| Author |
Message |
Colleentinker
Registered user
Username: Colleentinker
Post Number: 3788
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 19, 2006 - 9:27 pm: |     |
Andy, I will also be praying for you. You certainly did have a seriously hard childhood. Just remember that the love of Jesus and the reality of God transcend anything a human can describe to you.
For sure, Scripture is destructive when misused for evil purposesójust as all of God's gifts are. But with the Holy Spirit as your teacher, it will gradually become a new book. God knows what you need and when you need it. You can trust His timing and his faithfulness.
Praise Him for opening your eyes to the deception of Adventism! He has already begun your healing.
Colleen |
Artman29
Registered user
Username: Artman29
Post Number: 15
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, April 20, 2006 - 4:48 am: | |
Colleen,
Thankyou so much for the words of wisdom.
Thanks too for the prayers.
I have a long way to go but i have gone along way already and I love the Lord but not all of the legalism that I have been taught over the years.
I look forward to the days when scripture will be a comfort and not a burden to my already damaged psyche. I find much comfort being in this forum. For the first time in my life since leaving that cult I feel like people here understand my plite, but not in a bad way or a false way. Life is not black and white like it was in Adventism it is beautiful and can be enjoyed. In my life I am finally starting to be able to enjoy life without fear of the Sunday Law or Dume. The weight of being a "special person" in the eyes of other adventists is finally lifting and I can finally focus on rebuilding my life with my wonderful wife who has been so faithfull through all of this and stood by my side without fully understanding for the last 4 years of us knowing each other. I used to get false strength from reading EGW. I used to feel it was my mission to minister to the Sunday Keepers and was taught that even though they seemed like good christians that they where being decieved and it was my job to tell them the "truth" no matter what the cost.
Isolation has been a big factor for me, not only with regard to adventism but security as a kid did not exist. The winters get quite cold uppwards of -40 to -60 below in Alaska sometimes. Survival was my life, it was what I was taught. If we didn't get wood for the fire we would litteraly freeze to death. I remember many times waking up and it would be 2o below in our cabin because the fire had gone out. My mother had her own issues as I said before, so in order to get some semblance, in her other wise unstabel life, when she met my step-dad(who was an adventist) she glued her self to everything egw had to say. Not only was egw very Black and white in her approach to manipulating us, our physical lifestyle was very black and white as well. Heck, we lived out in the middle of no where. My mom used to ask believe and claim everything relating to our lifestyle, clothes to wear, cars to drive, wood for the fire, everything. There was no sence of personal identity, if it was God's will then it happened,if it wasn't than it didn't. There was no sence of self worth or joy. Sorry if this sounds so depressing but it was a very conservative household I grew up in with much arguing and yelling. According to my step-Dad everyone else in the community where morons because they didn't get this simple truth of Adventistm, and for them to think for themselves was just plain ignorance according to him. Every saturday we had some adventist friends that we would or they would drive 75 miles to see. Over the years a sence of helplessness of being in the cult begain to be evident in my life. God's will became the precurser to decision making. If employers didn't let me have friday and Saturday off then it must not be God's will that I work there. How messed up is that? Material possesions where not even considered to me. The mentality that it was all gowing to burn became what I learned. Oh sure, on the outside I was perfect, nobody knew the turmoil I was going through because good adventists have to show example by there actions. So, Anger and confusion became burried. I hurt so deeply that I didn't know what to do. I lived a totally fake existance for many years. I couldn't handle the pressure. |
Dennis
Registered user
Username: Dennis
Post Number: 671
Registered: 4-2000
| | Posted on Thursday, April 20, 2006 - 5:14 am: | |
Andy,
With tears in my eyes, I must admit anew that life is not always fair in this world. However, I sincerely believe that God redeems our past and he will make up to us to all the heartaches we have endured in the name of religion. We serve a prayer-answering God.
What a warped, unloving picture of God you were taught through the pen and influence of Ellen White! As you said, it was like she was your very own mother. False religious systems truly hurt people badly. They even deprive us of a normal childhood. Indeed, those to are intent upon accurate answers will no longer remain in a toxic-faith system. Praise God, there is wonderful, abundant life beyond Adventism.
Dennis Fischer |
Dd
Registered user
Username: Dd
Post Number: 669
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, April 20, 2006 - 9:31 am: | |
Andy,
The exciting part of your story is that God did not leave you in that darkness! It is His Spirit that has beckoned you to look outside the Adventist walls. He has plans for you, plans to prosper and plans to give you hope and a future (Jeremiah 29:11). I am looking forward to hearing how He is leading you...please keep us informed because He WILL bring you out through His love and mercy into a new day of freedom and peace!
He brought you to FAF! He brought all of us together..even those who lurk...His presence is here in cyberspace. I don't understand always but I cling to the promise of His Steadfast love in Isa. 55:8,9 - His ways are not our ways and our thoughts are not His thoughts...
Just keep on keepin' on, Andy. We all have trauma to sift through and He promises to send His Spirit to guide us through all the muck and into His Holy Light! (Read John chapters 14 - 16)
Denise |
Colleentinker
Registered user
Username: Colleentinker
Post Number: 3792
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, April 20, 2006 - 3:42 pm: | |
Andy, As Dennis said, God redeems our pasts when we bring them to Him. I believe that deep pain and brokenness such as yours becomes healed and built into amazing strength and insight through the power of the Lord Jesus. As Joseph said to his brothers, you meant it for harm, but God meant it for good and for the saving of many lives.
God is creating something powerful and beautiful out of the shattered childhood and youth you endured. In His hands, your past is becoming the foundation of a life that Jesus will gift in ways you could not be gifted if the original abuse had not happened. Truly, when we are in Him and are yielding to Him, our lives becomes works of mercy and grace that reflect the miracle of His love.
Your story partially illustrates an observation I have made over the years. When people take Adventism seriously, it either leads them into mental illness or causes them to despair of reaching its standards, jettisoning them into agnosticism. Your mother's meticulous embracing of Ellen's "counsels" illustrates the "mental illness" end of the continuum.
Every one of us here would have ultimately ended up moving toward one extreme or the other if God had not awakened us to the reality of the finished work of Jesus and brought us into the new reality of being alive in Him.
All I can do is praise Him for His faithfulness in rescuing us from false religion and hopeless darkness.
Colleen |
Artman29
Registered user
Username: Artman29
Post Number: 16
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, April 20, 2006 - 10:17 pm: | |
Colleen,
My mother has been on medication most of my life. She was diagnosed by an Adventist Dr. of having some rare stress dissorder that makes her not be able to endure any type of high stress environements, you know, like life and bills and normal everyday stuff. Now, she is convinced that she has this ailment and I believe that it isn't so. I believe that she hasn't dealt with her past and her mental illness is a direct result of using the adventist church for a psychological crutch. I personally think that her "stress" illness is trauma that she endured before she became an adventist. It's always been about her. When I was a kid she was in bed most of the time and when she wasn't she was lashing out at me or my step-Dad and would fly into a rage at the drop of a hat over what seemed like nothing. The body that God gave us is designed to deal with stress in a very natural way, a natural cycle if you will. When other things like, cults get in the mix it throws off the system and can ultimately impare the healing process. I believe this is what happened to my mother.
I hope you are right about God creating something beautiful and powerful out of my shattered chilhood.
Trauma is a thing that can, over time change a belief system that otherwise would have endured. Continued life and death stress is like being a novice boxer going up against an expert in the field. Sure, a couple of punches can be endured, but over time and continuous spiritual and psychological punches it will eventually knock you down and over time you won't get up for fear of being nocked down again. This is what I have been through and through God's grace am coming out of.
I'm really confused about prayer too. I have alot of financial problems directly related to the cult and my upbringing. I don't know if I should pray about that or what. I know that God is not a magic Genie to answer my every wish. When we are Christs, does he protect us from these problems? I used to pay tithe and sometimes go without food in the Adventist church, was that God's will? I went to adventist college, signed loans and for the last ten years have been haunted by all of the financial pressures and collectors. Does God want to help me in these areas as well? Does prayer like I was taught solve everything? What about all the poor people in the world? There have been times, that I can't even move or get up, or go to work when I had a job. I have a very strong work ethic and all my life I have worked hard but this past year I haven't been able to for fear of the past and the phone calls that i've had to make to employers many times to explain to them that I can't come to work and try to explain to them that no I am not sick but that I just don't have enought energy to come to work that day. They don't understand. I was a professional caricature artist in Las Vegas for 5 years I worked for a multi million dollar company I made very good money but everyday I went to work it killed me inside. I had to work but being around thousands of people demanding something from me and them expecting me to draw there perfect likeness and all of the critism was one of the hardest things I endured.
Everyone except for my wife who I have ever loved has left me. My biological father who was not an adventist, tried to kill himself the two years that I lived with him. Ten years later, he is doing better now but has never once thanked me for saving him. You ask, why did you stay with him so long? I say, because of the Adventist church I loved my father and realy didn't know him but knew enough to know that he wasn't like my step dad and that I needed to stay with him and try to get him to be an Adventist so he could be in heaven with me. I was basicly an orphan after that because instead of waiting for him to try and kill himself again I finally left and graduated from UCA and met an adventist family who had two kids and they took me in. For a while I felt like things where getting better until they got tired of me and I bounced over to another family I didn't know, but because they had the Adventist name I didn't question trusting them. After a year of that they got tired of me and so on and so on. MY mother, over those years was still in Alaska and was confident that I was just fine. NOT TRUE. Was all of this God's will? Is this part of God's plan for my life? When other kids where out playing or whatever I was studying to show myself approved. I was constantly rittled with guilt and oppression and memorized scripture after scripture to endure but it didn't help. I was always a good kid and never did anything to deserve any of this. Now 8 years later, I have trust issues. I followed ellen white to the letter of her law and it ended me in utter termoil. I want so desperately, to be able to trust again.
"Trust in the Lord with all your heart and He will direct your paths"
Thanks for listening.
In Christ,
Andy
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Colleentinker
Registered user
Username: Colleentinker
Post Number: 3799
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Friday, April 21, 2006 - 1:28 pm: | |
Dear Andy,
Without the intervention of the Holy Spirit in our lives, we would all be incurable. Our brokenness would ultimately destroy usósome sooner than others.
Sinóeither ours or othere's perpetrated against usóis not God's will. Still, God is sovereign, and He knows and sees things we cannot know. The thing I am beginning to learn is that God walks with us and sustains us even in the horrific events of our lives.
In the book of JobóThe very first book of the Bible that was writtenóGod allowed Satan to bring great suffering on Job for reasons Job NEVER knew much less understood. Job, a righteous man, believed his suffering was undeservedóand indeed, from a human standpoint, it was. What God ended up revealing to Job at the end of the book was the fact that He knows things no human can know, and as His creations, our proper response is to trust HIMóand to surrender our "right to understand" all the hows and whys.
At the end of the book, Job the righteous puts his hand over his mouth and repents in sackcloth and ashes. Even righteous Job had to repent of his deep belief that he had a right to understand his suffering and that somehow he shouldn't suffer if he didn't deserve it.
God's first inspired book of Scripture taught us that God is sovereign; we can't understand Him or figure Him out, He has reasons known only to Him why suffering is allowed, he redeems our suffering, and we can trust Him.
You won't be able to trust people, Andy, unless you first learn to know Jesus and find how dependable He is. You won't have a foundation for trusting people. The problem most of us have is Job's problem: we see the world from a human-centered perspective instead of from a God-centered perspective. We believe that if we are obedient to our authority figures, sutdy hard, do what we're told, obey what we think the Bible says, suffer for the sake of our understanding of Godóthen we should turn out OK and be rewarded for our stellar performance.
Instead, from God's persepctive, our good or bad deeds do not determine whether or not we suffer. Of course, people suffer from making self-destructive choices, as you described your mother doing. But innocent suffering of children has nothing to do with the child's behavior or obedience.
The core of what you are facing right now, Andy, is that you were taught lies about God. All your life you have reacted to a false god whom you were taught to believe was the True God.
The True God is the One who brought you to the place of looking for answers and has brought you to our forum and to a desire to get well. He is in the process of revealing Himself to you, and He is faithful to complete what He has begun in you (Phil 1:6).
Instead of trying to "figure out" what to pray for our whether it's OK to pray for certain things, look at what the Bible says about your needs:
Read Matthew 6:25-34. Part of this passage says, "So do not worry, saying, 'What shall we eat?' or "What shall we drink?' or 'What shall we wear?' For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. But seek first his kingdom and his righteosuness, and all these things will be given to you as well."
Miraculously, when our desire is to know Jesus and to "run after Him", he gives us Himself in deep ways, and He provides our material needs as well. He never promises that He will rescue us from bad debts or cancel our bills, but He provides ways that we can get these things back under control. Then He teaches us how to live responsibly and accountably. Knowing Him truly does teach us how to live with integrity.
Other things the Bible says to pray for:
Ephesians 1:17-20: says in part, "I keep asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father, may give you the spirit of wisdom and revelation so that you may know him better."
Ephesians 3:16-19: "I pray that out of his glorious riches he may strengthen you with power through his Spirit in your inner being, that Christ may dwell in your heart through faith. And I pray that you, together with all the saints, will have the power to grasp how wide and long and high and deep is the love of Christ, and to know this love that surpasses knowledgeóthat you may be filled to the measure with all the fullness of God."
Ephesians 5:19-20: "Speak to one another with psalms, hymns and spiritual songs. Sing and make music in your heart to the Lord, always giving thanks to God the Father for everything, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ."
Ephesians 6:10-18 reads in part: "Put on the full armor of God so that you can take your stand against the devil's schemesÖStand firm, then, with the belt of truth buckled around your waist, with the breastplate of righteousness in place, with your feet fitted with the readiness that comes from the gospel of peace, In addition to all this, take up the shieled of faith, with which you can extinguish all the flaming darts of the evil one. Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God. And pray in the Spirit on all occasions, with all kinds of prayers and requests. With this in mind, be alert, and always keep on praying for all the saints."
Philippians 1:9-11: "And this is my prayer: that your love may abound more and more in knowledge and depth of insight, so that you may be able to discern what is best and may be pure and blameless until the day of Christ, filled with the fruit of righteousness that coms through Jesus Christóto the glory and praise of God."
Colossians 1:9-14 inpart: "We have not stopped praying for you and asking God to fill you with the knowledge of his will through all spiritual wisdom and understanding. We pray this in order that you may live a life worthy of the Lord and may please him in every way: bearing fruit in every good work, growing in the knowledge of God, being strengthened with all power according to his glorious might so that you may have great endurance and patience, and joyfully giving thanks to the Father, who has qualified you to share in the inheritance of the saints in the kingdom of light. For he has rescued us from the dominion of dakrness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he loves, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins."
And so on!
Andy, the secret to healing is being willing to know what is true and being willing to surrender to God the identity and the coping skills you have learned from your painful past. He is enoughóHis Spirit is your literal new life, and He is your victory and your great reward. He alone gives peace.
Tell Him how much you fear trusting and ask Him to teach you what you need to know, to be willing to change what He wants to change in you; and to keep you rooted in truth and reality.
Praying for you...
Colleen |
Artman29
Registered user
Username: Artman29
Post Number: 23
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Friday, April 21, 2006 - 3:56 pm: | |
Colleen, thanks for taking the time to write me. I realy appreciate it. May God continue to bless you in the obvious gift that he has given you!
I think I am finally getting to know the real Jesus!
It will take time but I can see that God is working.
I love you Lord!
Andy |
Patriar
Registered user
Username: Patriar
Post Number: 266
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, April 22, 2006 - 10:23 am: | |
Andy:
May I say a belated welcome!!!
Praise God that you are here! I am praying for you. There is nothing more exciting or fulfilling than understanding the Love of God. May you be enveloped with His Peace and Presence today...this moment.
Philippians 4:7
"And the peace of God, which transcends all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus."
In Him,
Patria |
Artman29
Registered user
Username: Artman29
Post Number: 24
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Saturday, April 22, 2006 - 9:22 pm: | |
Patria,
Thanks for the encouraging words and the welcome.
Andy |
Cw
Registered user
Username: Cw
Post Number: 12
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 25, 2006 - 12:03 pm: | |
Andy, now I get to say "welcome" to someone. Until you I was probably the newest member here-only about a week now. But this is a great place for support. Our circumstances are different in that I'm not a former Adventist but I'm fearful that my daughter may join the church through her boyfriend. I spent 12 years in what I considered a legalistic denomination. I was even on the Pastor's Council. The MOMENT I decided to leave that church I felt like a weight was lifted from my shoulders. Long story short-in the end it cost my marriage. But in what I have lately learned of SDA I see that what I thought was strict legalism was nothing compared to SDA. In a posting I wrote yesterday I referred to Phil 4:7 just as Patriar did above. It's true, I don't understand how peace can come through some of our turmoil. God seldom seems to give us all the answers but He does give the peace of knowing that He is in control. Keep memorizing the word. I have noticed that since I made it a hobby 1 1/2 years ago that just having it ingrained in my heart and mind is a strength I never before possessed. And it's not MY strength. I picture my self as that tree planted by streams of water as described in Ps 1. The water is God's strength and as long as I stay tapped into it I will yield fruit. And there is no place where I can point to and say "this is where a change happened". It's an on-going and cumulative process. I thank God for somewhat of a legalistic back ground so that I know how to pray for my daughter and for you. God bless. CW |
Colleentinker
Registered user
Username: Colleentinker
Post Number: 3822
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 25, 2006 - 3:32 pm: | |
Andy, I endorse Cw's suggestion that you begin memorizing Scripture. After hearing a Christian counselor recommend to a young woman dealing with severe Post Traumatic Stress Disorder and an eating disorder that she memorize Scripture as a way of replacing her own unhealthy "reality" with Truth ("Truth", the counselor said, "is in the Bible, not in your own head"), I also began memorizing larger Bible passages.
I've been pursuing this exercise for about 10 months now, and it is amazing to me how much my understanding of God and of myself and the church and sin and Jesus' role in human life has sharpened and integrated and informed me.
You don't have to memorize much at a timeóbut the discipline of it really implants those words of truth deeply in your head and heart. God works in us through His word to us when we open ourselves to knowing and desiring truth.
Cw is right about its bringing a completely new strength to you.
Colleen |
Colleentinker
Registered user
Username: Colleentinker
Post Number: 3823
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 25, 2006 - 3:34 pm: | |
Cw, thank you also for sharing more of your own story with us. Many of us here can deeply relate to what you have experienced. We're glad you're here!
Colleen |
Artman29
Registered user
Username: Artman29
Post Number: 27
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 25, 2006 - 4:04 pm: | |
CW, thanks for the encouraging words. I will start to memorize small scriptures again. I did this for years while in the SDA church but they had different meanings then they do now.
colleen, God does work in us through His word.
Thanks so much,
Andy |
Cw
Registered user
Username: Cw
Post Number: 15
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 25, 2006 - 5:33 pm: | |
Andy, just a tip you might try. It works for me. If it doesn't for you God will show you another way. When memorizing, I count the number of words in a small section at a time, maybe as small as 6 or 8. Then as I go over and over it in my mind I count that number on my fingers. Some of us, like me, are more mathimatically inclined and the numbering works great. That way you know you've got the right number of words and after a while you simply drop the numbering for that section but the words stay. Hey, WHATEVER works. I always wondered how an actor can remember several minutes worth of lines. Our capacity for memorization, even at my age of 61, astounds me. As long as what we're doing is pleasing to God he will blow us away with what we're capable of. A great one to start with is Psalm 1-all of it. I prefer NIV but whichever translation you enjoy makes it easier. The more you do the more you will want to and the more confident you will become in it. CW |
Belvalew
Registered user
Username: Belvalew
Post Number: 1021
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 26, 2006 - 12:25 am: | |
Another suggestion would be to read one chapter of the Proverbs a day. There are 31 chapters in Proverbs, so read the one corresponding to the date. Each verse is a little gem to be stored away, and you never know how that little proverb can give you strength in moments of need. The Proverbs never get old, and each trip through you will find it is almost like reading it for the first time, mainly because you are in a different place with your life than you were last month, or last year, and the jewel you need for this month, this day, will be the one that feeds you now. |
Colleentinker
Registered user
Username: Colleentinker
Post Number: 3830
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 26, 2006 - 10:06 am: | |
Belva, I always appreciate your insight. What a great ideaóto use Proverbs as a monthy devotional. And Cw, I would never have come up with that mathematical method of memorizationówhat a clever idea! (I tend to use methods like creating acronyms and noticing prepositionsóha! Can you tell I've been an English teacher?)
Colleen |
Cw
Registered user
Username: Cw
Post Number: 18
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 26, 2006 - 11:06 am: | |
Colleen, I've used the "numbering" method with great success. However, when I told my wife about it she just sort of dismissed it. I believe males in general are more mathematically (can you add a spell check to this site?)inclined so it may work better for us. No offense. My wife can do several things at the same time--multi-tasking--I'm limited to one thing at a time and some times even less than that. And I certainly never impressed an English teacher before so you just made my day. CW |
Artman29
Registered user
Username: Artman29
Post Number: 30
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 26, 2006 - 12:51 pm: | |
Cw,
I will try the number idea! If it works it will make memorizing much easier. I agree with what you said about multi tasking. I have a real hard time with that, but my wife can do three or four things at one time with one hand behind her back! Amazing!
Thanks again,
Andy |
Colleentinker
Registered user
Username: Colleentinker
Post Number: 3833
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 26, 2006 - 2:58 pm: | |
Cw, (I'm laughing now!), I almost wrote above that I believed the numbering method was a sort-of Y-chromosome-linked phenomenon, but I decided that I should defer to a less potentially controversial statement!
I do think you're right, though!
Colleen
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Cw
Registered user
Username: Cw
Post Number: 20
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 26, 2006 - 3:18 pm: | |
Thanks Colleen, I don't understand them there kinda big words anyhow. And don't worry, I've had English teachers laugh at me before-but usually not good naturedly. |
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