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Jeff_governale
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Username: Jeff_governale

Post Number: 1
Registered: 3-2006
Posted on Saturday, April 01, 2006 - 4:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Just as a point of interest: I was often skeptical of the claim of some writers giving Herbert Armstrong credit for "inventing" the Wednesday Crucifixion theory. In reading various web sources, the Wednesday hypothesis had been current in the Church of God Seventh Day during the 1920s. Bullinger, a founder of Grace Gospel, noted the Wednesday view in his study bible. My guess is that Bullinger and the late 19th. cen. 7COG folks read of the Wed. Hypothesis froma common source. This further disputes any claim HWA had to apostolic authority, but it also raises an interesting question: if SDAs and SDBs insist on keeping Saturday, then why are not Christians compelled to keep high holy days, new moons, or even the sacrificial system?
Colleentinker
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Username: Colleentinker

Post Number: 3666
Registered: 12-2003


Posted on Saturday, April 01, 2006 - 7:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Welcome to the forum, Jeff!

You ask a good questionóI've wondered that, too!

We look forward to hearing more of your story.

Colleen
Dennis
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Username: Dennis

Post Number: 644
Registered: 4-2000


Posted on Saturday, April 01, 2006 - 9:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A hearty FAF welcome, Jeff! We look forward to your participation in our conversation cafe.
Flyinglady
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Username: Flyinglady

Post Number: 2427
Registered: 3-2004


Posted on Saturday, April 01, 2006 - 10:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Jeff,
Welcome to the FAF. Please be comfortable here. Ask questions, join the discussions.
Let us know more about you, when you are ready.
God is awesome in all He does.
Diana
Lindylou
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Username: Lindylou

Post Number: 138
Registered: 1-2005


Posted on Monday, April 03, 2006 - 7:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Jeff, I think that your question is one that some fringe SDA's are answering as they get involved in a somewhat judeo/christian movement. I have relatives that believe that very thing - they feel that God has led them to keep all the feast days, holy days, ect.. They draw the line on the sacrificial system saying that Jesus did away with that with His sacrifice. There is a growing movement in Christian circles to embrace the Judeo system of laws and feast days.

A few months ago, in a loving attempt to convince me of this "new truth", I was given a book titled, "The Testimony of the Moon." This book claims the revelation of a 4th Angel's message. The basic premise of this book is that we should all be striving to be part of the 144,000 saints by:
Keeping all holy days and feast days, such as the 7th day Sabbath, Passover, feast of tabernacles and such, as well as avoid anything with pagan origins, like Christmas, Easter and Halloween. These folks believe that the moon was created by God to mark these holy days and feast days. These beliefs are also usually tied up with encouraging all to eat "healthfully" - like going on a raw food diet,ect... (Spare me!)

This is a website address for a site that talks more about this topic for the curious.

http://lightedway.org/public_html/html/index.html

It's definitely got SDA connections.

And lest I forget.... welcome to the forum!
Linda
Riverfonz
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Username: Riverfonz

Post Number: 1483
Registered: 3-2005
Posted on Monday, April 03, 2006 - 8:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Interesting website Lindylou. These people are moon worshippers. At least they are consistent in trying to go back to Judaism. Isaiah 66 could only be logically interpreted by Sabbathkeepers to also include keeping the new moons. One clue, that these folks have SDA roots is the section on hell. It seems to have been copied from Great Controversy. Just some thoughts on a quick review of that site.

Wow, the fourth angels message, "the testimony of the moon"!!

Stan

Colleentinker
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Username: Colleentinker

Post Number: 3679
Registered: 12-2003


Posted on Monday, April 03, 2006 - 11:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm sure Mary can give us more details, but I know that the SDA Reform Movement also touts the "Fourth Angel's Message".

Colleen
Cathy2
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Username: Cathy2

Post Number: 110
Registered: 2-2006
Posted on Monday, April 03, 2006 - 11:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You know, my mind understands that human nature has always, innately, tended towards towards works, pride and Self--the veil and all that spiritual blindness, I once was in too-- but I still find myself internally screaming "Why, why, why????", irrationally, with the beauty and power of Christ right there in scripture.

This 4th angel business goes so far beyond Adventism, I cannot wrap my mind around it. (I read the site) They even take Ellen out of context to add even more works to humanity.

Why do they bother with Jesus/the cross at all and just go ahead and be Jewish?

Heart-sick for Christ~
Cathy
Colleentinker
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Username: Colleentinker

Post Number: 3682
Registered: 12-2003


Posted on Tuesday, April 04, 2006 - 10:32 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cathy, I know what you mean. I'm coming to believe that people who turn away from the clear beauty of Jesus are deeply afraid of the truth. When one accepts the Biblical truth of Jesus, the gospel, and complete forgiveness, one must also repent. I think people sense (rather than overtly THINK) that if they surrender to Jesus' call to them, they will have to face things and admit guilt for things they want to rationalize.

I'm thinking of some entrenched, historic Adventists that I know who, if they were to surrender to Jesus, would have to give up private indulgences they have rationalized for decades. They would have to admit certain things in their lives and families were outright sin, and they couldn't pretend any longer that there were good "explanations" for those things.

Really knowing Jesus brings His truth into every part of our lives. I am convinced that many people truly do not want the purifying light of truth to reveal the true nature of their own histories.

Yet Jesus has promised (and His promise is certain!) that He will give us 100 fold more than we give up. It's hard to decide to give up our own interpretation of our lives for the reality of Jesus and His persepctive. But when we do, He is completely faithful to His promises!

Colleen
Seekr777
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Username: Seekr777

Post Number: 468
Registered: 1-2003


Posted on Tuesday, April 04, 2006 - 2:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cathy, I didn't see it, but do they quote Ellen White in fact? I even checked area codes to see where they where from since I wondered if they were SDA based.

Richard

rtruitt@mac.com


Raven
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Username: Raven

Post Number: 410
Registered: 7-2004


Posted on Tuesday, April 04, 2006 - 7:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Richard, they do indeed quote Ellen White. Here is a link within the website posted above, along with a statement I'm assuming by the person who has this website--I didn't see the name.

http://lightedway.org/Moon/1888.html


quote:

To conclude this study, I must add that I am a Seventh-day Adventist. I love my church. I love the wonderful truth in it. Our church has long known the messages of the three angels from Revelation. We have understood the decoded meaning. It is tremendous light. But it is not the last light.




It's amazing how they use EGW to support their ideas, even saying the 1888 message was really the 4th angels message, which is supposedly a call to observing all the feast days. They even say that's why EGW was banished to Australia, because the SDA church rejected her 4th angel's message.

I guess if one believes EGW had more light or progressive truth, then this must be the next thing.
Riverfonz
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Username: Riverfonz

Post Number: 1486
Registered: 3-2005
Posted on Tuesday, April 04, 2006 - 8:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

EGW had the light of the moon, but true Christians have the light of the Son.

Stan
Helovesme2
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Username: Helovesme2

Post Number: 464
Registered: 8-2004


Posted on Thursday, April 06, 2006 - 10:02 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes, the SDARM do have a 'Fourth Angel' belief. They believe that just as the SDA church corresponds with the third angel, they correspond with the fourth - the 'Angel of Rev. 18'. But no need to take my word for it. Here are some links to their own works on the topic:

A study by Bro Sas (a recent SDARM GC president):
http://www.sdarm.net/books/poa/chapter40.html

A Sabbath School Lesson on the topic:
http://www.sdarmgc.org/sbl/sbl.php?yr=1999&qtr=4

Statement about 'That Other Angel' as part of the official belief statement on the SDARM GC site (it's about half way down this page I believe):
http://www.sdarmgc.org/beliefs/bible_doctrines1.php?doc=15

It's amazing what happens when the focus gets taken from Jesus and the work HE HAS DONE for us, and turned to ourselves - or even 'our' church! May we keep this in mind in our own walk with God.

Blessings,

Mary




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