| Author | Message | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 811 Registered: 10-2004  |
Javagirl, how wonderful! Praise God! Things sure are happening fast--you seem far removed from the feelings you had when you started posting here just a week ago! Praise the Lord. I'm praying for you. (And also for you, Julie.) Jeremy | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 484 Registered: 3-2005 |
Javagirl, I am very late in welcoming you to FAF, but I will welcome you anyway, and I agree with Jeremy, that it has been interesting following your progress. God bless you. Stan | ||
| Schasc Registered user Username: Schasc Post Number: 12 Registered: 10-2004 |
Have been reading this posting with interest tonight. My wife is taking a class this summer at the local Adventist college. It is a religion class and they had to wright a paper about which doctrine they disagreed with or had had a hard time following. My wife does not have the same questions that I have about some doctrines but she decided to write about the Sabbath and the struggle she feels sometime with keeping it the right way. (That is what has bothered me for alot of years...............it seems it is alot about keeping it the right way......), anyway we talked about this with my parents the other day and all the old questions came up: Is ok to eat out on Sabbath? Is it ok to go on a trip? What about this and what about that? Remember when you had to purchase your ticket for the Sabbath meal at campmeeting? My dad wasnt sure why handing a ticket to the cashier was better than handing them money! Despite that comment I know that they still feel like there are things that should and should not be done on Sabbath. After the conversation I said to my wife that it is impossible to try and keep a Old Covenant command in a modern world. It just creates enormous headaches for all..............Anyway having said all that I was interested in if any of you carry over any traditions a bout Sabbath that you enjoyed? Some of you made comments about things you enjoyed about Sabbath and in my wifes paper she talked about how special it was to be with her family on friday night and specialness that surrounded it all. Have any of you carried some of that over? I know this was a long way around the barn but I would be interested in hearing what you all think | ||
| Carol_2 Registered user Username: Carol_2 Post Number: 330 Registered: 2-2002  |
Javagirl! Another belated welcome!!!! Have been out of town for three weeks, and just catching up. If you are interested in trying a local church, you're welcome to join my husband and I at Wesleyan Fellowship. We are very blessed there, and I love the music. It's extremely contemporary, so may or may not be your cup of tea. You said you've been attending a Bible study for a few years now, but in case you're interested, the Liberty Church (across the highway from the SDA church in Marietta,) has a lot of ongoing studies, seems like they're always in the middle of a Beth Moore study, and I understand a new one will begin in the fall. Wesleyan did the Beth Moore study on Paul, and I regret not taking it. Paul has always fascinated me. If you would like to visit Wesleyan, we go to the 11:00 service in the summmer (Wayne and I teach kids during the school year, so attend at 9:00 and teach at 11:00.) We're meeting at the Lockheed Union Hall on the South Loop, next to Southern Polytechnic University. You mentioned other formers, you probably know the same ones I do, but I understand we have formers at Woodstock Baptist, Liberty Church, and I know of a few others, but don't know where they attend. One other thing, Greg Taylor has friends in the Atlanta area, and I know stays in touch with Jerry Gladstone, and is in the area occasionally (hope I'm getting the names right, it's late and I'm tired......new puppy is keeping me up!!!!) If you haven't read his story (Greg's,) you should. It's in the "stories" section. Before leaving the church, his screen name was "Nate." Colleen, if possible it would be great to meet Greg if we get together this fall! I think we all feel like we experienced his journey by his side. I remember at the time he was leaving, I too was at the same place. Sorry for the length.....Javagirl, stay in touch! Love and prayers to all! Carol | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 549 Registered: 7-2004 |
Dear Schasc, What I miss about Sabbath is setting aside quiet time, particularly on Friday evenings, after getting the house all cleaned and dinner things put away, we would put on soft music, and take time to just relax, maybe read or have worship. It was a special way of opening up the Sabbath hours. Each week was a new effort at keeping the Sabbath totally sacred. The earliest hours of the Sabbath, right after sunset, were the most memorable to me because it seemed we could get the first part of the Sabbath right more often than not, before the phone would ring, or some other "intrusion" brought the everyday back to our consciousnesses. Belva | ||
| Wooliee Registered user Username: Wooliee Post Number: 15 Registered: 6-2005 |
Hello Schasc, I agree with Belvalew. When I was a kid my family would pitch in with getting everything done before sundown. It was great getting out of school early on Fridays, going grocery shopping with our mom, and then coming home and finish cleaning the house. My dad would be home early too, and we would start our family time. My brother and I lived for that! When my husband and I start our family, we want to try to do the same thing for our children. I don't want it to become a burden though. I think my parents allowed the influence of others to make them feel guilty sometimes. To me the sabbath is all about enjoying what God gave us, like family, friends, and His creation. If we are busy worrying that we are not keeping it perfectly, then to me that isn't rest. I remember some people would frown upon it when we would take day trips on the sabbath to go up to the mountains, because we might have to buy gas or something. That is ridiculous in my opinion. I think the one tradition I still keep is having my work done before the weekend gets here. I don't like anything hanging over my head. Julie | ||
| Lydell Registered user Username: Lydell Post Number: 693 Registered: 7-2000 |
Now see, when we went into the denomination, we had been Christians for years. One of the things about the sabbath that always irritated me was the bit about rushing around to get all your work done. Mind you, when we started, I had a 4 year old and a baby that was two months premature. My husband helped where he could, but he worked full time too and often it would end up being quite late on Friday before he got off. All that rushig around was NOT, and NEVER did add to my enjoyment of the sabbath. By the time sabbath arrived I was too darned tired to enjoying anything. I tried to plan ahead, but stuff just invariably would come up on Friday. It is FAR better now to just step from the busy stuff and be with the Lord WHENEVER. No quilt, no condemnation, just enjoying time with my Friend. I don't need someone else to tell me when to do it. I just do it. One of the very favorite things we do after church is to have friends over or go out to eat. I think one of the stupidest, most irritating things I can remember about being SDA was the day I read a story in that paper they always gave to the primary class. It was a real tear jerker of a story about how a little boy was just incredibly guilty for playing with his toy cars on sabbath. And we won't even go into how rotten he was for wanting to fly his kite with his dad that day! After we had left the denomination, we were still allowing our son, age 10 to attend Pathfinders with a friend. He went on a campout with them once and came home and announced he would never go again. It seems that kids at another camp site had been playing with a football on sabbath when the ball had gotten away. Dan went over and picked it up, and tossed it back to them. One of the counselors came over and chewed his backside about it. He said, "mom, she made me feel like I was the lowest form of dirt. That sure doesn't sound like something Jesus would have done. Does she honestly think that Jesus would have fun with his friends and would laugh and enjoy them every day of the week except one?" Smart kid! | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1672 Registered: 3-2004  |
When I think of Sabbath I think of how God showed me to raise my son. On Satudays, when the weather was nice, we went to a local park and just enjoyed being outside in nature. When the weather was cold and rainy, we went to the Smithsonian Museums, especially the Museum of Natural History. When it was snowing out and we could not get out, I read to him from books about nature. They were books I got at the public library. I did get him a few books published by the SDAs, but they did not stick with him. I also read to him from Sam Campbell's books. How many of you remember them??? I have almost a complete set that my son now wants for his son. Now that they have a new house, I will send them to my Grandson. I did this things, I thought, on my own, because I wanted my son to enjoy the Sabbath, because I had not as a kid or teenager. It was not until withing the last year that I realized God had me raise my son in this way to prepare him and me to leave the SDA church. Now that my son is an adult he has told me that the adventism I taught him is not the adventism taught by the SDA church. He has thanked me for raising him the way I did. All I can say, is God did it. It shows me that God is such an awesome God. Diana | ||
| Wooliee Registered user Username: Wooliee Post Number: 16 Registered: 6-2005 |
Lydell, Your son is right on the money! What a crazy primary story...sounds like they were trying get the kids off to a good start with laying on the guilt. Nothing shows a joyful relationship with Jesus quite as well as a guilt ridden 10 year old (sarcasm intended). The difference for me now in getting ready for the weekend, is that if I don't get something done I'm okay with it. I know the world will not tilt off its axis if I don't have all my work done by sundown, and Jesus will still love me. I don't picture Him shaking His head at me in disappointment any longer. Julie | ||
| Javagirl Registered user Username: Javagirl Post Number: 19 Registered: 6-2005 |
hi carol I know Greg Taylor, and tried to get him via email,but it came back. Do you have a recent email address for him. | ||
| Chris Registered user Username: Chris Post Number: 875 Registered: 7-2003  |
I'm really the odd man out here and often feel out of palce when my friends who are formers have conversations about missing certain things about the Sabbath. I don't feel that at all and am not quite sure how to begin to identify. In my present life, my family and I take time to read a Bible story and pray together every evening after dinner. We put on Christian music throughout the evening and pretty much anytime we're around the house. Most evenings, when the weather is nice, we sit out on the porch after worship and talk or read. I'm currently reading through C.S. Lewis' Chronicles of Narnia wiith my kids. When the weather is bad we read indoors or play chess by the fire. We go for walks together, we go for ice cream together, we have lots' of relaxing family time. On a personal basis, I spend time each day reading my Bible and studying as well as reading various theology books that interest me at the time. I spend some time everyday walking and praying and communing with God. I have Christian music or Christian talk shows on in my car when I drive to and from work and even at work. I take time to relax each day and spend time with my family and with God.....these are my priorities. I guess what I am saying is that I can't imagine what I would possibly do differently in my life if I decided to start "keeping" Sabbath. My experince is that instead of losing one day out of seven, I gained an additional six. My Sabbath rest, peace, and enjoyment extends throughout the week. The things that I used to reserve for only one day and labeled as "Sabbath Activities" are now a way of life each and everyday for my entire family. Perhaps my puzzelment stems from the fact that I can't miss something that I never really lost. I guess I quit observing Sabbath, so I could finally start living it. Chris | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 814 Registered: 10-2004 |
Javagirl, Greg Taylor's web site (www.oneflockministries.org) has this email address: gregt@oneflockministries.org Jeremy | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 2239 Registered: 12-2003  |
Chris, I really have to agree with you. While I really did LOVE the Sabbath (Friday evenings, long nap on Sabbath, hikes, etc.), when we finally quit observing it, I have not missed a thing. The main thing that has been hard to adjust to (although I've adjusted quite well by now!) was going back to work the day after church! We still have great family time on many different days; we have friends over to dinner on Sundays after church, and Firday evenings have become way more of a highlight than Sabbath Fridays ever were. We have our FAF Bible study that night, and we always have such a really great experience delving into the Bible. We really learn a lot. And most of the group goes out to dinner together afterward. Our time together is so much more meaningful than the Sabbath dinners used to be. Conversation is more real, less filled with complaints or gossip. I know I cannot explain this so it makes sense to anyone just by reading it, but quite literally the reality of living with Jesus, of submitting and praying moment by moment as the days move by, is so much more intimate and peaceful and confident than Sabbath EVER used to be, that I truly do not miss the day at all. I thought I could never give up that day and the habits and traditions I loved. I was wrong. Jesus is 'WAY better than the day ever was! I don't mean to suggest that if you're keeping Sabbath you're not also living with Jesus. I just know that God really does a miraculous thing when people let go of the day in favor of Him. I think that for most of us, the day really had meaning and symoblism and even fears attached to it at a subliminal level. That's why it so hard for an Adventist to give it up. It is the shadow of Christ--of course it's a powerful symbol. It's easy to hang onto it and miss the reality we now have. I know it doesn't sound logical, but God really does replace even the most loved parts of Sabbath in amazing and inexplicable ways. Colleen | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 550 Registered: 7-2004 |
Dear Colleen, Correct me if I'm wrong, but my experience of being a "Sabbath Keeper" was that there was always a little bit of doubt about whether I was "keeping" it right. Also, when I got together with other SDA's I felt a little bit guarded about revealing me to them. I was never a vegetarian Adventist, so I had to slip and dodge there. I never have eaten a lot of meat, but it has always been in my diet. I never experienced myself as being as pious as everyone else seemed to be. Nature walks weren't as much fun for me because I missed that lesson in Pathfinders where one learns the genus and fila of every plant and lizard... It is simply profoundly clear that I was never cut out to be an Adventist in the first place My relationships with Christians now are much more open, because nobody is trying to impress anybody else with how far down that road to perfection they have traveled. All the Granny Longnoses that I encountered in SDA churches obviously are still there, and the rest of us are willing to get together and celebrate our freedom from sin, through the blood of Christ. Now I know that we still see that we are living in a sinful world, and we belong to a race that has sin in our very DNA. Even so, we know that we are more than overcomers In Jesus. There is certainly a lot more breathing space out here "in the Christian world." (I had to make that "in the world" comment because of all the times I've heard about this or that person becoming "worldly.") Belva | ||
| Melissa Registered user Username: Melissa Post Number: 952 Registered: 7-2003  |
Well, as a non-former, I can tell you Saturday used to be the most horrible day ever with the SDA I was involved with. He would do absolutely nothing he didn't want to do. He would play computer games on his computer, and when he wanted, he would go roller blading or biking (but in the summer it was way too hot to go at 3 in the afternoon, when he could break away from his SDA friends)...but he'd go to the pool. If it was football season and the chiefs were playing, he'd watch whether he was pretending not to or not. He would never help with meals, and absolutely wouldn't help clean up anything...even if his cats threw up on the floor or "missed" the litter box...disgusting! After nearly 5 years, the greatest thing I ever did for myself was tell him he couldn't come over on Saturdays any more. I didn't like that my son(s) were learning that mom does all the work while B sits on his back side and only does what he wants. I never saw him studying the Bible or spending any more time with God...I saw him sunbathing a lot during the summer, and he would lay on the couch and sleep, or he would watch me doing whatever project I was working on, but not lift a finger to help. Friday night was never anything special...he would go to a resturant sun up or sundown on Friday nights...sometimes in the winter he didn't even get off work until after dark. When you are not a sabbitarian, and have never been, it's quite fascinating watching the thought process...it took me a while to figure out why he always bought gas on Fridays, and some of his other habits. Towards the end, he would be willing to go to a resturant after 6 pm on Saturday, whether the sun was still up or not. Maybe he figured he'd pay after the sun had gone down...I don't know. I sure enjoy not having the judgmental comments or glares all afternoon on Saturdays! I know this is not the question asked, but I thought it might be an "interesting" perspective from the outsider in the group. | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 818 Registered: 10-2004 |
Melissa wrote:
Heh...maybe he converted to the early Adventist Sabbath: 6pm Friday to 6pm Saturday. ;-) Jeremy | ||
| Wooliee Registered user Username: Wooliee Post Number: 17 Registered: 6-2005 |
Belva, What you said about being guarded around SDAs is how I have felt my entire life. I have never felt like I could be myself outside of my family life, because that was never good enough. I am new in my journey out of Adventism, and I wonder now who am I? I want to be myself, but don't know just who that is right now. Maybe it is because I am still in shock, and I panic every now and then that I am making the wrong decision. One time I ran into a couple of older ladies from church, and they were eating corndogs. The looks on their faces were like, "Uh oh." You would have thought I caught them both with the devil's very own pinchforks in their hands! I wanted to hug them and say, "No, it's okay...here have a pork chop too! Jesus still loves you." I told them it was okay, and that I ate meat too, but they were still so ashamed. It was sad. I also remember being in the first, second, and third grade and HIDING my sandwiches that had meat in them. Kids would make fun of me, and I was so ashamed. I had one girl tell me all the time that I would not go to heaven if I ate meat. I remember thinking that if she was going to be in heaven then I did not want to be there! I went home and asked my mom to make me a salami sandwich (I even knew at that tender age that they thought pork was satan's food) for school the next day to which I was informed we did not eat anymore. Praise the Lord He is helping me find my way out of that garbage! Julie | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1681 Registered: 3-2004 |
Julie, God will help you find who you truly are and it is an exciting journey. You will like yourself even more and will know how to take care of yourself. And as you have discovered, it has nothing to do with what you eat, drink, or wear. I started wearing rings, necklaces, bracelets long ago, but I just could not have my ears pierced. A year ago February, God let me know it was okay to be good to myself and okay to pierce my ears. So I did. Yes, what we were in is Garbage and we can come out of that can, clean and white as snow. Isn't that fantastic and wonderful. I am always awed by what God does for me and others. Diana | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 1682 Registered: 3-2004 |
Belva, I understand about being guarded around SDAs. I remember thinking at the SDA church I attended in VA how people just could not talk about the problems in their lives. When I asked for prayers for my problems, a friend was told to tell me to quit complaining. I remember thinking, they must have some kind of problems, but they just cannot show it. I had forgotten the part in Adventism about having to be perfect, and doing it by oneself, without God's help. Fortunately, my SDA friends did not see God that way. With my 12 step program, God brought me part way out of adventism. Learning about EGW brought me out the rest of the way. Thank you so much God. You are so awesome. Diana | ||
| Belvalew Registered user Username: Belvalew Post Number: 561 Registered: 7-2004 |
Didn't Ellen make the statement that sickness and ill fortune came upon people as a result of sin in their lives? Of course I cannot give you the exact book/page reference, I know she made it clear that these things were the punishments that God used to get his people back into line. This is all very OC in nature, too. At any rate, bad things can happen to good people, but when those good people are also SDA, other SDA look for the sin in the lives of those good people. My theory is that when even a small portion of one's salvation must come from that person himself, then everyone living in alignment with that theory (that is what religions are, theories about how to live one's life) is in a type of competition to be the best at it. I believe, now, that is why Jesus took it all upon himself so nobody would have the right to boast, point fingers, or get elitist about their ranking with God. I praise God every day that I've been delivered from that manner of thinking. God doesn't love his own based on some ranking system, He loves us because Jesus loves us and died to save us. So simple, and so pure, and oh, so wonderful is Jesus. Belva |
