| Author | Message | ||
| Mwh Registered user Username: Mwh Post Number: 22 Registered: 4-2006  |
Greetings to all I've read somewhere that there is something fishy about the SDA when it comes to money and I would like to know if its just rumores or if there is some fact to it. 1. SDA pastors earns more than pastors do in general. How much more? Are they into it for the money? 2. That tithing is obligational for salvation. The top SDA's do they grin all the way to the bank? What do you know about SDA and money? Jesus Christ lives! | ||
| Violet Registered user Username: Violet Post Number: 374 Registered: 2-2001 |
I do know that they will not let a non-Adventist CPA audit their books at the GC level because "they could not understand the sacredness of the tithe. This was a personal e-mail to me several years ago when I inquired about and independent audit. We were also not allowed to hold a church office if we did no tithe to the conference (didn't matter how much you gave locally it could of been a million dollars a year) if you didn't sent it upstream you could not be a deacon. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 3971 Registered: 12-2003  |
I don't personally know how an Adventist pastor's salary compares with a non-SDAs, but I know there is great distress even within the church over how tithe is used and required. It does not serve the local church at all except that it becomes part of the fund that pays all SDA pastors. While the church says tithe is for pastoral payroll, in reality it gets used for a lot of other things as well, but the local members are generally not informed of these uses. The church requires tithe to be sent to the organization. The local church needs are funded by the "combined budget" line-item which members are supposed to pay in addition to the 10%. Today many Adventists (at least in N America) either do not pay tithe, or they pay a tithe into combined budget and ignore the official tithe line item. At the top, the church is big business. There are many business dealsóoften "unofficial" but tacitly approvedóthat bring profit to those involved and often a share goes to the church. The local members are not told of these things, and if they are offered the chance to sign up for a service at a low cost by the churchósuch as intenet or phone servicesóthey never realize these things are part of behind-the-scenes deals, at least sometimes, that bring profit to the deal-makers. The former General Confernece president made such deals with a Catholic representative of one of the pope's charitable organizations. They would sometimes do land deals together, splitting profits between themselves and their respective "charities"óthe Catholics and the Adventistsóand sometimes they would collaborate on plans to sell services to their members, splitting the profits between the Adventists and the Catholics. The closer you look, the messier it gets. Colleen | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 1277 Registered: 10-2004  |
For more information on SDA financial corruption, see this link and other articles at Truth or Fables. The SDA church was started by James and Ellen White partly as a money-making scam, and that continues to this day. Jeremy | ||
| Freeofe Registered user Username: Freeofe Post Number: 1 Registered: 10-2005 |
I have a relative who's been an Adventist pastor for several years and expects to be ordained soon. He told me he expects to make $50,000 a year at that point. As for tithe, Adventists take it so seriously they withdraw it from a pastor's wages before he even sees his paycheck. | ||
| Helovesme2 Registered user Username: Helovesme2 Post Number: 510 Registered: 8-2004  |
Welcome Freeofe! Yes. I've been told that they do that to most (all?) church workers' saleries. Glad to see you on the forum. Hope to hear more from you soon! Blessings, Mary | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 3972 Registered: 12-2003 |
Welcome, Freeofe! We're glad you've joined us. We're looking forward to getting to know you. Colleen | ||
| Pegg Registered user Username: Pegg Post Number: 9 Registered: 2-2006 |
My husband's dad is a retired minister. He catagorically denies that his parents ever had tithe deducted from their paycheck. They always faithfully paid the tithe themselves. Also, when my husband was teaching SDA school, we were never asked to have tithe deducted from his paycheck, either. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 3976 Registered: 12-2003 |
When Richard was a student at Rio Lindo Academy he worked in the school's industry, Harris Pine Mills. He had to sign a waver allowing Harris Pine to deduct his tithe from his gross income. When I taught in the Idaho Conference, we had to agree to pay tithe. I can't remember right now if we had to sign a statement promising to pay, or exactly how it was handledóbut we had to agree to pay, and they could check up on us. Richard said that in the Pacific Union when he worked there in the late 70s-early 80s, administration would contact prospective employees' churches to ascertain whether or not they paid tithe before they hired the person. Richard's mom was credit manager for the Pacific Union Home Health Education Service, and before any new colpourter was hired, part of the person's background check was determining whether or not he paid tithe. Colleen | ||
| Jerry Registered user Username: Jerry Post Number: 489 Registered: 6-2002 |
As someone who used to see a local congregation's finances up close and in detail, I can tell you that all elders were monitored for tithe. This would affect their eligibility for office. I don't know if anyone has mentioned this in this thread, but the tithe (plus a few other line items) went ultimately to the General Conference. Some of it filtered back to the local churches as pastor's salary, sometimes land and building purchases, and often (get this) LOANS TO THE LOCAL CHURCH through the lower conferences. As for whether it was a salvational requirement: Um, let's see, "Oh NO, not AT ALL, NO WAY, Totally unrelated to salvation . . . well . . . 'course if you didn't, you would be disobeying God and would never go to heaven . . . Yeah, but NOTHING to do with salvation." | ||
| Freeindeed Registered user Username: Freeindeed Post Number: 26 Registered: 3-2006 |
They do not automatically deduct tithe from my paycheck. However, they do monitor if employees are paying tithe or not. If you aren't paying enough (or at all) you will be confronted and if you don't do it the way they (conference) say your job is at risk. As far as pastors making a LOT of money, I don't think so. You won't get rich being an SDA pastor. All of the tithe dollars ultimately go up and a portion comes back for pastors salaries and subsidy for grade schools. Local congregations must meet the expenses of thier church in addition to tithe and if they have a church school they must support it as well in addition to tithe. A stranglehold is effectively put on the local church where money becomes so tight that the focus becomes meeting a budget. Of course to restructure and do it a different way would mean that many at the top would no longer have a job, but the local church would have more resources for reaching lost souls through ministry. Imagine that. We don't have to wonder where the priorities are. It won't happen, and even if it did we would only be taking the message of the Adventist/EGW gospel into local communities, not the true gospel found in scripture. Maybe it's better to leave it like it is. Freeindeed | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 1278 Registered: 10-2004 |
Yeah, that's exactly what I was thinking--that we should be glad that they are not "reaching" people through ministry. But if they did, wouldn't more money come in through the new members? Of course, this is probably why EGW said not to "waste time" reaching poor people. Jeremy | ||
| Seekr777 Registered user Username: Seekr777 Post Number: 515 Registered: 1-2003  |
Jeremy can you give me a quote where she says this. "EGW said not to "waste time" reaching poor people." If she said this it is very sad. Richard rtruitt@mac.com | ||
| Cw Registered user Username: Cw Post Number: 65 Registered: 4-2006  |
Welcome Freeofe. Is that Free of Ellen? CW | ||
| Jeremy Registered user Username: Jeremy Post Number: 1279 Registered: 10-2004 |
Richard, Here are several quotes:
And you can read more quotes here. That last one I quoted is probably the best example of what I was talking about. Jeremy | ||
| Seekr777 Registered user Username: Seekr777 Post Number: 516 Registered: 1-2003 |
thanks for sending me the quotes Richard rtruitt@mac.com | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 2538 Registered: 3-2004  |
Freeofe, Welcome to FAF. When you are comfortable, tell us more or your journey. Diana | ||
| 91steps Registered user Username: 91steps Post Number: 43 Registered: 8-2005 |
I stopped paying tithe 2+ years before I quit working at the GC and never heard a peep!!! The primary reason I stopped was I could not tithe with a clear conscience knowing how my money was being wasted. I now work for the Govt and the waste there is NOTHING compared to what went on at the GC. | ||
| Susan_2 Registered user Username: Susan_2 Post Number: 2202 Registered: 11-2002 |
Colleen, What about non SDA's who work for SDA owned companies? I would assume the tithe thing doesn't apply to them. I finily just stopped attending the local SDA church altogether several years ago because it finily dawned on me that every sermon for several months had been an Adventist informericial. One week the 'sermon' would be about Adventist World Radio and then a special offering would be taken for Adventist World Radio. The next week it would be about FFT or the VOP and then a special offering would be taken for those organizations. One week it was for the $10.00 Church, Maranatha and the offering was for them and one week it was for SAWS or has SAWS been renamed ADRA? Anyway, it was money, money, money week after week. I NEVER heard a sermon or even a sermonette about The Gosple, the Saving Power of Jesus, the death, resurrection and assention of Jesus or the power of the Holy Spirit. Finily I just decided if I wanted to listen to informercials I could turn them on my t.v. which I don't so why bother getting all dressed up to sit through one. Also, I attended a local SDA church several years ago in one of the most improvished regions of the US. Most the adults in this congreation were illeterate but since they are convinced of the Adventist truth and can't read the Bible for themselves they fall for whatever the pastor tells them and the pastor was a Joe Crews devottee. These people are very poor, most having no electrisity, gas, plumbing or phone in their homes and they contributed to a special offering to provide scholarships for ministerial students attending Andrews. I just thought the whole thing was very sad. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 4020 Registered: 12-2003 |
You're right, Susan--the Adventist organizations have no say about whether or not a non-SDA employee pays tithe. Colleen | ||
| Freeofe Registered user Username: Freeofe Post Number: 3 Registered: 10-2005 |
CW~Yes, Freeofe means free of Ellen! It was exactly how I was feeling when I decided to join the forum.:-) | ||
| Cw Registered user Username: Cw Post Number: 74 Registered: 4-2006 |
Freeofe, cool-I was right. I like to try and figure out personalized license plates also. As a "never wasa Adventist" I can't identify with being free of Ellen. But I am free of other things that should never have been in my life in the first place so I get the drift. Although I was not SDA I was involved in a very legalistic church for 12 years and the MOMENT I made the decision to leave it (even though in the end it cost me a marriage)I felt like a ton of weight was lifted off my shoulders. Congratulations on your freedom. Where have you been? I asked what Freeofe meant two weeks ago. CW | ||
| Cw Registered user Username: Cw Post Number: 75 Registered: 4-2006 |
Freeofe, cool-I was right. I like to try and figure out personalized license plates also. As a "never wasa Adventist" I can't identify with being free of Ellen. But I am free of other things that should never have been in my life in the first place so I get the drift. Although I was not SDA I was involved in a very legalistic church for 12 years and the MOMENT I made the decision to leave it (even though in the end it cost me a marriage)I felt like a ton of weight was lifted off my shoulders. Congratulations on your freedom. Where have you been? I asked what Freeofe meant two weeks ago. CW | ||
| Cw Registered user Username: Cw Post Number: 76 Registered: 4-2006 |
Sorry, I posted that twice. I guess my finger slipped. CW |
