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Jorgfe
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Username: Jorgfe

Post Number: 1281
Registered: 11-2005
Posted on Friday, October 31, 2008 - 7:50 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Exposing Adventism - Are former Adventists qualified to evaluate Adventism?

Most Adventists naturally will do everything they can to discredit "former Adventists" who expose the cultic doctrines of Adventism. The following points are helpful to keep in mind.

  1. We "former Adventists" are not "coming out of the blue" with no comprehension of what Adventism is all about. In my case, as a sixth-generation SDA, I was deceived by the cultic doctrine of Adventism for 54 of the past 56 years. In sum, the very large bulk of our lives we were Adventists and members of this belief system.
  2. Like former Mormons, we are no longer Adventists. That gives us a two vantage points from which to evaluate the veracity of Adventism -- both from within and from without. We understand the dangers and deception promoted by Adventism.
  3. Like bank tellers, it is by studying the genuine Word of God that we have a heightened awareness of the deceptive similarity, and differences, of Adventism.
  4. With this "stereo vision" described in point 2 above, we former Adventists are acutely aware of the techniques and logic used to try to rationalize the cognitive dissonance within the Adventist belief system.
  5. With this "stereo vision" described in point 2 above, we former Adventists are well aware of the harvest of false spiritual "fruit" and emotional damage that it brings to its followers through the guilt-laden perfectionistic, out-of-balance works-oriented denial of the full atoning power of Christ's blood in the lives of each of His children.
  6. I have not met a single former Adventist who, of their own volition, spends the time we do here studying both the Bible and Ellen White to determine what they actually say, and how they disagree. We feel called by the Holy Spirit to speak out, each with our own applicable message, some with the boldness of the Apostle Paul, as God inspires us as former Adventists to do so. This is not our idea of pleasure or vindictiveness, but of a unique calling.
  7. It is not an attack on individuals, even when individuals are addressed, but on a belief system that promotes a blasphemeously false "gospel"
    • a false "gospel" that was not completed on the cross, but required an additional unbiblical "investigative judgment" (in absentia) conveniently commencing in 1844
    • a false "gospel" that "vindicates" God the Son -- who needs no vindication (http://www.exposingadventism.com/content/facts/christ_adventist-jesus.php)
    • a false "gospel" that places God the Son on probation! (SDA Bible Commentary, Volume 5, p. 1082; Signs of the Times May 10, 1869)
    • a false "gospel" that replaces Christ with one of His appointed feasts, the weekly Sabbath (Leviticus 23 , 2 Chronicles 8:12)
    • a false "gospel" that rips out the rightful seat of the Holy Spirit from the seal of God (and once again replaces it with the weekly Sabbath feast)
    • a false "gospel" that totally confuses the identity of the "mark of the beast" and the "seal of God", a false "gospel" that accuses God of intentionally lying to the Millerites to (as Ellen White put it in Early Writings, p. 246)
    • a false "gospel" that does damage to the body of Christ by claiming that "Satan has taken full possession of the churches as a body." Its cultic doctrines denigrate the member churches of the body of Christ in order to build up Seventh-day Adventism. (Early Writings, page 273-274, http://www.exposingadventism.com/content/facts/body-of-christ_this-office.php)
    • a false "gospel" that teaches that Christ's blood was laden with sin when He ascended to heaven, rather than that His blood cleanses from all unrighteousness!
    • a false "gospel" that teaches, through a contorted misapplication of Daniel 8:14, that the heavenly sanctuary was defiled prior to 1844 (but Adventism can't say when!), and needed to be cleansed.
    • a false "gospel" that denies the existence after death of a soul (Matt 10:28, Luke 12:4-5, Luke 23:42-43, Acts 7:59, 2 Cor 5:1-10, 2 Cor 12:1-4, 1 Peter 3:18-22) and then tries to accomplish a "resurrection" through a disingenuous partial annihilation. (http://www.exposingadventism.com/content/facts/death_partial-annihilation.php)
    • a false "gospel" -- that is so false -- it motivates the promotion of a blasphemeously false SDA Clear Word Bible, copyrighted by the official publishing house of the Seventh-day Adventist Church. (http://www.exposingadventism.com/content/organization/clear-word-bible/verses/index.php)
    • a false "gospel" that is so false that it denies (http://www.exposingadventism.com/content/facts/gospel_adventism-vs-christianity.php) that:
      • The gospel is about a finished thing.
      • The gospel is a final thing.
      • The gospel is an eschatological thing.
      • The gospel is an all-sufficient thing.
      • The gospel is a clear and certain thing.
      • The gospel is a decisive thing.
    • a false "gospel" that produces a plethora of unique Seventh-day Adventist teachings such as the investigative judgment, the two apartments or ministrations in the heavenly sanctuary, the remnant church, the special sealing and blotting out of sins, the latter rain, close of probation and the Spirit of Prophecy.
    • the Seventh-day Adventist false "gospel" fails the test.
  8. It has been demonstrated over and over again that most Adventists exhibit the same denial that we did when we were Adventists. They simply refuse to address the issues we have been confronted in our Biblical studies with in any meaningful way. Nowhere is this more evident than their total silence, or prevarication, on the hard questions. That is not called study. It is called denial and rationalization -- the very thing the Holy Spirit has led us former Adventists out of. The subject of 1843/1844 and the Investigative Judgment is just one of many such examples. The Biblical application of the "body of Christ" to the "remnant church" attitude of the Seventh-day Adventist Church is another. There are hundreds of similar examples.
  9. This is not a discussion about someone's ear, but it is about an entire false belief system -- a belief system that openly states "the Spirit of Prophecy is the only infallible interpreter of Bible principles." (G. A. Irwin, General Conference President)
  10. The Scriptures are very pointed about our duty and responsibility to expose error. In Galations 1:6-11 (NIV), God states through Paul:
"I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel — which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!

Am I now trying to win the approval of men, or of God? Or am I trying to please men? If I were still trying to please men, I would not be a servant of Christ. I want you to know, brothers, that the gospel I preached is not something that man made up. I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ."
Those are some extremely bold words. We need to tremble at the thought of watering down the significance.

Your brother in Christ,

Gilbert Jorgensen
Larry
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Username: Larry

Post Number: 568
Registered: 5-2007
Posted on Friday, October 31, 2008 - 9:51 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"Jesus entered the most holy of the heavenly (sanctuary), at the end of the 2300 days of Daniel 8, in 1844, to make a final atonement for all who could be benefited by His mediation." Ellen White, Early Writings, p. 253

Whats the matter ellen? Is the Bible account of the gospel not good enough for you, that you have to teach a different gospel?

The Holy Spirit leads us into all truth:

12He did not enter by means of the blood of goats and calves; but he entered the Most Holy Place once for all by his own blood, having obtained eternal redemption. Hebrews 9

10And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
12But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, He sat down at the right hand of God. 13Since that time he waits** for his enemies to be made his footstool, 14because by one sacrifice He has made perfect forever those who are being made holy. Hebrews 10

No allowance in Hebrews is made for a second and final atonement! Clearly anybody that teaches otherwise is the appendage of a cult.

Since when do all purveyors of false gospels not qualify for cult status?

Titus 1 says their minds and consciences are corrupted, they claim to know God, but by their actions they deny him, they are detestable, disobedient and unfit for doing anything good.

I was a cultist who was taught and believed a wrong gospel for 50 years, but no longer! Praise God for showing His mercy.


**Even in 1844 He was waiting!
Jorgfe
Registered user
Username: Jorgfe

Post Number: 1282
Registered: 11-2005
Posted on Friday, October 31, 2008 - 10:24 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Larry, I notice Ellen's quote states, "Jesus entered the most holy of the heavenly (sanctuary), at the end of the 2300 days of Daniel 8, in 1844, to make a final atonement for all who could be benefited by His mediation." Ellen White, Early Writings, p. 253

Just who are these "all who could benefit"? We know from Scripture that the sanctuary service only applied to "sins of ommission" -- not intentional sin. For example a "sin offering" was brought for touching a dead person -- something that morticians today do all the time. Leprosy and a whole host of other "sins of ommission" were covered by the sacrificial system culminating in the Day of Atonement.

Under the Old Covenant, "intentional sins" never were covered by the temple services. "An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth", cities of refuge for someone who accidentally murdered someone else until the judges could sort it out. Achan's sin, Moses's striking the rock, Sabbath breaking -- none of these were covered by bringing a "sin offering" to that sanctuary. The sacrificial system didn't cover that.

Adventists are totally clueless when asked how this relates to their jaw-dropping claims that Christ took all sin with him to the "heavenly sanctuary" via his "defiled blood".

So what was it again, that He made "final atonement" for in 1844?

[Extra credit -- Ellen White can't even get the right robe on Jesus in her vision in Early Writings, pp 56-57, where she talks about a bell and a pomegranite, a bell and a pomegranite. That was the common dress worn for the ordinary daily priestly services. Read Leviticus and Deuteronomy. The High Priest wore a white linen robe when he went into the Most Holy Place. Just what did Ellen White actually see anyway -- or was she making this up -- like her "vision" in "A Word to the Little Flock" where there were almonds and pomagranites in the Ark of the Covenant but no Ten Commandments?]

Gilbert Jorgensen
Dennis
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Username: Dennis

Post Number: 1518
Registered: 4-2000


Posted on Saturday, November 01, 2008 - 7:50 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gilbert,

As longtime former insiders, we have an immense amount of information and experience that our Adventist friends wish we didn't know, have, nor expose. Public access to reliable and factual information is most detrimental to the cults. This is why the cults are growing primarily in the third world countries where information technology is either non-existent or limited.

Dennis Fischer

(Message edited by Dennis on November 01, 2008)
Jorgfe
Registered user
Username: Jorgfe

Post Number: 1287
Registered: 11-2005
Posted on Saturday, November 01, 2008 - 8:56 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dennis, I always enjoy all your great insights! Keep up the good work.

Gilbert Jorgensen
Flyinglady
Registered user
Username: Flyinglady

Post Number: 5954
Registered: 3-2004


Posted on Saturday, November 01, 2008 - 11:21 am:   Edit PostDelete PostPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have to agree Dennis that we formers have information and experience that our Adventist friends wish we did not have, know, nor expose. I am not a debater, but God has His place for me in doing His will. On a personal basis I tell others what adventism teaches. I thank God He gives me the words to say.
He is so awesome that way and every other way.
Diana L

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