| Author | Message | ||
| Jackob Registered user Username: Jackob Post Number: 154 Registered: 7-2005  |
I asked God to search my heart and remove what is still the cultic adventist heritage in me. I was impressed with a residual attitude in myself, a very important issue. Some days ago I have a discussion with a friend about the fact that Bacchiocchi said that in the last 5 years almost 50 000 adventists leaved the church on theological new covenant issue. My friend responded that this is a insignifiant number compared with the huge number of members in USA. I recognize that his words have some power, because they had brought some very scaring feelings in me. They brought to light the fact that, as a former, I will be in a real sense alone, or in minority all my life. With the adventists, it's clear, they will shun me. But the problem starts here because in the evangelical world, I will be seen as the guy who once thought that they were Babylon, that they have the mark of the beast. Even if they will not know that I'm a former, I will have the feeling in myself, that I always be indebted to these people. Indebted with apologies for the former attitude of contempt. For me, this is a burden. Somehow I feel like an adopted child in the middle of the real children of the family. I will have no rights of the real children. I'm in the process of searching the community which will be the real place of God prepared for me. But my impression was affected by this fact: I'm an adopted child wherever I will go. My blood family is SDA. I'm a third generation adventist. Has anyone a key of unlocking this fear? It's like, God is the father and I'll be welcomed in many congregationd of christians, but I feel like in another family because I will have another mother church Now I want to introduce the idea of spiritual mother. In Catholic church is the Saint Mary. Always she is related with Jesus, the believer needs Jesus but more important, needs Mary, to mediate the believer relationship with Jesus, with the Father and Holy Spirit. It's like a god and goddes. And the biggest mother is the mother church, the Roman Catholic Church which is just an extended ego of Mary In adventism Ellen White is the adventist Mary, and the effect is that the normal adventist has not only a relation with God the Father, but with Ellen THE CHURCH. Ellen is not only the Spirit behind the church, she is the church. Even if she is not quoted, the spirit of the church is her spirit. For me, this means that I had almost all my life a relationship with God, at least at a formal level, mediated by the mother church. To feel that I'm a part of GOd's family, I was programmed to believe that God the father is not sufficient, it's necessary to be in the church who really is the mother church. When I go to an evangelical church I'm like in a divorced family. I'll miss the mother church. These churches have not the concept of the mother church. I visited some of them, but had not found the spiritual mother who I needed. The problem is with the need. How the sufficiency of Christ has replace and feel this need for you? It seems that my experience will be negative with other churches until this issue will be resolved. Interesting is the fact that in the past I had no such feeling going in the evangelical churches and attended their services. Now, when I regard them more better than in the past, I have a negative experience. Has anyone a similar experience, or feelings? How you got rid of them? | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 3687 Registered: 12-2003  |
Jackob, During our first year or so at our present church, Richard often commented to me that we were "baby Christians" compared with the people around us. In time, as we grew in our ongoing relationship with God, that feeling gradually disappeared, and we found that we were all "in the same boat", so to speak. All of us were growing at different rates, but we were all equal before our Father. I'll tell you my suggestion for the very real problem you describe. First, intellectually, you can know that your adoption into God's family is the only REAL identity anyone has. Those who relate to some form of "mother church" are not relating to God through Jesus. I know you know this; but the fact bears repeating. Second, and this is where my suggestion comes in, that feeling of missing your spiritual mother or church mother is primarily a spiritual, not an emotional, issue. What you describe is related to the feelings I had when I felt "connected" to Adventism even though I knew I had come to the place of rejecting it. I missed the comfort, the identity, the "belonging". These feelings were literally what disappeared when I prayed for God to remove the spirit of Adventism and to replace it with His Spirit in my heart, filling the places that had previously been filled with the Adventist spirit. I have encountered many people who did not want to deal with this problem as a SPIRITUAL problem; they preferred to try to deal with it on an emotional or rational level. The fact is, though, that we were bound unawares by a spirit which was not God's Spirit, and that spirit created certain senses of loyalty and need and dependence. It's not scary or dangerous to recognize that this deep attachment is spiritual; in fact, unless we do, we continue to be haunted by those lingering, longing memories. It a matter of submission, of repentance before God, surrendering all that we once held dear and choosing to renounce the evil that had a claim on us. Now, to all those who will be offended by what I said, I am NOT talking about demon possession nor any such thing. I am talking about an alliance with deceptionówith evilóthat we embraced, even though we embraced it ignorantly. God is faithful; ask Him to send His Spirit to replace the spirit of Adventism, and ask Him to be more real to you than the fear and grief and the spectre of unfulfilled longing that appears to threaten your future joy. God's desire is to bring you, His adopted son, into the full freedom and joy of His family and of fellwoship with the true body of Christ, united by the Holy Spirit. Unless we face the reality of what held us, we are always in some degree of bondage to itóeither through fear or grief or longing or shame. Only when we admit the reality of our experience and confess it to God, asking Him to mend our hearts and our spirits, will be be finally free from the bondage of the backward glance. Colleen | ||
| Snowboardingmom Registered user Username: Snowboardingmom Post Number: 53 Registered: 11-2005 |
Wow -- this post is so relevant to me right now. Jackob, I know exactly what you're feeling. A couple of days ago, I was feeling a little "lost", feeling as if I'd lost my identity by becoming a full-fledged former Adventist. I was really struggling with this. In fact, I ended up talking about it with one of my close friends I work with about it (she could tell something was bothering me -- which I believe was the Spirit leading her intuitively). Here is the amazing part: she said (almost word for word) what Colleen just posted above. She told me that this wasn't just an emotional issue that I was having a hard time letting go, but a spiritual attachment issue. It really took me back when she said that; I didn't really want to believe it at first. But the more I thought about it, I knew she was right. I had to pray that God would completely remove any spiritual attachment to SDAism, and replace it with His Spirit. I also prayed, that as a "baby Christian" (because that's what I feel like), to please protect me during these early stages of growth, and let me have complete peace that I am completely His, and in need of nothing else. It wasn't until then, did I truly feel like I was free. **(And that's why Colleen, when you said "Welcome to being "just" a Christ-follower, a daughter of God and part of His family..." I was so emotionally touched). Once again, I am just amazed by how God speaks to us through others who are living by the Spirit. I am continually humbled by how much He really cares about us and looks out for us in this way. God is so good! You're in my prayers Jackob. Grace | ||
| Riverfonz Registered user Username: Riverfonz Post Number: 1488 Registered: 3-2005 |
Hi Jackob, Thanks for sharing these fears and feelings with us. Colleen and Grace have given great advice. Just remember that you were chosen by God long before the foundation of the world. He has now ADOPTED you into His family in Christ, so your identity is now in Christ alone. God is your Father, and since you have been given a resurrected soul, you can claim the promise of adoption "Abba Father...Galatians 4:6,7 "So you are no longer a slave, but a son; and since you are a son, God has made you an heir." You have strong support on this board, Jacob, and I will join with others in praying for your situation. Stan | ||
| Bobj Registered user Username: Bobj Post Number: 7 Registered: 1-2006 |
Hi Grace, Jakob, Stan, and Colleen, Thank you for these fine posts, and for your honesty about your experiences. I must tell you that the Lord has given me his peace in a way I never would have imagined, but he waited until I took the step of formally leaving adventism to really let his peace flood my life. I had no idea such peace could even exist! What an experience! I praise God for it, and also for the heartfelt and positive discussions on this forum. It's so good to know that we have the support and prayers of others with similar stories. Bob | ||
| Jackob Registered user Username: Jackob Post Number: 155 Registered: 7-2005 |
Friends, I already prayed for Jesus to replace the empty space left by adventist "mother" church. Somehow the answer was clear even before you answered, when I said that Jesus is sufficient. What I appreciate is the fact that Colleen emphasized that this is a exclusive spiritual issue and not emotional or rational. I tink that believing that it's not only a spiritual, but a rational or emotional issue was a barrier in claiming my liberty in Jesus. I just prayed and thanks for your prayers, I already leave the burden on the shoulders of Jesus and resting in His peace. I've repented for treating the evangelicals like second-class christians because they have not a mother church, the ark of salvation, this was another issue mingled with it. I'm indebted also to Gary Inrig for the insights given in his sermon at FAF meeting. Comparing the few christians which worship in little home-churches with the greater temple of Jerusalim, and synagogues, they appear like loosing something meaningful, I believe they looked at the temple and their religion like we fomers looked at mother church. I say this based on the idea that they believe that they are God's only choosen people, that the salvation is limited to their ranks and to the proselytes. I learned from Gary to look at Jesus Who is Greater than the temple, and greater than the SDA church which pales in comparision, The real important thing is to be with christians who have Jesus, "There is no greater thing". And about the remarks of my friend, even if the formers are few, they have more than the entire SDA church. Thanks again for the new perspective, it's very beautiful and liberating. I began to see how Paul can say that his personal achievements in the religion of judaism is junk compared to knowing Jesus. It's a little beginning, but I'll expect more and more | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 3690 Registered: 12-2003 |
Jackob, praise God for how He is healing your heart and deepening your roots in Him! I am always challenged and inspired by your reflections and questions and observations. God is so faithful! Colleen | ||
| Dennis Registered user Username: Dennis Post Number: 646 Registered: 4-2000  |
Jackob, What a great post! As formers, God has already blessed us beyond measure as we fervently prayed and intensely studied our way out of the darkness of Adventism. Indeed, He will "...make up to you for the years that the swarming locust has eaten..." (Joel 2:25 NASB). He redeems our past and nothing is lost. Praise God! Dennis Fischer | ||
| Jackob Registered user Username: Jackob Post Number: 161 Registered: 7-2005 |
Thanks Colleen, I'm happy that I'm useful on this forum. I have a lot to learn, I'm sure, also God was mercifull with me and his grace I want to share. Dennis, my post reflected my weakness, sometimes I'm tired about seeing what is wrong in my life, and also my unwillingness to change, or my desire to conserve the status-quo. At these moments, I cannot value enough the strong support I have here. Also I'm motivated to be a blessing for you, all who are helping me here. |
