told him that was true. That when my husband led a Revelation Seminar he was told emphatically not to reveal who we were. Tim responded that well, he had heard of a Baptist group doing that, just giving the name of their publishing house, and that he could understand not wanting to have someone make a prejudicial judgement without listening to you. I just responded I'd never heard of anyone else doing that. And the conversation moved on. Any idea what that was about? | ||
| Lydell Registered user Username: Lydell Post Number: 699 Registered: 7-2000 |
Ah Chris...so YOU'RE the one that got the 6:45 slot. ha sorry.....but trust me, if they'd called me at that time of morning they would have been met by a blithering idiot. I know what you are feeling, there were a couple of things I wish I had said differently. But there is one thing the Lord has been trying to teach me, that is that when the words are REALLY important than He sees to it that we say THOSE. The rest we can let go of. And you always have to think of it this way, does he only bless the lips of the one who is speaking? or does he also bless the listener? Our pastor has told me about times someone will come up to him after a sermon enthusiastic and tell him about a specific point he has made that was just exactly what they need to hear that day. Will tell him weeks later what a huge impact that had on their lives. He says, "well, while what they relate that I said was definitely scriptural, I know I never said it in my sermon!" God is pretty darned good at His job! You have to realize that the "I should have saids" is an attack of the enemy. He doesn't like us to ever speak about the Lord. So it figures that when you have stepped forward and done something for God, he is going to want to smack you down someway to try to stop you from doing it again. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 2265 Registered: 12-2003 |
Great point, Lydell! I don't know where Tim's question came from. Dale says Tim is quite well-disposed to his (Dale's) views, so I don't know if he was just throwing out "stuff", shot-gun style, to get the audience's attention, or what. There's always the fact that they have "keeping the audience engaged" on their minds. Your answer was excellent. Colleen | ||
| Seekr777 Registered user Username: Seekr777 Post Number: 191 Registered: 1-2003  |
Is anyone getting a copy of all of these interviews? I'd love to get a copy to listen to ! ! ! Second question, who set up the interviews? Colleen did you have the job of selecting who was interviewed?  Richard rtruitt@mac.com | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 2270 Registered: 12-2003 |
Question 1: The host of the morning show told Dale that he will edit the interviews together and make them available to him. We will probably put them online as audio files at some point so they will be avialable to everyone. Question 2: Dale was responsible for the interviewees and the scheduling. He asked me to suggest a few names to him, but largely he selected the people to be on the air. Colleen | ||
| Dennis Registered user Username: Dennis Post Number: 427 Registered: 4-2000 |
Colleen, Tim Berends very briefly talked to me and handed the interviewing role over to a local minister. My topic was supposed to be how leaving Adventism has impacted my journey with Christ. Only the first question dealt with my selected topic. I briefly explained how I am no longer a "hope-so" Christian but rather I am now a "know-so" Christian. Most of the interview included questions such as are Adventists Christian, a cult, believe in Christ being an archangel similar to the JWs, amount of plagiarism in the writings attributed to Ellen White, etc. Finally, I was asked how the radio audience could get in touch with me. I responded FORMERADVENTIST.COM. Then he repeated the website address before concluding my segment on the Morning Show with Tim and Al. The most direct question was, "Are Adventists a cult?" I answered, "Yes, they are." Then he asked, "Why?" I responded by citing the SDA reliance on extrabiblical authority and thereby they are not truly Protestant in my view. I was amazed how many questions they squeezed into the 15-minute segment of air time. I trust the Lord used my imperfect replies to advance his kingdom. In awe of His grace, Dennis J. Fischer | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1713 Registered: 3-2004 |
Dennis, I am sure God used what you said and what every other person, interviewed, said. HE will be honored and glorified. I thank each of you for speaking up for Jesus. I am sure the SDAs did not appreciate it, but God's will, will be done. He is so awesome. Diana | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 518 Registered: 3-2005 |
Dennis, Thanks for having the courage to say what needs to be said. Most evangelicals do not understand what we as formers understand and that is the cultic nature of adventism. Whether it is the extra-biblical authority of EGW, or the slavish keeping of the Sabbath--without which you can't be saved-- to the estrangement from our family members that are still SDA, to their unique understanding of eschatology, that all endtime events will revolve around THEM! What more evidence is there neede to warrant using the "cult" word? Stan | ||
| Wooliee Registered user Username: Wooliee Post Number: 20 Registered: 6-2005 |
Stan, You are absolutely correct that most evangelicals do not understand the cultic nature of Adventism. I was trying to explain a little bit about it to someone today, and he just could not grasp it. On the surface the SDA church is full of people who claim to believe in salvation by grace through faith, but there is that under current of "I've got to do all these other things in order for God to accept and love me, otherwise He will be angry with me and punish me." I have Adventist friends who believe that out of a church of 100 or so people only three or four will be saved. I believe EGW said that, but I am not sure where. How sad and desperate is that? Julie | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1716 Registered: 3-2004 |
I have been very fortunate in my church to have met people who have dealt with adventists and have some idea of what they believe and know what cult like beliefs they have. Then there is a minister who works with the seniors, those over 55, who thinks SDAs are a good Christian group. The friends I have made have listened to me and know and understand why I did not return to the SDA church. God works in mysterious ways His wonders to perform and He did that with me. He is so awesome. Diana | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 2277 Registered: 12-2003 |
Dennis, how interesting. Praise God for giving you words and the opportunity to tell the truth. I so glad you were able to say all you said. I look forward to geting the edited interviews so I can hear them all! Colleen | ||
| Susan_2 Registered user Username: Susan_2 Post Number: 1881 Registered: 11-2002 |
Around a year ago the Review (Recorder?) had an article about a lady who converted to SDA'ism. Her reason for converting? She is an accountant and is good with nimbers and math and when she heard the IJ theory it all mathimatically made sence to her so she's now an Adventist. According to her it was all so logical. |
