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Goose
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Username: Goose

Post Number: 111
Registered: 11-2011


Posted on Friday, September 07, 2012 - 8:57 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hello, friends. Sorry it's been awhile since I've visited the forum.

I wanted to share this short YouTube clip from an episode of television's "E.R." It is quite something, showing how an "all-inclusive" approach to "spiritual care" has infiltrated the ministry of chaplains. This is actually what has been happening, and for quite some time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RA-JzVxGTg

We will agree, the patient does get quite angry, and the "all inclusive" chaplain is so beat up, she goes away quite dejected. But I am wondering. Does the show's writers/ producers want to create sympathy in the heart of the viewer for the chaplain, but not the dying patient?? If so, WHY?

I look forward to everyone's response and feedback. Your response and feedback is welcome as I ponder how I ought to look at the possibility of making health care chaplaincy a career. Kinda scary. It's scary because it seems like God, and any chaplain who truly believes in God, are being taken away.
Mjcmcook
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Username: Mjcmcook

Post Number: 607
Registered: 2-2011


Posted on Friday, September 07, 2012 - 11:25 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Goose~

It is good to hear from you!

I have so many different responses to this "tripe" that is being served up on this television show! too numerous to write~

This summer I was in the hospital for a week~ I had several "roommates" during my stay~ one of them wanted to have a Chaplain visit~ since there is only a curtain between the beds, you can hear all that is going on~

The Chaplain was NOT anything like what was portrayed by "Hollywood"! (Surprise)! He was straightforward with what he said to the patient; he was not "scared" to communicate the "Truth" about the "here&now" and eternal consequences~

My encouragement to you, Goose, is if you believe you have a GOD-given call on your life to train yourself for the service of Chaplaincy, by ALL means, answer the "Call"~

People that are in crisis desperately need a Truthful, compassionate, servant of GOD, to assist them in their search for "Truth"~ that can only come from "Scripture"~ The Heart of GOD~

In closing, may I say that GOD will not "Call" you to a service for HIM, that HE will not equip you to do for HIS Glory!

GOD does not want His children to be afraid, of anything! No "scarey" stuff when we are "in Him"!

In Isaiah 41:10,13 this is what GOD says~

"Don't worry, because I am with you. don't be afraid, because I am your GOD. I will make you strong and will help you; I will support you with my right hand that saves you...I am the the LORD your GOD, who holds your right hand, and I tell you, Don't be afraid. I will help you."

Earthly fears are no fears at all. Answer the big question of eternity, and the little questions of life fall into perspective!

If, GOD is "Calling" you, Goose, You can DO This! by His Grace!

Sincerely~
~*~mj~*~
Philharris
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Username: Philharris

Post Number: 2747
Registered: 5-2007


Posted on Friday, September 07, 2012 - 3:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well, I watched the video clip. It seems strange to me that the patient asked the question and the script writers didn't have the guts to turn to scripture for and answer.

A real chapain needs scriptue...Jesus died for sinners. Agree with the dying man. He was a 'chief of sinners', guilty and desearve death but even the Apostle Paul murdered Christians. Tell sinners what Paul tells the Phippian Jailer.

Phil
River
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Username: River

Post Number: 8006
Registered: 9-2006


Posted on Friday, September 07, 2012 - 8:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

All inclusive meaning?
Asurprise
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Username: Asurprise

Post Number: 2765
Registered: 7-2007
Posted on Friday, September 07, 2012 - 9:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

All inclusive, meaning an attitude of "if it works for you, great!" An attitude that one religion isn't better than another, that Buddhism is just as good as Christianity, etc. Which is a horrible attitude, that will send people right on their way to hell.

It seems that today, people want to be "politically correct" which increasingly seems to mean that it isn't accepted to teach about Jesus. I remember awhile back that the military was considering a measure to prohibit chaplains from praying in the name of Jesus. I don't know what came of that proposed measure - whether they made it into law or not. Recently, I heard that they were prohibiting police chaplains from praying in the name of Jesus and that a lot of them were resigning because of it.

Goose, that video made my eyes tear up, it was so sad. :-(

The answer is so simple. Jesus died to pay the penalty for ALL sin and all a person needs to do is accept what Jesus did in their behalf.
River
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Username: River

Post Number: 8007
Registered: 9-2006


Posted on Saturday, September 08, 2012 - 7:20 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes, I remember hearing something like that. I can tell you from personal experience that not all military chaplains believe in the Bible so just because they wear a cross on their lapel is no sign they are any real help to our troops.

As for the script writers there are two kinds of fiction, literary and popular fiction.

LITERARY fiction is the fiction of ideas. The primary purpose is to evoke thought.

With POPULAR fiction the primary purpose is to evoke emotion. A person needs to choose whichever one he wants to use before he sits down to write a story if heís expecting a monetary reward.

What you are looking at in the flick is POPULAR fiction. The writers aim is to generate dollars, bottom line.

As for all inclusive, to put it in military terms, as a Christian I have sworn allegiance to my supreme commander and no matter which way the world would like me to spin it, I cannot betray my supreme commander, that would be treason.

Thatís probably not much help, but it IS feedback. :-)
River
Asurprise
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Username: Asurprise

Post Number: 2767
Registered: 7-2007
Posted on Saturday, September 08, 2012 - 10:07 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

One thing for sure is that if a person doesn't know where they are going after they die, when they watch something like this, their empathy with the dying man in the show will turn to wondering about themselves - where are they going when this life is over?

The dying man asked real, valid questions that every person should ask if they don't already know the answers. Perhaps that was the writer's intent. He/she couldn't really tell the gospel in the popular show, so he put the question out there. Where are you going when you die? God has promised in His word that if a person seeks Him with all their heart, they'll find him. Perhaps the show got people to seek God.

The place where I work greatly frowns on employees sharing the gospel. Once, on one of my regular reviews, I was rated lower because somebody had complained about my sharing the gospel with them.
Goose
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Username: Goose

Post Number: 112
Registered: 11-2011


Posted on Saturday, September 08, 2012 - 1:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks, everyone, for watching the clip and sharing your thoughts and insights. Mj, thank you for your words of encouragement.

In this link, below, from HealthCare Chaplaincy, are a list of prayers and meditations this organization recommends chaplains utilize for people of different faith....

http://www.healthcarechaplaincy.org/sources-comfort-meaning/prayers-meditations.html

What about you? If I were chaplain, I don't think I would be a one size fits all chaplain. Like River wrote, I would betray my Supreme Commander.

Now, if someone was listed on the patients chart as anything else but Christian, I suppose I would first and foremost, just check to find out how they are doing/ feeling, and explore--to find out if their belief system is working for them.
Marysroses
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Username: Marysroses

Post Number: 294
Registered: 4-2007
Posted on Tuesday, September 11, 2012 - 3:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A chaplain doesn't have be "one size fits all" to be sensitive to those who don't share his personal beliefs. I think your last post was perfect Goose.
See how they are doing. I'd ask if there was anyone they'd like for me to contact for them. Being caring and sensitive would likely touch them far more than being confrontational and intrusive about their beliefs, especially in a time of illness or personal crisis. If someone does want to open the door to discussion, then they WANT It and will be open to it. Then its all good.

I have spent many weeks and even months in hospitals with my daughter. I once caught a "volunteer chaplain" making her cry because she didn't understand what he wanted from her. She was 6! sheesh! (Rant Rant)

As far as my family, as a result, I made sure it was clear that only Catholic chaplains are allowed to contact her in the hospital. And its a shame because I enjoy fellowship with others, but I couldn't stay in the room 24/7.
Colleentinker
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Username: Colleentinker

Post Number: 13971
Registered: 12-2003


Posted on Tuesday, September 11, 2012 - 5:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Goose, I agree. Be true to your belief in Jesus. You have to answer to Him, and He equips you for what He brings to you.

It's unbelievable that a chaplain would harangue a child until she cried, Marysroses...good grief! What was he/she thinking?! I'm so sorry...what happened to "Jesus love the little children..."

He is faithful!
Colleen
Mjcmcook
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Username: Mjcmcook

Post Number: 623
Registered: 2-2011


Posted on Tuesday, September 11, 2012 - 8:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Marysroses~

What you wrote leads me to believe that you, were not present when this "volunteer" spoke with your little girl?

It surprises me that anyone in this sensitive capacity would be allowed to speak with a six year old child, without a parent in attendance~

This makes me so sad~ to picture your little girl crying in a hospital bed because of the blundering of an incompetent!
However well-meaning they might have been~

I surely hope this person had the sense to apologize?

~mj~
Marysroses
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Username: Marysroses

Post Number: 295
Registered: 4-2007
Posted on Tuesday, September 11, 2012 - 10:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

mj..

No I wasn't there, I had gone down to the cafeteria to get something to eat. and No, it shouldn't have happened. We were at shriner's for four long months. its such a friendly place in many ways, with lots of volunteers entertaining the kids. I ran this person off and never saw them again. I don't think they were in any way authorized as a chaplain. I told the nurses about the incident and they apologized profusely and I'm sure passed the information along.
Mjcmcook
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Username: Mjcmcook

Post Number: 625
Registered: 2-2011


Posted on Wednesday, September 12, 2012 - 1:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Marysroses~

"Children have no choice and no voice~"

IMO~ this is why GOD gave them Mothers!

Blessings to You
From one Mother to another!

~*~mj~*~
Goose
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Username: Goose

Post Number: 113
Registered: 11-2011


Posted on Saturday, September 22, 2012 - 10:20 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

ASurprise wrote: "

"It seems that today, people want to be 'politically correct' which increasingly seems to mean that it isn't accepted to teach about Jesus. I remember ..the military was considering ...to prohibit chaplains from praying in the name of Jesus. ... I heard that they were prohibiting police chaplains from praying in the name of Jesus"

Even at the Catholic hospital where I served a one year chaplain residency, patients & family-- having been so conditioned by this devilish "politically correct" trend--questioned the mentioning of Jesus name. To which a new father told his wife, "It is a Catholic hospital."

As I write, Jesus words come to mind, "When the son of man appears, will He find faith on the earth?" So what it is is a satanic war on faith--the faith of Jesus.

A concurrent trend has been the development of non-sectarian, large corporate health care "systems," and the disappearance of hospitals and hospices that used to be part a church's mission. And so, chaplains have "evolved" (or truth be told, rather de-volved) into this one size fits all "spiritual care giver."

Had anyone looked at this link, below? This is "HealthCare Chaplaincy's" list of prayers and meditations for chaplains to utilize for people of different faith....

http://www.healthcarechaplaincy.org/sources-comfort-meaning/prayers-meditations.html

What do we think about this?
Mjcmcook
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Username: Mjcmcook

Post Number: 642
Registered: 2-2011


Posted on Saturday, September 22, 2012 - 10:34 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

HELLO~Goose~

Yes, I read the information on the link you gave last time you shared it~ I just did not respond~

My belief, is that you should, "pray in the name of JESUS CHRIST" if this is what you believe. How could you do otherwise?

A true Believer in JESUS CHRIST cannot abandon his LORD~ to do so, IMO, is cowardly.

If the people involved do not want a prayer that includes the name of JESUS~ then someone else should pray for them.

~mj~
Goose
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Username: Goose

Post Number: 114
Registered: 11-2011


Posted on Saturday, September 22, 2012 - 10:35 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I also wanted to share a short related story.

A CPE (Clinical Pastoral Education) supervisor we had while I was at that Catholic hospital was chosen by the CPE manager after a colleague retired, leaving a vacancy. Why the manager chose him, I do not know,..for he knew this guy quite well.

I give the guy some credit for at least being forthcoming and honest. Early on he told the group that he had given up his Christian faith and no longer believed.

It was then little wonder that he caused me grief when he read on my verbatims how I would sometimes say "see you later" to a dying patient, rather than the all too final sounding "good bye."

He would write on my verbatim, "What? Is this that heaven thing again?"

So, all about us, it seems, in ever nook and cranny of the world, we have this spirit of unbelief.
Mjcmcook
Registered user
Username: Mjcmcook

Post Number: 643
Registered: 2-2011


Posted on Saturday, September 22, 2012 - 10:44 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

GOOSE~

Another way to say "spirit of unbelief", is the "spirit of darkness"~

REMEMBER~ as Followers of JESUS CHRIST we are the Children of LIGHT and Children of the Day~ It is our responsibility to keep this LIGHT shining! The HOLY SPIRIT that lives within us is stronger than the darkness without~ This is where our strength comes from! It is not from ourselves, because apart from GOD we can do nothing for HIS kingdom~ It is ALL about JESUS~!

~mj~

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