| Author | Message | ||
| U2bsda Registered user Username: U2bsda Post Number: 269 Registered: 11-2004 |
As I was in the process of leaving Adventism something that helped me make the "break" was the purpose of the SDA church. I hadn't really realized it previously that their purpose was to call people out of Babylon - to convert Christians to Adventism. I found out that they were not to focus on something like the Great Commission because God had ordained their group to do the special job of calling people from Babylon or proclaiming the 3 angels messages. Why didn't I see that sooner? I don't know, but when that sunk in I knew I had to officially stop considering myself an Adventist even though I still believed in the Sabbath, etc. After I left Adventism I was visiting family and attended an SDA church. In the Sabbath School class the teacher told people what their purpose was. I was so surprised when he said the purpose was "to make it to heaven". Someone in the class added "and take others with us". The teacher responded by saying that yes it was important to take others with us. It is sad that those words "to make it to heaven" were spoken by someone who was an associate pastor. At the same time I think that is very telling that that idea is accepted. I remember having assurance of my salvation as an Adventist. I am learning that that assurance was rare among Adventists. Anyone else have assurance of salvation as an Adventist? I didn't understand salvation like I do now, but I knew I belonged to Him. I realize there are some Adventists who do not agree with that purpose of calling people out of Babylon, but the church as a whole does have the mission of preaching the 3 angels messages instead of the great commission. This is from the mission statement on the Adventist website (www.adventist.org) "The mission of the Seventh-day Adventist Church is to communicate to all peoples the everlasting gospel of Godís love in the context of the three angels' messages of Revelation 14:6-12, and as revealed in the life, death, resurrection, and high priestly ministry of Jesus Christ, leading them to accept Jesus as personal Saviour and Lord and to unite with His remnant church; and to nurture believers as disciples in preparation for His soon return." When you look at the typical outreach (prophecy seminar) the target group is not the person who has not heard of Jesus or who does not believe in Jesus, but Christians who are interested in learning more about prophecy. Are non-Christians really going to be interested in prophecy of the Bible? Maybe, but I think the odds are that Christians are the only ones really interested in Biblical prophecy. Just some thoughts  | ||
| Violet Registered user Username: Violet Post Number: 489 Registered: 2-2001 |
Those are some interesting thoughts. I never had any assurance as an SDA only thoughts of inadequicy. You are right one does not normally start with Revelation when you are new to the Bible. | ||
| Grace_alone Registered user Username: Grace_alone Post Number: 243 Registered: 6-2006  |
U2, That has always driven me nuts when I spend time with my SDA relatives. Instead of being baptized into Christ and of the Holy Spirit, you're baptized and agreeing to the 28 (?) fundamentals of Adventism. Instead of spreading the Gospel and bringing people to Christ, you're leading people into the "remnant" church. Salvation is almost never mentioned, but the IJ comes up an awful lot at our family gatherings. Jesus is a rare name that comes up during worship services, but Sister White is a constant. U2, you're so right about the "purpose". That's a very important issue when you're shopping for churches, or even planning to attend a Bible study. The "Three Angels' message" makes me think of the following texts... Galatians 1:6-9 (NIV) 6I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospeló 7which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8But even if we or an ANGEL FROM HEAVEN should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! 9As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned! The Gospel is this: The resurection of Christ - 1 Cor 15 1-4 1Now, brothers, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received and on which you have taken your stand. 2By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain. 3For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance[a]: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures... The Gospel of our Lord is so simple and yet so powerful!! Any additions or modifications are simply a perversion and should be thrown out. I truly believe it's a tool of the devil. Thanks for sharing. That helps me understand my husband and family yet a little more. Leigh Anne | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 42 Registered: 9-2006 |
U2, That is very interesting, I know an sda fellow who travels to South America, Cuba and so forth quite often and he keeps me upon thing by E-mail and he always says they had x number of Baptisms, never anything about decisions for Christ and I wondered about that, baptism is a subject I never studied concerning sda, I will have to find time to read up on it some more. As far as true evangelism goes in Matt 22: 1-14 Jesus say that the kingdom of heaven is like this. If one reads it with a studied emphasis on the word Servant, we can see that the Servants were bidden to go out in the highways and bid them come to the marriage both good and bad. Also notice what happened to the fellow who had no wedding garment. The marriage supper of the lamb is prepared, we are to bid everyone come, garments are furnished by the king, no other garment will do. Anyone not found wearing Jesus spotless robe of his righteousness will be dealt with harshly. God will deal harshly with anyone who will ignore the sacrifice of his Son. Wet or dry. Thanks for sharing. river | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 4839 Registered: 12-2003  |
U2, you're right. The Adventist church does not exist to lead people primarily to Christ but into Adventism and the Sabbath "truth". They do, indeed, mainly evangelize other Christians. Our pastor even mentioned to us one time that he has heard stories from various missionaries of Adventists in various missions "sheep stealing". During my last few years in Adventism (maybe even the last 8 or 10) I was pretty sure of my salvation. I finally realized that believing in Jesus was what the Bible requiredóand I knew I was believing in Him. At the same time, however, I still experienced a lot of guilt over the "edges" of the Sabbath, etc. On the one hand I believed the Bible meant what it said about believing in Jesus, but on the other hand I had a great deal of anxiety and guilt over the Adventist understandings and requirements. Cognitive Dissonance...! Colleen | ||
| Mrsbrian3 Registered user Username: Mrsbrian3 Post Number: 63 Registered: 8-2005 |
We received a "Texas Conference Camp Ministries Survey - Fall 2006" in the mail yesterday. They are in the process of selling off Nameless Valley Ranch and purchasing another parcel of land near Lake Whitney. Anyway, they want some input on how to set up this camp. Question #2 asks "What groups would you like to see the camp serve?" After the usual uses you get to "outreach to non-SDA groups" ... not non-Christian groups ... but non-SDA groups. How sad. Kim | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 4846 Registered: 12-2003 |
And also notice it's called "outreach to non-SDA groups." That is the general underlying motive I remember. In any dealings with the Christian community, it was always seen as "outreach" because they needed to full "truth". Colleen | ||
| Jwd Registered user Username: Jwd Post Number: 254 Registered: 4-2005  |
Colleen, I just got an e-mail letter from heaven. It spells "full truth" J E S U S C H R I S T! :c) There is NO true evangelism within SADventism, except, possibly some beginning topics to the most primitive peoples of the bush. I cannot comment on what their approach is, but I have no doubt but that they hurry through it so they can get to the "real" truth; and get to baptizing, so the NUMBERS can be reported on the monthly report. The actual practice is proselytizing through a planned program/presentation of dissuasion. Dissuasion by proof text methodology from Baptist, Methodist, Catholic (a big impressive baptism there!) or other denominational affiliations to SADventism. My personal experience and observation over many years has convinced me that the majority of people brought into the SADventist Church were not regenerated by the power of God's grace manifested through the indwelling Spirit of Christ, but were merely mentally convinced by a cleverly presented proof-texting plan for dissuading them to switch over from their denomination to Adventism. Baptisms rank highest on the pastor's monthly report. So it is easy to be motivated to try and convince as many as possible to be re-baptized, rather than come in by profession of faith. Baptisms appear on the monthly report like "home runs," whereas base hits don't even deserve honorable mention. So the un-converted pour into the pews with heads convinced, and hearts untouched by HIM, who "IS" Truth, "the whole Truth and nothing but the Truth! Jess | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 4850 Registered: 12-2003 |
Jess, you are so right. Your observations match my own. And I loved your email from heaven! Colleen | ||
| Pheeki Registered user Username: Pheeki Post Number: 827 Registered: 1-2003 |
My husband got those letters too, MsBrian...I could care less! My family went down and spent hours clearing Nameless Valley Ranch in the late 70's...but I guess the land became too valuable (Austin area) and they sold it off for millions. Maybe they learned their lesson from what happened about 8 years ago in my town (the town that holds the GC building). They had land across the highway and the city I live in took imminent domain on it and paid them hardly anthing and put in a beautiful golf course. Maybe they were afraid if they didn't sell it would happen again down there? | ||
| 91steps Registered user Username: 91steps Post Number: 124 Registered: 8-2005  |
My wife and I, (who is still an SDA), both agree that the SDA church needs to lead people to Christ FIRST, then worry about whether they join their cult or not. But alls the GC wants is number, numbers numbers. Baptize, baptize and baptize, then keep them rolling in and to heck if they lose people in droves. Out of the 2+ dozen people who I was baptized with in 1996 I think my wife is the ONLY one who still attends ANY church. That is very sad, they have allowed around 23 people to leave and not even worry about why they left. | ||
| 91steps Registered user Username: 91steps Post Number: 125 Registered: 8-2005 |
My wife and I, (who is still an SDA), both agree that the SDA church needs to lead people to Christ FIRST, then worry about whether they join their cult or not. But alls the GC wants is numbers, numbers numbers. Baptize, baptize and baptize, then keep them rolling in and to heck if they lose people in droves. Out of the 2+ dozen people who I was baptized with in 1996 I think my wife is the ONLY one who still attends ANY church. That is very sad, they have allowed around 23 people to leave and not even worry about why they left. | ||
| Mrsbrian3 Registered user Username: Mrsbrian3 Post Number: 64 Registered: 8-2005 |
Pheeki, At first we weren't going to fill out the survey, but then we changed our minds. First off I changed the "38,000 constituents in the Texas conference" to 37,998 and wrote in that their numbers were wrong because we had asked that our membership be removed several months ago. Then I only addressed the question of outreach to non-SDA groups. Other than that we left it blank. We'll see if we get a response. Kim |
