| Author | Message | ||
| Jackob Registered user Username: Jackob Post Number: 249 Registered: 7-2005  |
Today I was in a conversation with my adventist friend. He is upset about God's dealings with Him, and something he said captured my attention. He said that God has the power and the resources to feed the children who are dying of starvation in the poor countries of the thirld world, but He leaves many of them to dye. My friend quoted James 4:17 "Anyone, then, who knows the good he ought to do and doesn't do it, sins" as proof that God is sinning, because He is not doing the good he ought to do. this is a horrible conclusion, unacceptable, but is the normal result of the adventist view about the definition of sin. In the adventist view, the Decalogue defines what is sin, and all the other definitions of sin in the Bible are only explanations of the decalogue, explaining the real meaning of the Ten Commandments. After this pattern James 4:17 is also an explanation of the law, and everyone who does not the good he ought to do shares the same fate as those who break one or more of the Ten Commandments. Remember, the Decalogue was a stern rule which condemned everybody who disobeyed it's letter it without mercy. No exceptions. Seeing also James 4:17 as a law like Decalogue, my friend is seeing God taking exceptions from this law, and sinning. This situation could be a good illustration of the limits of the Decalogue, and the law of Moses. Seeing God through the lens of the Decalogue, through the veil of the Old Covenant, He appears as a sinner. The problem is with the lens. Of course, James 4:17 talks about a sin against the law of love, the new commandment of Christ. But this law of love is of a different kind that the Decalogue. The huge difference is that it is not a law of LETTER, the letter kills. In the case of God, after the letter of James 4:17, He stands condemned, because at surface God is not doing the good he ought to do. He leaves many children to dye from starvation. But thank God, the law of love, the new commandment of the New Covenant is not a law of letter, is a law of the Spirit. It's a different kind of law. This is why nobody can keep the New Commandment of Jesus "Love one another as I loved you" legalistically, by letter. It's an impossibility. The good which we ought to do is not the good dictated by an external law, but by the Holy Spirit who dwells in us. We are led by the Spirit, not by an external law. The Holy Spirit defines what we ought to do, and we are obeying God Himself. It's difficult for adventists to comprehend this difference, the fact that the Decalogue is a different kind of law than the Royal Law. Maybe this conversation can be useful. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 4131 Registered: 12-2003  |
Jackob, that is a very well-thought-out explanation. You are right. One of the problems with Adventist teaching, at least among some Adventists currently, is that theyófor example, Shelly Quinn of 3ABN notorietyóequates the Ten Comamndments with the Royal Law of James. They are not the same, as you have just explained. Yet someone listening to the texts and the explanations as they fly from the these preachers' lips during sermons would not be able to perceive the ways the texts are being misused. Colleen | ||
| Lori Registered user Username: Lori Post Number: 41 Registered: 11-1999 |
Perhaps it is the kindness, the mercy of God which ALLOWS these children to die. As children who have not reached the age of accountability....they are saved!!!! | ||
| Jackob Registered user Username: Jackob Post Number: 250 Registered: 7-2005 |
I liked very much what Patria said in her testimony which is available online in Proclamation http://formeradvent.temp.powweb.com/Proclamation2006_JanFeb.pdf about God allowing disasters to happen. Her brother suffered a terrible accident, and this made Patria doubt God and asking herself "Why?" This was a question that was instrumental in leading her out of adventism. She discovered grace, peace, and the security of God's love in salvation. This changes her entire perspective about disasters, and God allowing them.
I want to emphasize the fact that God is the ultimate Good, he not only do what is good. this is why He is the Law himself, from Himself the law of love springs, and there is no external law which can measure this Good. Because the law of love is in God, this law is infinite and cannot be defined in any way. Any law is limited and cannot define what is good or what is wrong for God to do. This is why new Covenant christians are following a greater law than Ten Commandments. They live after the law of Love, after the living leading of the Spirit of God, which is God Himself, the ultimate Good, as Patria said. Their life is shaped after the greatest law of all, the law which is high as God, because it God Himself who guide their lives. Lori, like Patria, I don't know why God allowes children to dye from starvation. But I know sufficiently to trust Him in this matter. Praise Him for such a great and sure salvation! | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 4135 Registered: 12-2003 |
Jackob, I have often pondered exactly what you wrote. When we live by the Spirit, we are following the "greatest law of all, the law which is high as God, because it [is] God Himself who guide[s] their lives." To make the 10 Commandments eternal is to make them a godóit is idolatry. Those Ten Words cannot be worthy of th eternal praise and obedience of God's people. They were creations of God. Instead, we worship GOD! Colleen | ||
| Jackob Registered user Username: Jackob Post Number: 251 Registered: 7-2005 |
Collen, thank you also for editing my post. I must take more time to verify what I'm writing (smile) Dear FAF-ers, we are indeed blessed to understand and know the Royal Law. Adventists cannot understand the difference between obeying the Law of Moses and the Royal Law. They only think that we obey a more relaxed law, something like the law of Nine Commandments. They believe that, as Raven said in the last Proclamation! we renounced the Sabbath because it's convenient, and that's all. That we just only want to go to heaven by an easy way. I know from personal experience how this thinking kept me from enjoying God's blessings. And that it takes a miracle to understand the difference between the Royal Law and the Law of Moses, between the law of the Spirit and the Law of the Letter. Every time I discover something which can be useful, I want to share with others, because we are in a spiritual battle with legalism at every step, perhaps will be useful for others who are questioning our present position. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 4140 Registered: 12-2003 |
Jackob, you are so right. It takes a miracle to understand the difference between the Royal Law and the Law of Moses. And this is a spiritual battle. I remember a couple of years ago whe our pastor was preaching, he used the passage in 2 Corinthians 3 where Paul talks about the veil covering hearts whenever Moses is read, but when a person turns to Christ, the veil is removed. Gary then said, "The veil is a spiritual power." This is not merely an intellectual comprehension. Even the ability to see that the Royal Law is not the 10 Commandments is a result of God's interventionóit's a miracle. Colleen | ||
| Violet Registered user Username: Violet Post Number: 397 Registered: 2-2001 |
For anyone to think that keeping the 10 commandments is harder than the Royal Law truly does not understand. The Royal Law requires more than just refraining from stealing or committing adultry, now I am responsible to not only not steal my neigbour's car but to love that neigbour which means if he just washed his car I am to be careful not to blow grass clippings on it when I mow. I have to be careful not to gossip about him. To treat him with respect even if he treats me horribly. But the greatest thing about all of this is that every time I treat someone kind that I do not want to I know that it is the Holy Spirit within me and there is no greater pleasure. | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 4156 Registered: 12-2003 |
Violet, what a great insight. It IS a pleasure to realize that the Holy Spirit is changing usóand sometimes we don't actually see it right away because it happens so gently. Colleen | ||
| Violet Registered user Username: Violet Post Number: 403 Registered: 2-2001 |
Colleen you are such a sweetie--thanks for the words of kindness! |
