| Author | Message | ||
| Honestwitness Registered user Username: Honestwitness Post Number: 287 Registered: 7-2005  |
Today I met a young couple, one of whom is an editor of one of the conference publications in the midwest US and the other of whom teaches at an Adventist college. This couple travels a lot and has visited many SDA churches all over the US. They are evidently on the more progressive side of Adventism, as the wife was wearing earrings and wedding rings. They shared with me how they see a wide range of varying Adventist lifestyles and beliefs in their travels. In one town, all the Adventists are strict vegetarians, whereas in another town, the majority of Adventists are meat eaters. They even said that many of the Adventists around the Loma Linda area drink wine with their meals. I asked if they had met any Adventists who eat pork, and was surprised to hear that they have. The pork eaters don't cook the pork at home, but if a dish, such as green beans, is served with some bacon in it, they will still eat it. Now that is mind boggling to me, because I was under the impression that NO Adventist would eat pork or drink alcohol. The one who is an editor said that the senior editor is soliciting letters from readers that bring up controversial questions, because they have noticed that other conference magazines do this and it makes the publication more interesting if they can present several sides to an issue. I told this person that, although we receive the conference magazine in the mail, I always throw it away without reading it. But now that I know of their willingness to publish various views, I'll be looking forward to reading and maybe contributing letters myself. Just thought you might be interested in this tidbit of information. Honestwitness | ||
| Luzisbornagain Registered user Username: Luzisbornagain Post Number: 79 Registered: 7-2007 |
interesting | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 514 Registered: 11-2005 |
I am not at all surprised. That is completely consistent with my observations. I guess I am surprised that anyone is surprised. This is precisely why many Adventists can't see what the "big deal" is. They don't believe what Ellen White wrote anyway, and wonder why I am so hung up on her. That is why I am feeling more and more like we need to spend more time promoting what Christ's Sabbath Rest is really all about. Most Adventists couldn't care less what Ellen White said. But even then we have a problem because they are theologically numb. They don't study their Bibles any more than Mormons do. And like Mormons with their Book of Mormon, Adventists are encouraged to study Ellen White first. For more and more Adventists it is a culture. As long as they can enjoy the culture and the sense of belonging they really don't care what the conservative leadership promotes as its doctrines. It is a symbiotic relationship. The denomination provides a sense of belonging. The Mormons do precisely the same thing. The members provide the funding and the membership. Meanwhile there are a few zealots running around promoting historic Adventism to help those in charge feel like there still is a connection with Adventism's roots. The doctrines have become something to give Seventh-day Adventism its unique sense of identity. If Adventism joins mainstream Christianity it looses those unique features, and in its myopic view, its purpose for being. It's like shopping at your favorite grocery store. You already know where everything is. Why switch? As long as they don't tell you what to buy, you select what you want and ignore the rest. Gilbert Jorgensen | ||
| Colleentinker Registered user Username: Colleentinker Post Number: 6469 Registered: 12-2003  |
Yes, Gilbert, your observations are exactly what I see in California. "Southern California Adventists" have drunk wine for years or decades...at least many of them. I also know that for years—decades, even,—they have been eating meat including pretty raw beef at times. Sometimes they eat and drink these things when they go "out" and don't serve them at home, but these things are part of the quiet background "noise" of So Cal Adventism--and probably other places, too, especially on the West Coast. You're right about Adventists need to know the truth about Sabbath rest, Gilbert. I also know, however, that even the liberal Adventists who don't "believe" in Ellen still are deeply emotionally and spiritually bound to her. They don't know how bound they are; they think they've abandoned her. In reality, their whole culture is founded on her, that eccentric "great aunt" figure they hide in the back bedroom of their spiritual "house". They might claim not to "believe in" her, but they would never call her a "false prophet". The spiritual tie to Ellen is profound, even when they don't know that their Sabbath, public diet/health "message", state of the dead,etc. are all from Ellen. It's convoluted and powerful. Colleen | ||
| Agapetos Registered user Username: Agapetos Post Number: 947 Registered: 10-2002  |
It's the un-discardable family altar. (>_<) | ||
| Treasurehntr Registered user Username: Treasurehntr Post Number: 30 Registered: 7-2007 |
Is this an example of the "Pluralism" mentioned in an earlier thread? | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 515 Registered: 11-2005 |
Colleen, I see your point. You are so right. The whole culture has its roots in her teachings. Without her they have no identity. They claim on the one hand to follow the Bible, but trying to do that without her is outside the scope of their comprehension. I guess I am weary of the various Adventists that I come in contact with wondering why I am so "hung up on Ellen White." They view themselves as having been liberated, and basically don't care what she wrote. It's like trying to explain alcoholism to a drunk person... Gilbert Jorgensen | ||
| Dennis Registered user Username: Dennis Post Number: 1201 Registered: 4-2000  |
Good analyses, Gilbert! | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 1220 Registered: 9-2006  |
I have said it before and it may not be the last time I will say it. Adventism is confusion at it worst, no matter what state you live in, no matter whether you eat meat or don't eat meat, they are confused about eating, Sabbath, E.G.,IJ, Bible organization,Adventism its self. It is a multifaceted organized confusion. I challenge anyone to pick a state, any state,any church and go right back in there and preach the Gospel of faith alone in Christ alone and see how far you get, that will let you know soon enough about what is going on in Adventism. If you do that be sure to try and live long enough to give us a report on the state of Adventism will you? By the way, wear armour. River | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 516 Registered: 11-2005 |
I agree. After badmouthing anyone who worships their Savior on His resurrection day, how does Adventism rationalize this? http://www.pacificunionrecorder.com/107/8/32814.html Maybe, just maybe, it is possible to worship our Savior on days of the week other than Saturday. | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 4091 Registered: 3-2004  |
It is because it fills their needs and their need to deceive the people who are studying with them. I fill extra sad as these are Hispanic people and I am of Mexican descent. I do not like them being duped. Diana | ||
| Laurie Registered user Username: Laurie Post Number: 58 Registered: 6-2007 |
I was raised in a home where EGW was never even mentioned. I learned plenty about her in 10 years of SDA schools. I had no idea that every SDA doctrine was tied back to her. It was a complete shock to me when I found out, particularly about the sabbath. When I told my parents I was leaving the church and the many arguments began, my mom admitted right away the she did not believe in EGW in any way, never had, and said she was mentally ill. I showed my mom countless quotes and showed her how all the doctrines came from EGW, she would not listen. I tried to make her see how you can not pick and choose parts of adventism but that is exactly what my parents do. They go out to eat every sabbath after church. When I was a child that was FORBIDDEN! I asked her how she could pay someone to bring her food on the sabbath but she would not work in the restaurant herself... no answer was given. They go to the mall to "walk". Funny, they also eat at the food court and shop on Friday nights and on Saturday afternoons. Again, when I was a kid that was unthinkable! Things have surely changed. The hypocrisy I saw in the church had become unbearable for me, even before I truly began to question the doctrines. Laurie | ||
| Susans Registered user Username: Susans Post Number: 400 Registered: 8-2006 |
Adventism can justify their "soul winning" on Sundays because it's what their prophet told them to do. I don't have my red books anymore, thankfully, but I'm sure Jeremy can provide the quotes where she tells to evangelize on Sundays. It's like Diana says, it's deceptive. | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 4093 Registered: 3-2004 |
I just wrote them, at the Pacific Union Recorder, a note on their website saying I was disappointed in their deception. I also told them I was a former SDA and would never be one again. If they answer me I will let you know what is written to me. Diana | ||
| Laurie Registered user Username: Laurie Post Number: 59 Registered: 6-2007 |
I did not click on the link above the first time I read through this post. I have been shocked by many things in adventism... but this takes the cake. They are holding church on sunday! I don't even know what to say. Lies, after lies, after lies. Sickening, angering, disturbing, deceitful, manipulative, ... it is all of these things and more. Laurie | ||
| Laurie Registered user Username: Laurie Post Number: 60 Registered: 6-2007 |
Diana - I also sent that website a note. I said: I am a former adventist and this is the most deceitful practice I have ever heard of. You are inviting people to attend a Sunday church service. You can call it an evangalistic meeting or whatever you want. You know perfectly well that these people you are inviting have never heard of attending church on Saturday and they are completely unaware of your tue intentions which are to convert them to a Saturday sabbath keeping church. It is shameful what you are doing. The fact that you have to gain members through lies and deceipt speaks for itself. We'll see if they respond to me. Laurie | ||
| River Registered user Username: River Post Number: 1227 Registered: 9-2006 |
Dianna, Yes, be sure and let us know if they write back, that would be interesting. Gettin hot yet in Henderson? River | ||
| Flyinglady Registered user Username: Flyinglady Post Number: 4096 Registered: 3-2004 |
It has been HOT, HOT, HOT here in Henderson and is now cooling off-in the low 100s or high 90s. Tolerable. Diana | ||
| Laurie Registered user Username: Laurie Post Number: 61 Registered: 6-2007 |
Wow! I had to take 2 Excedrin just now after reading that article about Sunday church. Laurie | ||
| Jorgfe Registered user Username: Jorgfe Post Number: 517 Registered: 11-2005 |
Laurie, I know a dear Seventh-day Adventist friend who is an ultra-conservative historical Seventh-day Adventist. They believe the Time of Trouble is always just around the corner, and seem to live in constant fear. They have no problem buying gas on their credit card on the Sabbath if they are traveling because as they told me, "I don't pay for it on the Sabbath. I pay for it during the week." Gilbert Jorgensen |
