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River
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Username: River

Post Number: 59
Registered: 9-2006
Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 7:34 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Does the Holy Spirit speak to our hearts individually today? The cessation-ist would have us believe that since the cannon is completed there is no longer a necessity and therefore does not speak to us directly today.
I will share with you this morning this article I have completed for a Christian magazine, as I wrote about the King and the Farmer the story came to me in words, pictures and ideas. No hand guiding going on here, no swoons, no drooling, just prayerful ministry and yet I felt the Holy Spirit guided me in some way. Mental guidance if you will.
Please feel free to disagree, criticize, or any thoughts or experiences you have had in the past or present.
What do you think?

The King and the Farmer

Once long ago in merry old England there was a farmers house at which the King of England passed by on the road everyday as he went about his Kingly business; now the farmer had never seen the King but only the carriage at a distance as he rose early and worked long hours in his fields providing for himself his food and comfort during the long winter months to come.
One day the farmer said to himself ìI shall see the King this day!î and so left his fields and waited by the side of the road until the King in his beautiful carriage with its escorts of horseman should pass by.
He waited and waited.
After a long time a lone horseman came riding up the road and the farmer said to him ìSir, hast thou seen the Kings carriage proceeding this way today?î and the man answered ìMy good Sir, thou hast missed him entirely, the King hast taken yon new road!î
Are we taking so much time these busy days in providing for our comfort and the provision of this life that we fail to take the time each day to seek Jesus, the King of glory?
As we busy ourselves in preparation for the upcoming holidays things tend to get a mite feverish so let us take the time to wait patiently on the Lord each day lest we hear the words ìSir, you have missed him entirely, he hast taken yon new road.
I would like to leave you with these words from (Isa 55:6 KJV) Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:
And from (Psa 24:7 KJV) Lift up your heads, O ye gates; and be ye lift up, ye everlasting doors; and the King of glory shall come in.
U2bsda
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Username: U2bsda

Post Number: 316
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 8:08 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thank you River for sharing the story you wrote! Do you write many articles?

I do agree with you! I must admit I hadn't realized that cessationalists believe that the Holy Spirit does not speak to us directly today. I do at times find that communion with God is a two-way conversation.
River
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Username: River

Post Number: 61
Registered: 9-2006
Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 8:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

No, I don't write many, although sometimes when I am
meditating on the things of God about a subject I write to an invisible audience,recently while driving to a nearby town to a certain place, I preached myself a complete 45 minute sermon while driving down the freeway and I finished just as I pulled into the Parking lot. Now am I crazy or what?
Sometimes I set here at the keyboard and just weep as I feel the Lords spirit so gentle on my soul. one of those times is this morning.
Flyinglady
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Username: Flyinglady

Post Number: 2992
Registered: 3-2004


Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 11:41 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

River,
I really like your story of the king and the farmer. It reminded me that it is in my best interest if I spend more time with God.
Diana
Dennis
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Username: Dennis

Post Number: 864
Registered: 4-2000


Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 1:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes, indeed, God still speaks to us today. The Bible is God's voice speaking to us. The Holy Spirit rephrases our heartfelt supplications to our awesome, prayer-answering God. While Jesus never told us about true prophets living in the last days, He did warn us about FALSE prophets in the last days.

Dennis Fischer
Aliza
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Username: Aliza

Post Number: 53
Registered: 8-2006
Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 2:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Do I understand correctly that you feel we can't be led as was Philip in Acts 8 where he headed out of town down a road or as was Paul in Acts 16 where he was specifically redirected from Bithynia to Macedonia?

Aliza
River
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Username: River

Post Number: 62
Registered: 9-2006
Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 3:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Aliza,
No, you do not understand me, but if I gave my own opinion of the matter, then I would be answering my own question, I shared the story for a purpose other than to share the story. In it you can see my sentiments on the subject reflected. My question is, do you believe the Holy Spirit speaks to your heart in ways other than the Bible yet you know that it is him guiding you.
According to the cessation-ist , God no longer speaks apart from the Bible, therefore, if that is the case, is would be impossible for a person to receive guidance apart from the Bible. So therefore my portrayal of The King and the Farmer could not be Holy Spirit inspired according to the cessation-ist.
Now I have let the cat out of the bag as to what I think, but I am really not interested in my own opinion, I really want to know how you out there see it.
I will not be offended if you disagree, the story has already been submitted and that without regret.
Cathy2
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Username: Cathy2

Post Number: 212
Registered: 2-2006
Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 3:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I believe the Holy Spirit speaks to our hearts/spirits and guides us, especially, while we are within the depths of prayer, requesting him to do so, and/or meditating on scripture. Also, if we or our loved ones are in trouble or danger, spiritual or otherwise...giving a heads-up to act and pray, so to speak.

Many times, the name of a friend has come to my mind and I prayed for them. Later, I would learn that they needed prayer just at that time. In reverse, my friend has thought of and prayed for me, and I needed it. We live 1000 miles apart.

Cathy
Flyinglady
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Username: Flyinglady

Post Number: 2994
Registered: 3-2004


Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 4:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes, I do believe God speaks to us or impresses us for individual things we ask or he wants us to do. God told me what church to attend, when I was searching in Jan-May 2004. He also told me, before I got a job, that the job was mine after I made the appointment for the interview a month ahead. I have also been impressed to pray for people.
He is so awesome.
Diana
Aliza
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Username: Aliza

Post Number: 55
Registered: 8-2006
Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 5:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

River, sorry if you misunderstood me. I was broadening your question a bit and directing it more to Dennis. If I understood correctly, Dennis, you seem to be saying God only speaks through the Scriptures? For me personally, I agree with you River as well as Cathy and Diana.

Aliza
Agapetos
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Username: Agapetos

Post Number: 480
Registered: 10-2002


Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 7:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

One interesting comparison I realized a little while ago:

We tend to think that the Spirit speaks *only* through the Bible and in no other way, but Scripture does not tell us that the Spirit is limited to the Bible. Rather, Scripture tells us that we are to *test* the spirits. In other words, the Spirit may speak elsewhere, but what the Spirit speaks will always be in harmony with Scripture.

The comparison I realized is that most all of us can agree that *demons* speak. We know the enemy speaks, and that if one gets twisted enough, one can hear from demons. So we believe that the enemy can communicate with us.

But in embarassing contrast, many of us in Christianity do not believe that the Holy Spirit of God is able to do the same thing! We often think that the Spirit speaks to us only when we read Scripture, or only through the words of Scripture. We unintentionally give more credit to the ability of the enemy to speak than we do to the ability of God to speak to us.
Helovesme2
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Username: Helovesme2

Post Number: 690
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Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 7:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Excellent point Ramone! What a blessing that God is not silent today!

Mary
Dennis
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Username: Dennis

Post Number: 865
Registered: 4-2000


Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 8:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Aliza,

The Bible is NOT the only way that the Holy Spirit speaks to us. As Christ-followers, we often overlook the intended impact of God's Word upon us. If we long to hear God's voice, it is as near as our Bible.

Dennis Fischer
Agapetos
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Username: Agapetos

Post Number: 484
Registered: 10-2002


Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 8:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Amen, Dennis, amen. :-)
River
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Username: River

Post Number: 63
Registered: 9-2006
Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 9:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Aliza,
I see, yes I caught that too, just got home from church, had a wonderful service, had communion; I do think communion is an important part of our lives.
Back to the leading of the Holy Spirit, at least I can know that Iím probably not yet insane.
I myself do check my own thoughts out by the word of God, the Bible. However I have found when he speaks to me he is never wrong, sometimes I am because of doubt as to whether it is God or not. I have at times let it go to my own chagrin. However he patently teaches us even when we fail.
I am convinced that God does desire that we commune with him and he us.
I think the problem with most of us is that we do not (2 Cor 10:5 KJV) Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;
At least I think thatís most of my own problems.
River
River
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Username: River

Post Number: 64
Registered: 9-2006
Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 9:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Amen Dennis,if we have a Bible at hand we can hear God any time day or night, all we got to do is flip
it open. However I wish to make clear that the Bible
is spiritually discerned in its self.so learning to
hear God as he talks directly to our hearts probably
is not much different. What say you?
Riverfonz
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Username: Riverfonz

Post Number: 2245
Registered: 3-2005
Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 10:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Holy Spirit speaks to us only through His Word. If the Holy Spirit speaks outside His word, it is a sure sign that that message is not from God. I am really troubled that so many think that the Bible is not adequate. That somehow God speaks through prophets and unknown tongues (gibberish).

The lessons of Adventism need to be learned. There is no one with the office of prophet or prophetess speaking in the church today.

Stan
Colleentinker
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Username: Colleentinker

Post Number: 4908
Registered: 12-2003


Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 10:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have never heard it implied that cessationists believe the Holy Spirit does not communicate directly with Christ-followers. My understanding was that cessationists believe the sign gifts ceased with the apostolic age.

At any rate, I agree: the Holy Spirit personally communicates with us in many ways. And I agree wtih Dennis that many of us forget that Scripture is one of the most powerful ways for the Holy Spirit to communicate with us. And I don't mean just "reading" Scripture. Of course, God can teach us in any circumstanceóbut I've experienced God teaching me in some profound ways as I memorize or contemplate verses in depth.

One of the reasons I see Scripture, more and more, as being a profound tool for the Holy Spirit to teach us is that I've learned so much that informs how I live and think and choose and respond in daily situationsóand this understanding has come out of the time I spend memorizing. I ask God to teach me the truth when I spend time this way, and He is faithful. Actually, I'm finding that contemplating or meditating on Scripture really does inform the practical decisions of life because we are immersing ourselves in the mind and words of God.

Colleen
Colleentinker
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Username: Colleentinker

Post Number: 4910
Registered: 12-2003


Posted on Sunday, November 05, 2006 - 11:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Stan, I don't believe most people think the Holy Spirit speaks to us only in tongues or prophets. He often gives me words to say as I'm speakingówords I would never think of on my own. He sometimes impresses me of things for which I need to pray, or he gives me discernment or understanding of situations.

Having the Holy Spirit in us means that we have the mind of Christ (1 Cor 2:16), and we will have His wisdom and understanding. But this wisdom is enhanced greatly by time spent in studying the Bible.

Colleen
River
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Username: River

Post Number: 65
Registered: 9-2006
Posted on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 6:22 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Stan wrote,
ìThe Holy Spirit speaks to us only through His Word. If the Holy Spirit speaks outside His word, it is a sure sign that that message is not from God. I am really troubled that so many think that the Bible is not adequate. That somehow God speaks through prophets and unknown tongues (gibberish).

The lessons of Adventism need to be learned. There is no one with the office of prophet or prophetess speaking in the church today.î
Stan, your answer to this question is exactly why I ask it of this group, I actually thought I might get tarred and feathered for asking the question.
I was wondering to what extent Adventism would have effected you.
I would peradventure to say that there is not one among us who think our Bible is inadequate for doctrine, for correction and reproof.
Yes, the word of God lives if it lives in us, I see not many who came out of Adventism still fear it. To fear Adventism would mean it still controls you to a certain extent. Ironically fear is one of the controlling factors in Adventism.
Fear of the church, fear of EGW, fear of anyone outside the church, fear of being lost, fear of being outside Gods ìRemnantî.
2 Tim 1:7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.
I do not fear Adventism, I used to be fraught with fear of people, but the closer I draw to God the less I fear anything at all.
As I said though, my opinion is not important here, I already know my opinion, thank you for yours.
I really donít think you need be troubled about anyone on this forum for we dwell safely in Christ Jesus, even us ìGibberizersî Ha. Now thatís a new word.
By the way Stan you ask me earlier how I came up with my screen name and I will answer that, I came up with it long before Al Gore ìdiscoveredî the internet. Back then we ìgeeksî had a connection between our homes and the College computer, I had a teletype machine in my garage I called ìThe Tankî, my ìComputerî stretched out on a table 24 inches wide by about four feet long, my drives were 8 inch floppys. Eventually my buddy and I saw an ad in a magazine extolling an IBM desk top and we made up our mind that we would have one so we drove all night to an electronics convention put on by geeks of our ilk, I spent every dime I had to bring all the parts home in a box, I felt like I had entered heaven at that convention. I some times miss the pure excitement we shared back then. My buddy and I would drive hundreds of miles to get to other people who shared our interest and talk about electronics and computing all the way there and back. I probably have at least $6000.00 dollars worth of equipment sitting here in my room but I walk in and go ìHo, Humî. Now that is probably more information than you wanted but I thought I would share it anyway. Do we lose the excitement of sharing Christ the same way? I do not see that here on this forum, I see the excitement of sharing the Lord Jesus and his word and I place great value on that.
River

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